13 ms·

My diet of almost only red meat

38 points by weisser 4y ago

jdpigeon 4y ago
Sounds like this guy is in the category of people for whom keto diets can work wonders. It's definitely not worth it for me, I've tried, and I suspect it's the same for most people.
- ryanSrich 4y ago
  Have you tried low carb? I tried keto for a while, and noticed a few benefits, but it was hell not having the occasional bowl of rice or slice of bread. So I switched to a mostly low carb diet, but allow myself to have things like rice and bread 1-3 times per week. I’ve found almost no difference for me between this and keto in terms of physical benefits.
walrus01 4y ago
[flagged]
- chrisco255 4y ago
  Clearly getting addicted to pills has nothing to do with diet selection.
  - pstuart 4y ago
    Yes, it has no direct connection. I think it was a chance to throw shade at Peterson, which is understandable. Edit: I understand Peterson's appeal but I am not a fan because I think he's full of bs and himself. In the case of the drug addiction issue he blamed everybody but himself. https://readpassage.com/jordan-petersons-handling-of-addiction-is-fair-game-for-critique/ https://readpassage.com/jordan-petersons-handling-of-addicti...
    - fortran77 4y ago
    - nocman 4y ago
      > I think it was a chance to throw shade at Peterson, which is understandable. I disagree, it was not understandable, it was just a plainly false statement. According to Jordan's own statements, he went on those medications due to a severe reaction he had to something he ate (not due to his regular diet, but rather something he ate once): https://youtu.be/3ktjZhih3LQ?t=173 https://youtu.be/3ktjZhih3LQ?t=173 And I wholeheartedly disagree with your assessment of him. I don't agree with everything he says (in fact there are a fair number of things we do not see eye-to-eye on). However, he is obviously very intelligent, and unlike a large number of the media he has interacted with he has been decidedly civil in his discourse (even in the face of media figures who were purposefully being unfair and uncivil, trying to score points on him and make him appear to be something that he is not).
- yellow_lead 4y ago
  His daughter does a red meat diet for those missing the connection
- IG_Semmelweiss 4y ago
- _skzr 4y ago
  [flagged]
  - walrus01 4y ago
- hstan4 4y ago
  Only if it’s Jordan Peterson is it okay to mock someone for their lifelong depression and attempts to cure it
colordrops 4y ago
There may be short term benefits to a keto diet, but longer term is not so clear. And health is only one element. Red meat is absolutely devastating to the environment and water supply, with immense greenhouse gas emissions, deforestation, and polluted water tables, on top of the incredible cruelty of factory farming and slaughter.
- chrisco255 4y ago
  No it's not. Monocropping is far worse for the environment and entails mowing entire states down, repeatedly tilling and saturating soil with herbicide and pesticide, destroying millions of acres of former prairie land, and genetically engineering crops for glyphosate. Ruminants like cattle, sheep, etc have existed naturally for over 50 million years. They are an essential component of prairie land ecosystems. And much of the land that they occupy is non-arable for crops. Red meat is the closest thing to a natural human diet there is. https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-2-million-years-humans-ate-meat-and-little-else-study/ https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-2-million-years-humans-ate... For 2 million years, your ancestors basically ate the diet from this article. Our biology is highly evolved for it, with agriculture being < 500 generations old.
  - TedDoesntTalk 4y ago
    > agriculture being < 500 generations old Evolution works in as few as two generations. This is established. > Stone Age humans were apex predators, only moved to more plant-based diet 85,000 years ago We’ve evolved since then. We are the same species but claim we are genetically the same as humans 85,000 years ago is crazy.
    - codeflow2202 4y ago
      However your physiology doesn't change in two generations. We can easily adapt our microbiome to get access to new sources of calories. But our erect posture, tool crafting and use abilities, and our guts structure are all evolutions we gained from our hunting/scavenging times. We are what we are because of meat and fat, not green leafy vegetables.
lettergram 4y ago
The carnivore diet is a thing, it’s probably closer to historical diets of Hunter gatherers. Having done a couple of stints of meat + veggies only for 8-12 months I can definitely say you feel wired. I highly recommend, though it takes a couple weeks to break any carbs. I prefer it personally, but alas with multiple children and constant gatherings it’s hard to keep it up perfectly. Real trick is snacks. I would make burgers and / or bacon and store it for a week or eat jerky. Worked well enough if I got hungry. After the first week or two your body adjusts to the protein & fat based meals and you no longer snack as much. At least not for me.
- IG_Semmelweiss 4y ago
  The middle paragraph should be required reading in bright bold letters in any keto/paleo website. - Do not attempt if you have children - Do not attempt if you dont control what goes in the fridge. - Do not attempt if you cant deflect peer pressure.
- SamBam 4y ago
  > it’s probably closer to historical diets of Hunter gatherers. My understanding is that this is not true, or at least extremely unlikely. The majority of hunter-gatherer societies seemed to have subsisted mostly on plants, with meat being a minority of their calories, possibly more of a special-occasion food. Here's a sample source: > The real Paleolithic diet, though, wasn’t all meat and marrow. It’s true that hunter-gatherers around the world crave meat more than any other food and usually get around 30 percent of their annual calories from animals. https://www.nationalgeographic.com/foodfeatures/evolution-of-diet/ https://www.nationalgeographic.com/foodfeatures/evolution-of...
  - barry-cotter 4y ago
    > My understanding is that this is not true, or at least extremely unlikely. The majority of hunter-gatherer societies seemed to have subsisted mostly on plants, with meat being a minority of their calories, possibly more of a special-occasion food. As with every statement about hunter gatherers or hunter gardeners it varies. If you’re living in the far north like the Inuit, Eskimos or similar your diet is going to be almost all meat, maybe some berries for two months of the year. Neanderthals and anatomically modern humans living in the far North of Eurasia would have had more plants but not a lot more. Humans can live on diets of 80% plus gruel, on potatoes with some milk, rice and beans, on noting not meat (as long as you eat organs and fat). Humans are really varied. We can’t eat pure vegan without deficiency diseases but there’s a lot of variety in human diet.
pineconebutt 4y ago
sneak 4y ago
I do the same, but with a lot of protein shakes (keto chow) as well. It works really really well for me. I'll still eat low/no carb vegetables like cucumbers, pickles, broccoli, etc, however. A diet of no soluble fiber isn't workable for me.
stevebmark 4y ago
I love meat, and I've done ketosis for years. Carnivore is the dumbest idea in the world, and I love seeing when it goes wrong, like this famous example https://twitter.com/thecarnivorekid/status/1473122272579833863 https://twitter.com/thecarnivorekid/status/14731222725798338...
- pineconebutt 4y ago
- pastaguy1 4y ago
  There are multiple replies there suggesting exercising or excessive exercising may be a cause. Is this a thing? This was definitely not on my radar except maybe some routine that's unimaginably intense.
  - stevebmark 4y ago
    I personally wouldn't take advice or put any klout in the suggestions from people who promote carnivore, and definitely not from the followers of those people. They are both blinded by their dogma and ironically think they are the most scientifically enlightened over others, unaware of their dogma.
wiradikusuma 4y ago
"I stopped eating plants (including vegetables, grains, and fruit) to try to heal an issue with my skin" — could anyone share more details about this?
- TedDoesntTalk 4y ago
  I stopped drinking water to heal an issue with my throat. Now I only drink soft drinks. /s
  - freedom2099 4y ago
    I stopped drinking water and moved to alcohol only to deal with an issue with bullshit
- nradov 4y ago
  Some people have sensitivities to certain foods, which in rare cases can cause skin symptoms. For those people it can be useful to try an elimination diet to see if the symptoms disappear after a few weeks.
0xbadcafebee 4y ago
The Arctic Explorer Who Pushed an All-Meat Diet [in 1928] (https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/all-meat-diet https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/all-meat-diet) tl;dr if you eat enough fat with your all-protein diet, and get enough vitamin C (e.g. from liver) to ward off scurvy, you (might be) okay
braingenious 4y ago
Who is this guy? I’m glad his diet seems to work for him, but I’m not really clear what the value of the post is. I made fried rice today and it was great. Thank you for coming to my TEDtalk.
- ethbr0 4y ago
  > TEDtalk You forgot the closing about how because you made great fried rice today, we will all be able to solve world hunger in 2 years.
- codeflow2202 4y ago
  Well there is a few people for whom this diet is having great effects. But there is indeed no science at all to back it up at the moment. But it is surely curious that such a diet which goes against every knowledge we have about diet can work even if just in the short time. 2 examples of dogmas which got debunked: -you need to eat carbs to nourish your brain -you need fruits and veggies to avoid scurvy
  - braingenious 4y ago
    It is indeed kind of, in a very mild roundabout and self-involved way, “interesting.” I know a guy that tried this diet and ended up on statins at 23 but I never thought to write about it on substack for (lol) consumption on HN, and I certainly wouldn’t have expected that ephemera of an anecdote to make it to the front page of a popular website about technology. Edit: also it is downright hilarious that it’s assumed that this guy doesn’t season his food at all aside from salt. Is there an HN/lobsters settle site for comedy articles?
    - codeflow2202 4y ago
      High LDL is a known consequence of keto on lean people. There are ongoing studies to find out if this is a risk factor for plaque development in otherwise metabolically healthy people. Anyway stopping the diet would normally lower his LDL to his previous levels without the need of going on statins at 23...
smm11 4y ago
Carnivore and keto diets are pretty much how much of the world ate until the 40s or so. Carnivore works for me, I did that for a few years some time back. I've been keto with a carnivore slant for four years. My blood work is similar to yours. I don't care what anyone else eats, have at it. But if you pay attention to those A1C commercials that are all over the place, cut down on the sugar a bit, would you?
- Blackthorn 4y ago
  > Carnivore and keto diets are pretty much how much of the world ate until the 40s or so Umm, what? The history of humanity is one of agriculture.
  - KennyBlanken 4y ago
    Exactly. It's times like this when I laugh at how handily HN proves Dunning-Kruger effect. Coding? Programming? Startups? Great discussion. Then any time HN has a post about the environment, food, health, energy policy, transportation, politics, human rights, etc the comments section is chock full of straight up "a simple google search disproves everything you've said."
  - codeflow2202 4y ago
    The last 12000 years maybe. We had 2.5 million years of hunting gathering before that. Only the very recent history is one of agriculture.
    - freedom2099 4y ago
      Homo sapiens is 300k yo
      - codeflow2202 4y ago
        Homo as a specie is way older. We started using tools and hunting way before homo sapiens. And even if you want to cherry pick homo sapiens, agriculture is just a minor fraction of his history.
oh_sigh 4y ago
A clean metabolic panel is an important but insufficient signal of good health. Meat is jam packed with vitamins and nutrients, so it would be strange if he was severely lacking in any of the important categories. The real question will be what will the results be when he gets a colonoscopy at 40. I have a family friend who has been a long term meat-only person, and he is 50 and has a very bad case of diverticulitis as well as gastric reflux. Maybe he would have gotten them regardless, or maybe if he tried eating a little fiber he could have avoided it. I personally would be taking something like psyllium husk if I was going on that kind of diet(which I did when I went keto, but I was just doing it for fun and not weight loss, so it was hard to stick with).
- the_only_law 4y ago
  I suspect I’ve had some form of IBD for years, but unfortunately much of what I’ve read indicates that truly managing it means a strict diet and eschewing certain foods, I’d almost rather just live with the discomfort at this point.
  - oh_sigh 4y ago
    Careful there... IBD isn't just discomfort, even if that is the immediate effect - long term gut lining inflammation can lead to cellular damage greatly increasing your risks of certain kinds of intestinal/colon cancers. Have you considered the possibility that you're merely sensitive to certain types of food, which would be easier to cut out than doing large scale diet readjustments?
    - the_only_law 4y ago
      > Have you considered the possibility that you're merely sensitive to certain types of food Possibly, I’d l just be nowhere near narrowing it down. The only reason I suspect IBD is the occasional formation of painful mouth ulcers which I hear are common in Chron’s disease. It was the only thing I could find that left sores exactly like that in the area on the inside of my lip in front of the teeth.
uf00lme 4y ago
Young bodies can do anything. Wait to you are middle aged, then it starts to feel like even a small win has downsides.
diego_moita 4y ago
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- Beaver117 4y ago
  Those same scientists used to tell us cigarettes are not harmful. Now we have the tools to do our own research. Read and verify.
  - gregjor 4y ago
    Surely not the same scientists. Not even even scientists. Tobacco marketing people, yes. Can you find any examples to support the claim that “Those same scientists used to tell us cigarettes are not harmful?” Scientists and doctors have linked cigarette smoking to multiple health problems since the late 19th century. Now we have the tools to do our own reading, but probably not actual scientific research. That means we have the tools to confirm our biases.
thehonest 4y ago
You are wrong and will probably die of a heart attack. Also, murdering and exploiting animals is not cool.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- incomingpain 4y ago
  >You are wrong and will probably die of a heart attack. This keto fad has been going on for years. The actual science is in on this. Dietary cholesterol has nothing to do with anything. In fact, high blood sugar tends to damage your serum cholesterol. You basically have to go into a long fast in order to let your body clear out the damaged cholesterol. But often people dont do that, so slowly but surely the damaged cholesterol builds up. That's when you start having heart attacks. https://www.healthline.com/health/high-cholesterol/sugar-and-cholesterol https://www.healthline.com/health/high-cholesterol/sugar-and... What keto does is effectively limit the amount of damage to ldl. Carnivore completely eliminates this. If you're concerned about other people's diet and heart attacks. You pretty much have to recommend carnivore to them. >Also, murdering and exploiting animals is not cool. Murdering and exploiting animals that wouldn't exist otherwise. As humans have been 'murdering and exploiting' animal for 100,000 years... not going to win much argument in ending this. I do believe synthmeat will be a thing in the future. I optimistically hope to see this day.
- atc 4y ago
octokatt 4y ago
A useful way to interpret this blog post is “I had weird health issues that were resistant to treatment, but dramatically changing my diet helped”. This blog post does not contain useful advice for most people, but is a) vaguely interesting to see how someone managed to control rare health issues, and b) may be helpful for folk who have been trying and failing to deal with major health issues similar to the author.
eixiepia 4y ago
Followed a vegan diet and felt great in the beginning as most people do. I made sure to do everything as recommended by vegan doctors. Slowly but surely various health problems started to show, including bad teeths. Tried to make it work, sought help in the vegan community, but it's not accepted that a vegan diet can cause health problems, so I was shunned. Being desperate and my health just getting worse, I did a radical shift to the carnivore diet and started to feel much better. Now, after 7 years on the carnivore diet, I have never been in better health. I believe this saved my life. I still have bad teeth from the vegan days, but atleast it's not getting worse.
- c0nducktr 4y ago
  What teeth issues did you run into? I'm not on a vegan diet, or a carnivore diet, but I worry about my teeth all the time. What happened when you changed your diet? Are these teeth issues, or gum issues, or both?
  - eixiepia 4y ago
    Always had good teeth before. Flushing and brushing thoroughly multiple times a day. After some time on vegan diet, suddenly 4 cavities was found during a dental visit, later 7 cavities found and two teeth pulled because of excessive decay. I would then even more rigorously take care of my teeth, but the cavities and decay just continued.
    - codeflow2202 4y ago
      I had the same problem a few years back when I tried a vegan diet for a few months. 2 teeth pulled, inflamed gums, plus as a bonus bad acid reflux (the 3 things could be related i guess). Going back to a normal diet made them better but did not fix it completely. A few months back I tried keto which did fix all those problems.
- apricot13 4y ago
  Obviously not helpful now but could be of interest to someone. This article has always stuck in my mind for when a well known vegan considers leaving. Turned out she needed more fat in her diet which I guess makes sense considering the naturally lean vegan diet especially when combined with raw. http://bonzaiaphrodite.com/2015/07/when-vegans-get-sick-excerpts-from-my-talk-at-vida-vegan-con-2015/ http://bonzaiaphrodite.com/2015/07/when-vegans-get-sick-exce...
rdednl 4y ago
"The first time I ate vegetables again I soon developed some kind of lethargy, but it was familiar, and had once been common. I realized that since I had stopped eating plants, I had not felt this at all. I thought it was just normal to eat dinner and not want to do anything for 1-2 hours? But when I only eat meat, I don’t get this. Eating plants, even just a bit, makes my stomach feel bloated— But I can eat 2lbs of steak in one sitting and feel great." I consider myself vegetarian although not 100% strict and in the past 4/5 years I ate red meat when I wanted to try specific foods, or dishes and every single time I felt in the exact same way that the author felt when eating vegetables. When I eat red meat, I am tired, I don't sleep well, I can't exercise well and I can't concentrate. And all my (mostly) vegetarian friends feel the same way when eating red meat. This to say that his single data point doesn't mean anything: most likely my body is not used to red meat anymore, in the same way that his is not used to vegetables anymore.
- freedom2099 4y ago
  To be fair I eat everything and never feel bloated or tired afterwards. Sometimes I eat vegan for a while if I go on vacation with some vegan friends or I eat more meat for random reasons and never felt any difference. I have the feeling that when people do try to actively do something to improve their wellbeing the bode has some kind of placebos effect. You believe that eating meat is better: you feel more energetic after eating meat. You believe vegan diet is better? Same things happen. With this I am not saying that either option is equally healthy! On the contrary there is a very strong scientific evidence towards a plant based being healthier!
kornhole 4y ago
This diet works well for my Scandinavian makeup, but it is very unethical in the world of today. I try to get most of my protein from plants. They don't make me feel physically great, but I can live with myself better doing so.
neuralRiot 4y ago
Arthritis, gout, heart disease, diabetes, cancer vs skin condition? Take your pick
- goldforever 4y ago
Markoff 4y ago
I don't really understand people trying to reinvent the wheel, why not look for diets around the world which work, look at life expectancy in Japan, Spain, Italy, South Korea, Singapore, Cyprus etc. (though quite odd to see at top places odd landlocked Switzerland, dunno when that happened, never noticed)
- codeflow2202 4y ago
  The problem is that many people start to develop problems in digesting many types of food that would normally be easily assimilated. The causes could be many but the most likely culprits are antibiotics and pesticides damaging the gut lining and flora. The consequence is that people is losing the ability to safely eat foods that would be normally considered safe and healthy. In all probability the reason that a meat only diet works for so many people it's that it is a subtype of low FODMAP diet. https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/treatments/22466-low-fodmap-diet https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/treatments/22466-low-f...
caeril 4y ago
This is generally a healthy way of eating, but one word of caution: Without any carbohydrates at all, your SHBG levels will generally get very high, and you may end up with long-term hormonal issues. It's also questionable whether very-long-term gluconeogenesis is good for your liver. More studies are needed. Paul Saladino, who used to be very strict carnivore, has recently recommended introduction of fruits and honey into an animal-based diet to address the SHBG and long-term gluconeogenesis concerns. He is still vehemently against grains and vegetables, but regularly includes 100-150 grams of carbohydrates from fruit/honey sources daily now, with positive effects on his (hormonal) blood work.
hereme888 4y ago
I'd be concerned about his heart's health. Idk you can do anything to mitigate the chronic ingestion of high amounts of trimethylamine N-oxide (TMAO) from causing heart disease. Maybe he'll eventually discover an alternative that also works well.
excitednumber 4y ago
Tl;dr colorectal cancer

38 points by weisser 4y ago

Sounds like this guy is in the category of people for whom keto diets can work wonders. It's definitely not worth it for me, I've tried, and I suspect it's the same for most people.

ryanSrich 4y ago
Have you tried low carb? I tried keto for a while, and noticed a few benefits, but it was hell not having the occasional bowl of rice or slice of bread. So I switched to a mostly low carb diet, but allow myself to have things like rice and bread 1-3 times per week. I’ve found almost no difference for me between this and keto in terms of physical benefits.

walrus01 4y ago

[flagged]

chrisco255 4y ago
Clearly getting addicted to pills has nothing to do with diet selection.
- pstuart 4y ago
  Yes, it has no direct connection. I think it was a chance to throw shade at Peterson, which is understandable. Edit: I understand Peterson's appeal but I am not a fan because I think he's full of bs and himself. In the case of the drug addiction issue he blamed everybody but himself. https://readpassage.com/jordan-petersons-handling-of-addiction-is-fair-game-for-critique/ https://readpassage.com/jordan-petersons-handling-of-addicti...
  - fortran77 4y ago
  - nocman 4y ago
    > I think it was a chance to throw shade at Peterson, which is understandable. I disagree, it was not understandable, it was just a plainly false statement. According to Jordan's own statements, he went on those medications due to a severe reaction he had to something he ate (not due to his regular diet, but rather something he ate once): https://youtu.be/3ktjZhih3LQ?t=173 https://youtu.be/3ktjZhih3LQ?t=173 And I wholeheartedly disagree with your assessment of him. I don't agree with everything he says (in fact there are a fair number of things we do not see eye-to-eye on). However, he is obviously very intelligent, and unlike a large number of the media he has interacted with he has been decidedly civil in his discourse (even in the face of media figures who were purposefully being unfair and uncivil, trying to score points on him and make him appear to be something that he is not).
yellow_lead 4y ago
His daughter does a red meat diet for those missing the connection
IG_Semmelweiss 4y ago
_skzr 4y ago
[flagged]
- walrus01 4y ago
hstan4 4y ago
Only if it’s Jordan Peterson is it okay to mock someone for their lifelong depression and attempts to cure it

colordrops 4y ago

There may be short term benefits to a keto diet, but longer term is not so clear. And health is only one element. Red meat is absolutely devastating to the environment and water supply, with immense greenhouse gas emissions, deforestation, and polluted water tables, on top of the incredible cruelty of factory farming and slaughter.

chrisco255 4y ago
No it's not. Monocropping is far worse for the environment and entails mowing entire states down, repeatedly tilling and saturating soil with herbicide and pesticide, destroying millions of acres of former prairie land, and genetically engineering crops for glyphosate. Ruminants like cattle, sheep, etc have existed naturally for over 50 million years. They are an essential component of prairie land ecosystems. And much of the land that they occupy is non-arable for crops. Red meat is the closest thing to a natural human diet there is. https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-2-million-years-humans-ate-meat-and-little-else-study/ https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-2-million-years-humans-ate... For 2 million years, your ancestors basically ate the diet from this article. Our biology is highly evolved for it, with agriculture being < 500 generations old.
- TedDoesntTalk 4y ago
  > agriculture being < 500 generations old Evolution works in as few as two generations. This is established. > Stone Age humans were apex predators, only moved to more plant-based diet 85,000 years ago We’ve evolved since then. We are the same species but claim we are genetically the same as humans 85,000 years ago is crazy.
  - codeflow2202 4y ago
    However your physiology doesn't change in two generations. We can easily adapt our microbiome to get access to new sources of calories. But our erect posture, tool crafting and use abilities, and our guts structure are all evolutions we gained from our hunting/scavenging times. We are what we are because of meat and fat, not green leafy vegetables.

lettergram 4y ago

The carnivore diet is a thing, it’s probably closer to historical diets of Hunter gatherers. Having done a couple of stints of meat + veggies only for 8-12 months I can definitely say you feel wired. I highly recommend, though it takes a couple weeks to break any carbs. I prefer it personally, but alas with multiple children and constant gatherings it’s hard to keep it up perfectly. Real trick is snacks. I would make burgers and / or bacon and store it for a week or eat jerky. Worked well enough if I got hungry. After the first week or two your body adjusts to the protein & fat based meals and you no longer snack as much. At least not for me.

IG_Semmelweiss 4y ago
The middle paragraph should be required reading in bright bold letters in any keto/paleo website. - Do not attempt if you have children - Do not attempt if you dont control what goes in the fridge. - Do not attempt if you cant deflect peer pressure.
SamBam 4y ago
> it’s probably closer to historical diets of Hunter gatherers. My understanding is that this is not true, or at least extremely unlikely. The majority of hunter-gatherer societies seemed to have subsisted mostly on plants, with meat being a minority of their calories, possibly more of a special-occasion food. Here's a sample source: > The real Paleolithic diet, though, wasn’t all meat and marrow. It’s true that hunter-gatherers around the world crave meat more than any other food and usually get around 30 percent of their annual calories from animals. https://www.nationalgeographic.com/foodfeatures/evolution-of-diet/ https://www.nationalgeographic.com/foodfeatures/evolution-of...
- barry-cotter 4y ago
  > My understanding is that this is not true, or at least extremely unlikely. The majority of hunter-gatherer societies seemed to have subsisted mostly on plants, with meat being a minority of their calories, possibly more of a special-occasion food. As with every statement about hunter gatherers or hunter gardeners it varies. If you’re living in the far north like the Inuit, Eskimos or similar your diet is going to be almost all meat, maybe some berries for two months of the year. Neanderthals and anatomically modern humans living in the far North of Eurasia would have had more plants but not a lot more. Humans can live on diets of 80% plus gruel, on potatoes with some milk, rice and beans, on noting not meat (as long as you eat organs and fat). Humans are really varied. We can’t eat pure vegan without deficiency diseases but there’s a lot of variety in human diet.

pineconebutt 4y ago

sneak 4y ago

I do the same, but with a lot of protein shakes (keto chow) as well. It works really really well for me. I'll still eat low/no carb vegetables like cucumbers, pickles, broccoli, etc, however. A diet of no soluble fiber isn't workable for me.

stevebmark 4y ago

I love meat, and I've done ketosis for years. Carnivore is the dumbest idea in the world, and I love seeing when it goes wrong, like this famous example https://twitter.com/thecarnivorekid/status/1473122272579833863 https://twitter.com/thecarnivorekid/status/14731222725798338...

pineconebutt 4y ago
pastaguy1 4y ago
There are multiple replies there suggesting exercising or excessive exercising may be a cause. Is this a thing? This was definitely not on my radar except maybe some routine that's unimaginably intense.
- stevebmark 4y ago
  I personally wouldn't take advice or put any klout in the suggestions from people who promote carnivore, and definitely not from the followers of those people. They are both blinded by their dogma and ironically think they are the most scientifically enlightened over others, unaware of their dogma.

wiradikusuma 4y ago

"I stopped eating plants (including vegetables, grains, and fruit) to try to heal an issue with my skin" — could anyone share more details about this?

TedDoesntTalk 4y ago
I stopped drinking water to heal an issue with my throat. Now I only drink soft drinks. /s
- freedom2099 4y ago
  I stopped drinking water and moved to alcohol only to deal with an issue with bullshit
nradov 4y ago
Some people have sensitivities to certain foods, which in rare cases can cause skin symptoms. For those people it can be useful to try an elimination diet to see if the symptoms disappear after a few weeks.

0xbadcafebee 4y ago

The Arctic Explorer Who Pushed an All-Meat Diet [in 1928] (https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/all-meat-diet https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/all-meat-diet) tl;dr if you eat enough fat with your all-protein diet, and get enough vitamin C (e.g. from liver) to ward off scurvy, you (might be) okay

braingenious 4y ago

Who is this guy? I’m glad his diet seems to work for him, but I’m not really clear what the value of the post is. I made fried rice today and it was great. Thank you for coming to my TEDtalk.

ethbr0 4y ago
> TEDtalk You forgot the closing about how because you made great fried rice today, we will all be able to solve world hunger in 2 years.
codeflow2202 4y ago
Well there is a few people for whom this diet is having great effects. But there is indeed no science at all to back it up at the moment. But it is surely curious that such a diet which goes against every knowledge we have about diet can work even if just in the short time. 2 examples of dogmas which got debunked: -you need to eat carbs to nourish your brain -you need fruits and veggies to avoid scurvy
- braingenious 4y ago
  It is indeed kind of, in a very mild roundabout and self-involved way, “interesting.” I know a guy that tried this diet and ended up on statins at 23 but I never thought to write about it on substack for (lol) consumption on HN, and I certainly wouldn’t have expected that ephemera of an anecdote to make it to the front page of a popular website about technology. Edit: also it is downright hilarious that it’s assumed that this guy doesn’t season his food at all aside from salt. Is there an HN/lobsters settle site for comedy articles?
  - codeflow2202 4y ago
    High LDL is a known consequence of keto on lean people. There are ongoing studies to find out if this is a risk factor for plaque development in otherwise metabolically healthy people. Anyway stopping the diet would normally lower his LDL to his previous levels without the need of going on statins at 23...

smm11 4y ago

Carnivore and keto diets are pretty much how much of the world ate until the 40s or so. Carnivore works for me, I did that for a few years some time back. I've been keto with a carnivore slant for four years. My blood work is similar to yours. I don't care what anyone else eats, have at it. But if you pay attention to those A1C commercials that are all over the place, cut down on the sugar a bit, would you?

Blackthorn 4y ago
> Carnivore and keto diets are pretty much how much of the world ate until the 40s or so Umm, what? The history of humanity is one of agriculture.
- KennyBlanken 4y ago
  Exactly. It's times like this when I laugh at how handily HN proves Dunning-Kruger effect. Coding? Programming? Startups? Great discussion. Then any time HN has a post about the environment, food, health, energy policy, transportation, politics, human rights, etc the comments section is chock full of straight up "a simple google search disproves everything you've said."
- codeflow2202 4y ago
  The last 12000 years maybe. We had 2.5 million years of hunting gathering before that. Only the very recent history is one of agriculture.
  - freedom2099 4y ago
    Homo sapiens is 300k yo
    - codeflow2202 4y ago
      Homo as a specie is way older. We started using tools and hunting way before homo sapiens. And even if you want to cherry pick homo sapiens, agriculture is just a minor fraction of his history.

oh_sigh 4y ago

A clean metabolic panel is an important but insufficient signal of good health. Meat is jam packed with vitamins and nutrients, so it would be strange if he was severely lacking in any of the important categories. The real question will be what will the results be when he gets a colonoscopy at 40. I have a family friend who has been a long term meat-only person, and he is 50 and has a very bad case of diverticulitis as well as gastric reflux. Maybe he would have gotten them regardless, or maybe if he tried eating a little fiber he could have avoided it. I personally would be taking something like psyllium husk if I was going on that kind of diet(which I did when I went keto, but I was just doing it for fun and not weight loss, so it was hard to stick with).

the_only_law 4y ago
I suspect I’ve had some form of IBD for years, but unfortunately much of what I’ve read indicates that truly managing it means a strict diet and eschewing certain foods, I’d almost rather just live with the discomfort at this point.
- oh_sigh 4y ago
  Careful there... IBD isn't just discomfort, even if that is the immediate effect - long term gut lining inflammation can lead to cellular damage greatly increasing your risks of certain kinds of intestinal/colon cancers. Have you considered the possibility that you're merely sensitive to certain types of food, which would be easier to cut out than doing large scale diet readjustments?
  - the_only_law 4y ago
    > Have you considered the possibility that you're merely sensitive to certain types of food Possibly, I’d l just be nowhere near narrowing it down. The only reason I suspect IBD is the occasional formation of painful mouth ulcers which I hear are common in Chron’s disease. It was the only thing I could find that left sores exactly like that in the area on the inside of my lip in front of the teeth.

uf00lme 4y ago

Young bodies can do anything. Wait to you are middle aged, then it starts to feel like even a small win has downsides.

diego_moita 4y ago

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Beaver117 4y ago
Those same scientists used to tell us cigarettes are not harmful. Now we have the tools to do our own research. Read and verify.
- gregjor 4y ago
  Surely not the same scientists. Not even even scientists. Tobacco marketing people, yes. Can you find any examples to support the claim that “Those same scientists used to tell us cigarettes are not harmful?” Scientists and doctors have linked cigarette smoking to multiple health problems since the late 19th century. Now we have the tools to do our own reading, but probably not actual scientific research. That means we have the tools to confirm our biases.

thehonest 4y ago

You are wrong and will probably die of a heart attack. Also, murdering and exploiting animals is not cool.

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incomingpain 4y ago
>You are wrong and will probably die of a heart attack. This keto fad has been going on for years. The actual science is in on this. Dietary cholesterol has nothing to do with anything. In fact, high blood sugar tends to damage your serum cholesterol. You basically have to go into a long fast in order to let your body clear out the damaged cholesterol. But often people dont do that, so slowly but surely the damaged cholesterol builds up. That's when you start having heart attacks. https://www.healthline.com/health/high-cholesterol/sugar-and-cholesterol https://www.healthline.com/health/high-cholesterol/sugar-and... What keto does is effectively limit the amount of damage to ldl. Carnivore completely eliminates this. If you're concerned about other people's diet and heart attacks. You pretty much have to recommend carnivore to them. >Also, murdering and exploiting animals is not cool. Murdering and exploiting animals that wouldn't exist otherwise. As humans have been 'murdering and exploiting' animal for 100,000 years... not going to win much argument in ending this. I do believe synthmeat will be a thing in the future. I optimistically hope to see this day.
atc 4y ago

octokatt 4y ago

A useful way to interpret this blog post is “I had weird health issues that were resistant to treatment, but dramatically changing my diet helped”. This blog post does not contain useful advice for most people, but is a) vaguely interesting to see how someone managed to control rare health issues, and b) may be helpful for folk who have been trying and failing to deal with major health issues similar to the author.

eixiepia 4y ago

Followed a vegan diet and felt great in the beginning as most people do. I made sure to do everything as recommended by vegan doctors. Slowly but surely various health problems started to show, including bad teeths. Tried to make it work, sought help in the vegan community, but it's not accepted that a vegan diet can cause health problems, so I was shunned. Being desperate and my health just getting worse, I did a radical shift to the carnivore diet and started to feel much better. Now, after 7 years on the carnivore diet, I have never been in better health. I believe this saved my life. I still have bad teeth from the vegan days, but atleast it's not getting worse.

c0nducktr 4y ago
What teeth issues did you run into? I'm not on a vegan diet, or a carnivore diet, but I worry about my teeth all the time. What happened when you changed your diet? Are these teeth issues, or gum issues, or both?
- eixiepia 4y ago
  Always had good teeth before. Flushing and brushing thoroughly multiple times a day. After some time on vegan diet, suddenly 4 cavities was found during a dental visit, later 7 cavities found and two teeth pulled because of excessive decay. I would then even more rigorously take care of my teeth, but the cavities and decay just continued.
  - codeflow2202 4y ago
    I had the same problem a few years back when I tried a vegan diet for a few months. 2 teeth pulled, inflamed gums, plus as a bonus bad acid reflux (the 3 things could be related i guess). Going back to a normal diet made them better but did not fix it completely. A few months back I tried keto which did fix all those problems.
apricot13 4y ago
Obviously not helpful now but could be of interest to someone. This article has always stuck in my mind for when a well known vegan considers leaving. Turned out she needed more fat in her diet which I guess makes sense considering the naturally lean vegan diet especially when combined with raw. http://bonzaiaphrodite.com/2015/07/when-vegans-get-sick-excerpts-from-my-talk-at-vida-vegan-con-2015/ http://bonzaiaphrodite.com/2015/07/when-vegans-get-sick-exce...

rdednl 4y ago

"The first time I ate vegetables again I soon developed some kind of lethargy, but it was familiar, and had once been common. I realized that since I had stopped eating plants, I had not felt this at all. I thought it was just normal to eat dinner and not want to do anything for 1-2 hours? But when I only eat meat, I don’t get this. Eating plants, even just a bit, makes my stomach feel bloated— But I can eat 2lbs of steak in one sitting and feel great." I consider myself vegetarian although not 100% strict and in the past 4/5 years I ate red meat when I wanted to try specific foods, or dishes and every single time I felt in the exact same way that the author felt when eating vegetables. When I eat red meat, I am tired, I don't sleep well, I can't exercise well and I can't concentrate. And all my (mostly) vegetarian friends feel the same way when eating red meat. This to say that his single data point doesn't mean anything: most likely my body is not used to red meat anymore, in the same way that his is not used to vegetables anymore.

freedom2099 4y ago
To be fair I eat everything and never feel bloated or tired afterwards. Sometimes I eat vegan for a while if I go on vacation with some vegan friends or I eat more meat for random reasons and never felt any difference. I have the feeling that when people do try to actively do something to improve their wellbeing the bode has some kind of placebos effect. You believe that eating meat is better: you feel more energetic after eating meat. You believe vegan diet is better? Same things happen. With this I am not saying that either option is equally healthy! On the contrary there is a very strong scientific evidence towards a plant based being healthier!

kornhole 4y ago

This diet works well for my Scandinavian makeup, but it is very unethical in the world of today. I try to get most of my protein from plants. They don't make me feel physically great, but I can live with myself better doing so.

neuralRiot 4y ago

Arthritis, gout, heart disease, diabetes, cancer vs skin condition? Take your pick

goldforever 4y ago

Markoff 4y ago

I don't really understand people trying to reinvent the wheel, why not look for diets around the world which work, look at life expectancy in Japan, Spain, Italy, South Korea, Singapore, Cyprus etc. (though quite odd to see at top places odd landlocked Switzerland, dunno when that happened, never noticed)

codeflow2202 4y ago
The problem is that many people start to develop problems in digesting many types of food that would normally be easily assimilated. The causes could be many but the most likely culprits are antibiotics and pesticides damaging the gut lining and flora. The consequence is that people is losing the ability to safely eat foods that would be normally considered safe and healthy. In all probability the reason that a meat only diet works for so many people it's that it is a subtype of low FODMAP diet. https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/treatments/22466-low-fodmap-diet https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/treatments/22466-low-f...

caeril 4y ago

This is generally a healthy way of eating, but one word of caution: Without any carbohydrates at all, your SHBG levels will generally get very high, and you may end up with long-term hormonal issues. It's also questionable whether very-long-term gluconeogenesis is good for your liver. More studies are needed. Paul Saladino, who used to be very strict carnivore, has recently recommended introduction of fruits and honey into an animal-based diet to address the SHBG and long-term gluconeogenesis concerns. He is still vehemently against grains and vegetables, but regularly includes 100-150 grams of carbohydrates from fruit/honey sources daily now, with positive effects on his (hormonal) blood work.

hereme888 4y ago

I'd be concerned about his heart's health. Idk you can do anything to mitigate the chronic ingestion of high amounts of trimethylamine N-oxide (TMAO) from causing heart disease. Maybe he'll eventually discover an alternative that also works well.

excitednumber 4y ago

Tl;dr colorectal cancer