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Mercedes says they will only take legal responsibility "while the system is active." The system will deactivate and hand control (and liability) right back to

by natch 5y ago

Mercedes says they will only take legal responsibility "while the system is active." The system will deactivate and hand control (and liability) right back to the human just in the nick of time if it encounters any marginal conditions (stormy weather, presence of emergency vehicles, etc…). So it looks like just an attempt to one-up Tesla with a marketing gimmick.

deepsun 5y ago
Tesla puts way more marketing BS than others, so I naturally believe others more.
- natch 5y ago
  Tesla doesn't advertise. Tesla doesn't even have a PR department… they closed it. >Tesla puts way more marketing BS than others link? waiting…
  - deepsun 5y ago
    Sure, just one example: Tesla Truck presentation, by Elon: [1] With unbreakable windows (forbidden for safety, otherwise there would not be carjackings anymore). [1]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m7atGkba-Z8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m7atGkba-Z8
    - natch 5y ago
      We shall see whether that was BS or not. The unbreakable windows part, yeah probably a bit of BS, but it doesn't rise nearly to the level of what other car companies put out. I mean… VW… And Mercedes promised self driving taxis "in three years from now" back in 2017 so… Tesla is not alone is delivering this later than expected. https://www.wired.com/2017/04/mercedes-promises-self-driving-taxis-just-three-years/ https://www.wired.com/2017/04/mercedes-promises-self-driving...
      - deepsun 5y ago
        Elon Musk: Tesla’s Autonomous Car Will Drive Coast-To-Coast by 2018 (2017) https://futurism.com/elon-musk-teslas-autonomous-car-will-drive-coast-to-coast-by-2018 https://futurism.com/elon-musk-teslas-autonomous-car-will-dr... (spoiler: it didn't as of 2022)
      - clouddrover 5y ago
        > The unbreakable windows part, yeah probably a bit of BS, but it doesn't rise nearly to the level of what other car companies put out. I mean… VW Sure! Let's test the glass on a Volkswagen Golf: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TWzUh53H_VU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TWzUh53H_VU
  - clouddrover 5y ago
    Here are some of Tesla's advertised lies about full self-driving: - https://www.tesla.com/blog/all-tesla-cars-being-produced-now-have-full-self-driving-hardware https://www.tesla.com/blog/all-tesla-cars-being-produced-now... - https://jalopnik.com/elon-musk-promises-full-self-driving-next-year-for-th-1848432496 https://jalopnik.com/elon-musk-promises-full-self-driving-ne...
    - natch 5y ago
      - Nothing BS about the first link. - The second one has been debunked repeatedly. Elon has predicted self driving dates (wrongly), not promised them. A prediction is not a promise. Mercedes is two years late on this "promise" too if we're doing that. Sure, Elon has been making his wrong predictions for more years, but now Mercedes is copying him: https://www.wired.com/2017/04/mercedes-promises-self-driving-taxis-just-three-years/ https://www.wired.com/2017/04/mercedes-promises-self-driving...
      - clouddrover 5y ago
        > Nothing BS about the first link. So your claim is that Teslas had "the hardware needed for full self-driving capability at a safety level substantially greater than that of a human driver" five years ago, conveniently ignoring the fact that the hardware has changed multiple times since then and even more conveniently ignoring the fact that Tesla still doesn't have a full self-driving product. Sorry, but that's bullshit. > The second one has been debunked repeatedly So your claim is that there are 1 million Tesla robotaxis operating on the roads right now. This too is plainly bullshit. Clearly Tesla's advertising has worked on you. The advertising has worked so well that you're fully bought into the bullshit to the point of irrationality.
        natch 5y ago
        It’s not about me, it’s more about overinterpreting statements. News flash: Elon can be wrong, has been wrong, will be wrong. This is not news, even to his fans. Taxi timeline was a prediction, not a promise. Elon. Can. Be. Wrong. Hardware is not software. The hardware working depends on software that is not done yet. Some hardware has been upgraded to be sure. The jury is still out on whether that old claim will pan out, pending future software updates. I doubt it will, but I think it was made in earnestness, not as “BS”.
  - paranoidrobot 5y ago
    There's an important distinction to be made: Tesla may not pay for advertising, but they do advertise. They also engage in marketing, too. It might not look like your usual company's advertising or marketing, but it's there. Their Youtube channel[1] is full of it. Watch this[2] and tell me that's not an ad. It's a perfect example of an advertisement. They might not have a department that is called a PR department, but they do PR. [1] https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC5WjFrtBdufl6CZojX3D8dQ https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC5WjFrtBdufl6CZojX3D8dQ [2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9id7BSPttGs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9id7BSPttGs
    - natch 5y ago
      Fair enough on the distinction between paid advertising and their own YouTube ad pieces. I don't see how this channel is "BS" as the OP's accusation, but I take your point on it being advertising.
amelius 5y ago
It takes at least a few seconds for humans to take over; any judge will assume that much.
- herbstein 5y ago
  In fact, Mercedes give the driver a full 10 seconds of buffer from first alert to relinquishing liability.
  - natch 5y ago
    That means they must have to alert the driver an awful lot, if you think about it, because that's an eternity.

by natch 5y ago

deepsun 5y ago

Tesla puts way more marketing BS than others, so I naturally believe others more.

natch 5y ago
Tesla doesn't advertise. Tesla doesn't even have a PR department… they closed it. >Tesla puts way more marketing BS than others link? waiting…
- deepsun 5y ago
  Sure, just one example: Tesla Truck presentation, by Elon: [1] With unbreakable windows (forbidden for safety, otherwise there would not be carjackings anymore). [1]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m7atGkba-Z8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m7atGkba-Z8
  - natch 5y ago
    We shall see whether that was BS or not. The unbreakable windows part, yeah probably a bit of BS, but it doesn't rise nearly to the level of what other car companies put out. I mean… VW… And Mercedes promised self driving taxis "in three years from now" back in 2017 so… Tesla is not alone is delivering this later than expected. https://www.wired.com/2017/04/mercedes-promises-self-driving-taxis-just-three-years/ https://www.wired.com/2017/04/mercedes-promises-self-driving...
    - deepsun 5y ago
      Elon Musk: Tesla’s Autonomous Car Will Drive Coast-To-Coast by 2018 (2017) https://futurism.com/elon-musk-teslas-autonomous-car-will-drive-coast-to-coast-by-2018 https://futurism.com/elon-musk-teslas-autonomous-car-will-dr... (spoiler: it didn't as of 2022)
    - clouddrover 5y ago
      > The unbreakable windows part, yeah probably a bit of BS, but it doesn't rise nearly to the level of what other car companies put out. I mean… VW Sure! Let's test the glass on a Volkswagen Golf: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TWzUh53H_VU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TWzUh53H_VU
- clouddrover 5y ago
  Here are some of Tesla's advertised lies about full self-driving: - https://www.tesla.com/blog/all-tesla-cars-being-produced-now-have-full-self-driving-hardware https://www.tesla.com/blog/all-tesla-cars-being-produced-now... - https://jalopnik.com/elon-musk-promises-full-self-driving-next-year-for-th-1848432496 https://jalopnik.com/elon-musk-promises-full-self-driving-ne...
  - natch 5y ago
    - Nothing BS about the first link. - The second one has been debunked repeatedly. Elon has predicted self driving dates (wrongly), not promised them. A prediction is not a promise. Mercedes is two years late on this "promise" too if we're doing that. Sure, Elon has been making his wrong predictions for more years, but now Mercedes is copying him: https://www.wired.com/2017/04/mercedes-promises-self-driving-taxis-just-three-years/ https://www.wired.com/2017/04/mercedes-promises-self-driving...
    - clouddrover 5y ago
      > Nothing BS about the first link. So your claim is that Teslas had "the hardware needed for full self-driving capability at a safety level substantially greater than that of a human driver" five years ago, conveniently ignoring the fact that the hardware has changed multiple times since then and even more conveniently ignoring the fact that Tesla still doesn't have a full self-driving product. Sorry, but that's bullshit. > The second one has been debunked repeatedly So your claim is that there are 1 million Tesla robotaxis operating on the roads right now. This too is plainly bullshit. Clearly Tesla's advertising has worked on you. The advertising has worked so well that you're fully bought into the bullshit to the point of irrationality.
      - natch 5y ago
        It’s not about me, it’s more about overinterpreting statements. News flash: Elon can be wrong, has been wrong, will be wrong. This is not news, even to his fans. Taxi timeline was a prediction, not a promise. Elon. Can. Be. Wrong. Hardware is not software. The hardware working depends on software that is not done yet. Some hardware has been upgraded to be sure. The jury is still out on whether that old claim will pan out, pending future software updates. I doubt it will, but I think it was made in earnestness, not as “BS”.
- paranoidrobot 5y ago
  There's an important distinction to be made: Tesla may not pay for advertising, but they do advertise. They also engage in marketing, too. It might not look like your usual company's advertising or marketing, but it's there. Their Youtube channel[1] is full of it. Watch this[2] and tell me that's not an ad. It's a perfect example of an advertisement. They might not have a department that is called a PR department, but they do PR. [1] https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC5WjFrtBdufl6CZojX3D8dQ https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC5WjFrtBdufl6CZojX3D8dQ [2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9id7BSPttGs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9id7BSPttGs
  - natch 5y ago
    Fair enough on the distinction between paid advertising and their own YouTube ad pieces. I don't see how this channel is "BS" as the OP's accusation, but I take your point on it being advertising.

amelius 5y ago

It takes at least a few seconds for humans to take over; any judge will assume that much.

herbstein 5y ago
In fact, Mercedes give the driver a full 10 seconds of buffer from first alert to relinquishing liability.
- natch 5y ago
  That means they must have to alert the driver an awful lot, if you think about it, because that's an eternity.