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I agree with you wholeheartedly, but I don’t understand why limit it only to Russians. At this same moment USA, Turkey and Saudi Arabia are involved directly i

I agree with you wholeheartedly, but I don’t understand why limit it only to Russians. At this same moment USA, Turkey and Saudi Arabia are involved directly in illegal aggression against multiple sovereign states, fully supported by many other NATO members. They were responsible for much more death yearly than Russia in this war, yet nobody seems to care. Is it because USA do it to spread democracy? Then what about Turkey? They used word for word exactly the same justification to invade Kurds in Syria. Where’s the outrage about other wars. Either condemn all wars, or stop pretending you care about people affected by wars.

jhgb 5y ago
You will not convince anyone sensible that the morals and discipline of US troops and officers are anywhere close to the morals and discipline (or the lack thereof) of their Russian counterparts with this whataboutism.
- tut-urut-utut 5y ago
  https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grdelica_train_bombing https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grdelica_train_bombing Nice example of moral and discipline of US troops. Just Google if you need more. Murderers are murderers, regardless if they wear Russian, US or Taliban uniform.
  - jhgb 4y ago
    If this is the worst example you can find for the US, then considering the recorded conversations of Russian officers ordering the troops to kill all civilians in various places and such, I guess Russia very easily "wins" this.
    - tut-urut-utut 4y ago
      No, some of the worst examples would include extermination of million of native Americans, the biggest genocide in human history. This I’d just a random example. But yeah, Russian army killing anyone suddenly makes US army winning humanitarian contest.
Aeolun 5y ago
> Either condemn all wars, or stop pretending you care about people affected by wars. What a weird thing to say. Humans are hypocrites. We can absolutely not care one whit about the Kurds (or only in the abstract anyway), and then get extremely upset when people that look like us, in a society that mostly functions like ours, get attacked by a country that really should know better And frankly, until they started this shit, I didn’t feel particularly bad about Russia any more. They shot themselves in the foot so hard…
- tut-urut-utut 5y ago
  What you just said makes it clear that humans are not only hypocrites, but also racists. Can we do better as a humanity? Should we just accept that we are all racist assholes and stop pretending we are better than that, or try to become better than that?
  - watwut 5y ago
    Your idea of being better as humanity is to not care at all.
    - tut-urut-utut 4y ago
      No, we should care about everyone. But even not caring at all is better than to care about subs and not care about other.
      - watwut 4y ago
        I think that what is going o here is that you don't care about anyone. Because one look at map and brief knowledge of history would make you guess some things. In all involved places. For you, all me mentionedd places are just abstractions. None of them are real, really real full of real people. You would prefer Ukrainian border to be locked so that they can't escape at all anywhere. And you don't seem to want to care countries next to Syria to treat refugees better, it is just about sticking it to countries next to Ukraine which you know nothing about. How come Arabs are more likely to fight ISIS and help Arabs over going over to Ukraine or help Arab refugees. Better no one helps anyone ever, not even when threatened by same aggressor again and not even if they are literally the next country over the border.
shafyy 5y ago
> Either condemn all wars, or stop pretending you care about people affected by wars. This is not a realistic stance. We are all humans, and it's obvious that some global tragedies affect us more than others (for whatever reason). Just because somebody is vocal about the Russo-Ukrainian war but less so about other wars doesn't mean they don't care. It just means that they are personally and emotionally more impacted by this. Furthermore, people do what they can. Should I either donate all my money to all causes or not donate at all? Should I either not do any action that has a negative effect on the environment or live in a forest alone without electricity?
- tut-urut-utut 5y ago
  Maybe I’m an idealist, but I think that, if we are not equally vocal about all wars, we are not against all wars. There are no good and bad wars. We should be most vocal about wars we can actually stop and prevent. We don’t have moral right to ask Russians to risk their lives and protest against their government to stop the war in Ukraine, if we don’t do the same regarding wars our government leads, supports and sponsors. We complaining about Russia and Russians and Iraqians complaining about USA will not stop any war. We need a strong international peace movement. It kinda worked in the case of Vietnam.

jhgb 5y ago

You will not convince anyone sensible that the morals and discipline of US troops and officers are anywhere close to the morals and discipline (or the lack thereof) of their Russian counterparts with this whataboutism.

tut-urut-utut 5y ago
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grdelica_train_bombing https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grdelica_train_bombing Nice example of moral and discipline of US troops. Just Google if you need more. Murderers are murderers, regardless if they wear Russian, US or Taliban uniform.
- jhgb 4y ago
  If this is the worst example you can find for the US, then considering the recorded conversations of Russian officers ordering the troops to kill all civilians in various places and such, I guess Russia very easily "wins" this.
  - tut-urut-utut 4y ago
    No, some of the worst examples would include extermination of million of native Americans, the biggest genocide in human history. This I’d just a random example. But yeah, Russian army killing anyone suddenly makes US army winning humanitarian contest.

Aeolun 5y ago

> Either condemn all wars, or stop pretending you care about people affected by wars. What a weird thing to say. Humans are hypocrites. We can absolutely not care one whit about the Kurds (or only in the abstract anyway), and then get extremely upset when people that look like us, in a society that mostly functions like ours, get attacked by a country that really should know better And frankly, until they started this shit, I didn’t feel particularly bad about Russia any more. They shot themselves in the foot so hard…

tut-urut-utut 5y ago
What you just said makes it clear that humans are not only hypocrites, but also racists. Can we do better as a humanity? Should we just accept that we are all racist assholes and stop pretending we are better than that, or try to become better than that?
- watwut 5y ago
  Your idea of being better as humanity is to not care at all.
  - tut-urut-utut 4y ago
    No, we should care about everyone. But even not caring at all is better than to care about subs and not care about other.
    - watwut 4y ago
      I think that what is going o here is that you don't care about anyone. Because one look at map and brief knowledge of history would make you guess some things. In all involved places. For you, all me mentionedd places are just abstractions. None of them are real, really real full of real people. You would prefer Ukrainian border to be locked so that they can't escape at all anywhere. And you don't seem to want to care countries next to Syria to treat refugees better, it is just about sticking it to countries next to Ukraine which you know nothing about. How come Arabs are more likely to fight ISIS and help Arabs over going over to Ukraine or help Arab refugees. Better no one helps anyone ever, not even when threatened by same aggressor again and not even if they are literally the next country over the border.

shafyy 5y ago

> Either condemn all wars, or stop pretending you care about people affected by wars. This is not a realistic stance. We are all humans, and it's obvious that some global tragedies affect us more than others (for whatever reason). Just because somebody is vocal about the Russo-Ukrainian war but less so about other wars doesn't mean they don't care. It just means that they are personally and emotionally more impacted by this. Furthermore, people do what they can. Should I either donate all my money to all causes or not donate at all? Should I either not do any action that has a negative effect on the environment or live in a forest alone without electricity?

tut-urut-utut 5y ago
Maybe I’m an idealist, but I think that, if we are not equally vocal about all wars, we are not against all wars. There are no good and bad wars. We should be most vocal about wars we can actually stop and prevent. We don’t have moral right to ask Russians to risk their lives and protest against their government to stop the war in Ukraine, if we don’t do the same regarding wars our government leads, supports and sponsors. We complaining about Russia and Russians and Iraqians complaining about USA will not stop any war. We need a strong international peace movement. It kinda worked in the case of Vietnam.