8 ms·

2035 target is not that far in the future - given the scale - and will require taking immediate steps. We should see if they are serious soon.

chess_buster 4y ago
We already have 50% generation of electricity from renewables this year
- lkbm 4y ago
  I know it takes forever to do big projects, and diminishing returns are very much a thing, but 80% by 2035 feels like a really low bar. Looking through various targets, it's far better than most countries[0], and Germany might not have the best geography for domestic renewable energy generation other than wind. (Not that it needs to be domestic. Being dependent on Russia for gas was a mistake. Being dependent on France for nuclear or Spain for solar feels a lot safer.) [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandatory_renewable_energy_target#Table_of_renewable_energy_and_targets https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandatory_renewable_energy_tar...
  - chess_buster 4y ago
    That's true, but many German's reaaaaaaallly love renewable energy. Just go to any rural area in north-west Germany in google maps and look at the solar on the roofs of all the farms. https://www.google.com/maps/place/26655+Westerstede/@53.2438839,7.7707086,317m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m5!3m4!1s0x47b6fadfc3304ead:0x426cf776300b4c0!8m2!3d53.2577806!4d7.9222968 https://www.google.com/maps/place/26655+Westerstede/@53.2438... Took me 3 seconds.
    - solarkraft 4y ago
      I certainly do, but a lot of people I know don't really care. ... but we used to have a policy that made it profitable to install solar power (Erneuerbare-Energien-Gesetz).
      - chess_buster 4y ago
        Now it's all about the Eigenenergieverbrauch and avoiding CO2-tax, my friend. Have you heard of Leben mit der Energiewende TV?
  - nmehner 4y ago
    On a sunny march day currently about 18% of all electricity is generated from solar. Also there is a lots of wind in winter and solar works better in summer so the combination works quite well.
  - nomel 4y ago
    > 80% by 2035 feels like a really low bar. Is this even possible? Doesn't it mean that renewable production fluctuates no more than 20%, throughout the whole year? Or, are you talking instantaneously, daytime, ideal conditions? It seems like grid scale storage that could handle these massive fluctuations (like nighttime) are pretty far off. It would be interesting to see the cost analysis of that vs nuclear.
    - lkbm 4y ago
      Oh, I assume it's much more expensive than nuclear. Personally, I tend to think of nuclear as renewable, though I guess it's not really; just carbon-neutral. But even without nuclear I'd think it's viable, albeit expensive. You have to overbuild, add a lot of storage, and interconnect the continent (and maybe northern Africa) with high voltage transmission lines. Domestically, night time isn't the big deal for Germany. They're 20% wind and only 8.5% solar[0]. They just need to be able to trade their wind output with countries whose wind blows at a different time. Their geography seems like it would be good for pumped hydro storage, but they only have ~6GW capacity as of 2019[1], so maybe it's not. [0] https://www.destatis.de/EN/Themes/Economic-Sectors-Enterprises/Energy/Production/Tables/gross-electricity-production.html https://www.destatis.de/EN/Themes/Economic-Sectors-Enterpris... [1] https://www.hydropower.org/country-profiles/germany https://www.hydropower.org/country-profiles/germany
      - namibj 4y ago
        The ecosystem impact of damming up valleys is quite strongly disliked by many.

chess_buster 4y ago

We already have 50% generation of electricity from renewables this year

lkbm 4y ago
I know it takes forever to do big projects, and diminishing returns are very much a thing, but 80% by 2035 feels like a really low bar. Looking through various targets, it's far better than most countries[0], and Germany might not have the best geography for domestic renewable energy generation other than wind. (Not that it needs to be domestic. Being dependent on Russia for gas was a mistake. Being dependent on France for nuclear or Spain for solar feels a lot safer.) [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandatory_renewable_energy_target#Table_of_renewable_energy_and_targets https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandatory_renewable_energy_tar...
- chess_buster 4y ago
  That's true, but many German's reaaaaaaallly love renewable energy. Just go to any rural area in north-west Germany in google maps and look at the solar on the roofs of all the farms. https://www.google.com/maps/place/26655+Westerstede/@53.2438839,7.7707086,317m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m5!3m4!1s0x47b6fadfc3304ead:0x426cf776300b4c0!8m2!3d53.2577806!4d7.9222968 https://www.google.com/maps/place/26655+Westerstede/@53.2438... Took me 3 seconds.
  - solarkraft 4y ago
    I certainly do, but a lot of people I know don't really care. ... but we used to have a policy that made it profitable to install solar power (Erneuerbare-Energien-Gesetz).
    - chess_buster 4y ago
      Now it's all about the Eigenenergieverbrauch and avoiding CO2-tax, my friend. Have you heard of Leben mit der Energiewende TV?
- nmehner 4y ago
  On a sunny march day currently about 18% of all electricity is generated from solar. Also there is a lots of wind in winter and solar works better in summer so the combination works quite well.
- nomel 4y ago
  > 80% by 2035 feels like a really low bar. Is this even possible? Doesn't it mean that renewable production fluctuates no more than 20%, throughout the whole year? Or, are you talking instantaneously, daytime, ideal conditions? It seems like grid scale storage that could handle these massive fluctuations (like nighttime) are pretty far off. It would be interesting to see the cost analysis of that vs nuclear.
  - lkbm 4y ago
    Oh, I assume it's much more expensive than nuclear. Personally, I tend to think of nuclear as renewable, though I guess it's not really; just carbon-neutral. But even without nuclear I'd think it's viable, albeit expensive. You have to overbuild, add a lot of storage, and interconnect the continent (and maybe northern Africa) with high voltage transmission lines. Domestically, night time isn't the big deal for Germany. They're 20% wind and only 8.5% solar[0]. They just need to be able to trade their wind output with countries whose wind blows at a different time. Their geography seems like it would be good for pumped hydro storage, but they only have ~6GW capacity as of 2019[1], so maybe it's not. [0] https://www.destatis.de/EN/Themes/Economic-Sectors-Enterprises/Energy/Production/Tables/gross-electricity-production.html https://www.destatis.de/EN/Themes/Economic-Sectors-Enterpris... [1] https://www.hydropower.org/country-profiles/germany https://www.hydropower.org/country-profiles/germany
    - namibj 4y ago
      The ecosystem impact of damming up valleys is quite strongly disliked by many.