5 ms·

If there is anything happening around you which influences, it is staged and driven by someone.

by zerop 5y ago

elsewhen 5y ago
http://www.paulgraham.com/submarine.html http://www.paulgraham.com/submarine.html
- JKCalhoun 5y ago
  > Of the stories you read in traditional media that aren't about politics, crimes, or disasters, more than half probably come from PR firms. Stories not about politics, crimes, or disasters ... are not news? But I would add corporate malfeasance to the list of "politics, crimes, or disasters" (or does that count as crime?).
croon 5y ago
What influenced you to believe that?
- SpicyLemonZest 5y ago
  I was skeptical for precisely that reason, so despite the fact that it isn't a secret (see for example https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/media/checks-balances-journalism-pr/2021/06/04/df35c110-b3fa-11eb-9059-d8176b9e3798_story.html https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/media/checks-balanc...) I didn't believe it until I saw the sausage getting made. Obviously I understand why you might not trust some random guy on this, but I've personally seen a billion dollar company where an outright majority of news coverage originated with its PR team, and nobody involved found this atypical or strange.
  - croon 5y ago
    I'm not saying the concept isn't real, I'm just generally skeptical of prescriptive statements such as GGP. There are plenty of things happening around me that influence me, like kind gestures big or small, the birth of my children, learning about things (that are verifiable), which I can assure you are not staged or driven by someone.
    - yunohn 5y ago
      > There are plenty of things happening around me that influence me You’re being really pedantic with those examples - obviously, they weren’t talking about events like the “birth of a child”…
      - croon 5y ago
        I understand the context, but I was questioning the OP:s use of "anything", so I don't think I'm being pedantic. They could've just as easily said "any news around you", or whatever they felt they meant. If I expand OP's statement, I'm a bit troubled by the (purposeful) spreading erosion of trust in society. Don't get me wrong, there's a lot to distrust, especially now, but when you blanketly start distrusting everything, the trustworthy lose and the unscrupulous win. Further, you yourself lose. TL;DR: trust but verify > distrust and don't verify. We might recognize that verification is the only relevant conditional, but I think it's safe to say that it's not what's being generally applied when it comes to media consumption.
        yunohn 5y ago
        > but I was questioning the OP:s use of "anything", so I don't think I'm being pedantic Nope, you’re 100% being pedantic. OP said “things happening around you”, which most would not interpret as “birth of my child” or random “kind gestures”. > I'm a bit troubled by the (purposeful) spreading erosion of trust in society I hear this kind of misguided sentiment quite often. I hate to break it to you, but your hope/trust for humanity doesn’t change reality. Eg, my European colleagues who call political corruption as “transgressions”, implying that somehow it’s a rare occurrence in the EU, but obviously developing countries are “deeply corrupt”.
- ummwhat 5y ago
  Paul Graham's submarine essay probably.
  - yunohn 5y ago
    Obviously, every HNer religiously reads and memorizes PG’s mediocre essays. There’s no way you could hold the opinion that PR and influence pervade our society, without having read “Submarine”.
    - engineeringwoke 5y ago
      > Obviously, every HNer religiously reads and memorizes PG’s mediocre essays. Idk, I like PG. I've read the really long-form pieces like "What I've Done", etc., but from what I gather by following his Twitter, he's less and less defined by creative or unique ideas and has turned towards more standard neo-con, gen X silicon valley. More than anything, there is a noticeable lack of emotional intelligence that doesn't hold up to the standards of youth today. He went to RISD; cool, awesome; he's a brilliant computer scientist; okay, cool. The world is more global now, a lot of people have these Renaissance man-type experiences, and haven't yet made the money that will put a veil over their eyes. A lot of the essays are mediocre. A lot of them are good. But I think it's just less his time in 2022 for what he was trying to do.
      - dazh 5y ago
        Whose essays do you like? I'm always looking for good writing to read.
    - Natsu 5y ago
      That was a good essay, honestly, but just reading the media is enough to tell you that the media is fake. I mean, we've all seen headlines that switch narratives on a dime, just within mainstream media orgs, going only by their own headlines. But yeah, anyone who knows how social media sites got started with faked engagement shouldn't believe most of the things they see online.
  - TheRealNGenius 5y ago
JKCalhoun 5y ago
I like the complete disallowance of nuance in your statement. Everything influential is staged.

If there is anything happening around you which influences, it is staged and driven by someone.

by zerop 5y ago

If there is anything happening around you which influences, it is staged and driven by someone.

elsewhen 5y ago

http://www.paulgraham.com/submarine.html http://www.paulgraham.com/submarine.html

JKCalhoun 5y ago
> Of the stories you read in traditional media that aren't about politics, crimes, or disasters, more than half probably come from PR firms. Stories not about politics, crimes, or disasters ... are not news? But I would add corporate malfeasance to the list of "politics, crimes, or disasters" (or does that count as crime?).

croon 5y ago

What influenced you to believe that?

SpicyLemonZest 5y ago
I was skeptical for precisely that reason, so despite the fact that it isn't a secret (see for example https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/media/checks-balances-journalism-pr/2021/06/04/df35c110-b3fa-11eb-9059-d8176b9e3798_story.html https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/media/checks-balanc...) I didn't believe it until I saw the sausage getting made. Obviously I understand why you might not trust some random guy on this, but I've personally seen a billion dollar company where an outright majority of news coverage originated with its PR team, and nobody involved found this atypical or strange.
- croon 5y ago
  I'm not saying the concept isn't real, I'm just generally skeptical of prescriptive statements such as GGP. There are plenty of things happening around me that influence me, like kind gestures big or small, the birth of my children, learning about things (that are verifiable), which I can assure you are not staged or driven by someone.
  - yunohn 5y ago
    > There are plenty of things happening around me that influence me You’re being really pedantic with those examples - obviously, they weren’t talking about events like the “birth of a child”…
    - croon 5y ago
      I understand the context, but I was questioning the OP:s use of "anything", so I don't think I'm being pedantic. They could've just as easily said "any news around you", or whatever they felt they meant. If I expand OP's statement, I'm a bit troubled by the (purposeful) spreading erosion of trust in society. Don't get me wrong, there's a lot to distrust, especially now, but when you blanketly start distrusting everything, the trustworthy lose and the unscrupulous win. Further, you yourself lose. TL;DR: trust but verify > distrust and don't verify. We might recognize that verification is the only relevant conditional, but I think it's safe to say that it's not what's being generally applied when it comes to media consumption.
      - yunohn 5y ago
        > but I was questioning the OP:s use of "anything", so I don't think I'm being pedantic Nope, you’re 100% being pedantic. OP said “things happening around you”, which most would not interpret as “birth of my child” or random “kind gestures”. > I'm a bit troubled by the (purposeful) spreading erosion of trust in society I hear this kind of misguided sentiment quite often. I hate to break it to you, but your hope/trust for humanity doesn’t change reality. Eg, my European colleagues who call political corruption as “transgressions”, implying that somehow it’s a rare occurrence in the EU, but obviously developing countries are “deeply corrupt”.
ummwhat 5y ago
Paul Graham's submarine essay probably.
- yunohn 5y ago
  Obviously, every HNer religiously reads and memorizes PG’s mediocre essays. There’s no way you could hold the opinion that PR and influence pervade our society, without having read “Submarine”.
  - engineeringwoke 5y ago
    > Obviously, every HNer religiously reads and memorizes PG’s mediocre essays. Idk, I like PG. I've read the really long-form pieces like "What I've Done", etc., but from what I gather by following his Twitter, he's less and less defined by creative or unique ideas and has turned towards more standard neo-con, gen X silicon valley. More than anything, there is a noticeable lack of emotional intelligence that doesn't hold up to the standards of youth today. He went to RISD; cool, awesome; he's a brilliant computer scientist; okay, cool. The world is more global now, a lot of people have these Renaissance man-type experiences, and haven't yet made the money that will put a veil over their eyes. A lot of the essays are mediocre. A lot of them are good. But I think it's just less his time in 2022 for what he was trying to do.
    - dazh 5y ago
      Whose essays do you like? I'm always looking for good writing to read.
  - Natsu 5y ago
    That was a good essay, honestly, but just reading the media is enough to tell you that the media is fake. I mean, we've all seen headlines that switch narratives on a dime, just within mainstream media orgs, going only by their own headlines. But yeah, anyone who knows how social media sites got started with faked engagement shouldn't believe most of the things they see online.
- TheRealNGenius 5y ago

JKCalhoun 5y ago

I like the complete disallowance of nuance in your statement. Everything influential is staged.