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I agree. Covid is not a crisis. For a vaxxed individual the risk looks very low. I’m happy to grab my boosters as needed and mask up during the winter. It doesn

I agree. Covid is not a crisis. For a vaxxed individual the risk looks very low. I’m happy to grab my boosters as needed and mask up during the winter. It doesn’t really matter. I would wager the virus will continue to grow less dangerous over time. What’s utterly astonishing is what’s going on in Shanghai in spite of this.

freebuju 5y ago
Covid will remain an endemic crisis always looming as you rightly point out with the events in Shanghai. Vaccines and multiple boosters won't stop infections and hospitalizations. At this point, if you are alive we have to assume you have developed some immune response to some variant of COVID. Am more disturbed about the overwhelming lack of research on natural immunity and other possible treatments. Vaccine over-reliance is akin to taking a shot in the dark.
- dahinds 5y ago
  dexamethasone, monoclonal antibodies, molnupiravir, paclovid, as well as all the work on ideas good and bad that did not pan out? And I think there's a decent amount of research on natural immunity going on? (not sure how to measure what you describe as an "overwhelming lack of research")
  - freebuju 5y ago
    I hold my ground and there is an obvious reason why none of the promising anti-inflammatory drugs which have been used in the past to deal with flu haven't seen the light of day. IMO Covid infection was only considered a death sentence because at first we did not have any patient care focused on treatment of known symptoms through the stages of the sickness & foolishly ignored any potential alternatives or rather the scientific community was co-opted into praising mRNA and look nowhere else. Remdesivir is one of the hush hush alternatives proven to have some success with covid treatment but it never comes up. Anywhere. Nevermind that the FDA approved its use for mild-cases treatment. The scientific community let us down a big one on this. Look at masks now. They backtracked on the effectiveness of that.
fps_doug 5y ago
> What’s utterly astonishing is what’s going on in Shanghai in spite of this. And ironically, with the case numbers vs. deaths we see there, it seems to strongly support the stance that the crisis is over. 7 deaths for 12k infected is ridiculous. They just cannot change course from zero covid without losing face, this is why they push through with this nonsense.
- contravariant 5y ago
  What do you find ridiculous about it? For a city with a population of 24 million that sounds pretty alarming to be honest.
  - fps_doug 5y ago
    7 in 12k is way less than the rate you'd expect in the overall population. It's 0.5 in 1000 people. The US' overall death rate was 8.8 per 1000 in 2020.
    - contravariant 5y ago
      It's still thousands of potential deaths, and nearing a million for all of China. And that's before taking into account the fact that this will be an underestimation since deaths tend to trail the infection count by something like 2 weeks. Still more alarming than ridiculous in my books.
      - fps_doug 5y ago
        > It's still thousands of potential deaths, and nearing a million for all of China. People die all the time. Every day. Shanghai has 25M people. Let's assume the US's annual death rate of 8.8 per 1000. That's 220k deaths per year, or 4230 deaths per week. Statistically with the current numbers, getting everybody infected would result in less deaths than having no covid at all :o) Sure, we'll only see real deaths with a delay of a few weeks, so that's witless, but as stated in my sibling comment in this thread, Omicron seems not to deliver on this from my personal experiences at all. Having a total lock-down over it seems absolutely ridiculous to me.
anonuser123456 5y ago
I agree covid is likely over. But as a vaxed person I would still avoid it. It took me 8 weeks for my cardiovascular system to return to baseline after omicron infection (metrics via Oura, apple watch).
- dominotw 5y ago
  i don't have apple watch ect but I do feel my cardio has gone down post omicron. Curious what metrics from those apps did you use to confirm your hypothesis.
  - anonuser123456 5y ago
    Heart rate variability & resting heart rate. Resting heart rate was up 5-7 BPM and HRV was down 10ms. It has since recovered.
- sinsterizme 5y ago
  I noticed elevated heart rate for months after my second dose. Honestly I think my health consequences would have been improved by not getting jabbed, as a fit young person. But alas afaik the current science doesn’t go as granular as fitness level.
colechristensen 5y ago
It’s over in America because nearly everyone was exposed to omicron and nearly everyone who was going to get it, got it. The numbers stopped growing and sharply fell because there wasn’t anyone left to infect. China didn’t have that and what’s happening is what trying to control with lockdowns will look like periodically forever. Many mitigation measures are only effective as delay instead of prevention.
TechBro8615 5y ago
The risk is low for unvaccinated individuals, too. It always has been. Within six months, the risk of a vaccinated individual approaches the risk of an unvaccinated one. That’s before considering new variants with potentially high immune escape.

freebuju 5y ago

Covid will remain an endemic crisis always looming as you rightly point out with the events in Shanghai. Vaccines and multiple boosters won't stop infections and hospitalizations. At this point, if you are alive we have to assume you have developed some immune response to some variant of COVID. Am more disturbed about the overwhelming lack of research on natural immunity and other possible treatments. Vaccine over-reliance is akin to taking a shot in the dark.

dahinds 5y ago
dexamethasone, monoclonal antibodies, molnupiravir, paclovid, as well as all the work on ideas good and bad that did not pan out? And I think there's a decent amount of research on natural immunity going on? (not sure how to measure what you describe as an "overwhelming lack of research")
- freebuju 5y ago
  I hold my ground and there is an obvious reason why none of the promising anti-inflammatory drugs which have been used in the past to deal with flu haven't seen the light of day. IMO Covid infection was only considered a death sentence because at first we did not have any patient care focused on treatment of known symptoms through the stages of the sickness & foolishly ignored any potential alternatives or rather the scientific community was co-opted into praising mRNA and look nowhere else. Remdesivir is one of the hush hush alternatives proven to have some success with covid treatment but it never comes up. Anywhere. Nevermind that the FDA approved its use for mild-cases treatment. The scientific community let us down a big one on this. Look at masks now. They backtracked on the effectiveness of that.

fps_doug 5y ago

> What’s utterly astonishing is what’s going on in Shanghai in spite of this. And ironically, with the case numbers vs. deaths we see there, it seems to strongly support the stance that the crisis is over. 7 deaths for 12k infected is ridiculous. They just cannot change course from zero covid without losing face, this is why they push through with this nonsense.

contravariant 5y ago
What do you find ridiculous about it? For a city with a population of 24 million that sounds pretty alarming to be honest.
- fps_doug 5y ago
  7 in 12k is way less than the rate you'd expect in the overall population. It's 0.5 in 1000 people. The US' overall death rate was 8.8 per 1000 in 2020.
  - contravariant 5y ago
    It's still thousands of potential deaths, and nearing a million for all of China. And that's before taking into account the fact that this will be an underestimation since deaths tend to trail the infection count by something like 2 weeks. Still more alarming than ridiculous in my books.
    - fps_doug 5y ago
      > It's still thousands of potential deaths, and nearing a million for all of China. People die all the time. Every day. Shanghai has 25M people. Let's assume the US's annual death rate of 8.8 per 1000. That's 220k deaths per year, or 4230 deaths per week. Statistically with the current numbers, getting everybody infected would result in less deaths than having no covid at all :o) Sure, we'll only see real deaths with a delay of a few weeks, so that's witless, but as stated in my sibling comment in this thread, Omicron seems not to deliver on this from my personal experiences at all. Having a total lock-down over it seems absolutely ridiculous to me.

anonuser123456 5y ago

I agree covid is likely over. But as a vaxed person I would still avoid it. It took me 8 weeks for my cardiovascular system to return to baseline after omicron infection (metrics via Oura, apple watch).

dominotw 5y ago
i don't have apple watch ect but I do feel my cardio has gone down post omicron. Curious what metrics from those apps did you use to confirm your hypothesis.
- anonuser123456 5y ago
  Heart rate variability & resting heart rate. Resting heart rate was up 5-7 BPM and HRV was down 10ms. It has since recovered.
sinsterizme 5y ago
I noticed elevated heart rate for months after my second dose. Honestly I think my health consequences would have been improved by not getting jabbed, as a fit young person. But alas afaik the current science doesn’t go as granular as fitness level.

colechristensen 5y ago

It’s over in America because nearly everyone was exposed to omicron and nearly everyone who was going to get it, got it. The numbers stopped growing and sharply fell because there wasn’t anyone left to infect. China didn’t have that and what’s happening is what trying to control with lockdowns will look like periodically forever. Many mitigation measures are only effective as delay instead of prevention.

TechBro8615 5y ago

The risk is low for unvaccinated individuals, too. It always has been. Within six months, the risk of a vaccinated individual approaches the risk of an unvaccinated one. That’s before considering new variants with potentially high immune escape.