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That’s the kind of reasoning people want to be true, as in „I’m not lazy, it’s just my perfectionism…“ Can anyone tag some name onto these shameless and shamef

That’s the kind of reasoning people want to be true, as in „I’m not lazy, it’s just my perfectionism…“ Can anyone tag some name onto these shameless and shameful tribes? Because I can’t come up with anything that I would want to be associated with.

visarga 5y ago
Guilt–shame–fear spectrum of cultures https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guilt%E2%80%93shame%E2%80%93fear_spectrum_of_cultures https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guilt%E2%80%93shame%E2%80%93fe...
- KarlKemp 5y ago
  That's really interesting, thank you. I'd always considered guilt and shame to be correlated, as two sides of the same medal. And believe the person above also conflated the two, since their "shamelessness" is really an inability to experience guilt. So maybe the problem is that guilt (felt by the person without specific external input) stopped working, and shaming is taking its place?
  - krageon 5y ago
    Why do you believe a lack of (feelings of) guilt is a problem?
- akomtu 5y ago
  This looks a lot like one occult classification of souls: there are 3 positive types (those driven by action/will, love/compassion and wisdom/knowledge) and 3 negative types (posturing, vanity and fear). Every cycle of civilization is started by the former types, and are gradually replaced by the latter types. This wiki page describes the 3 negative types, and the 3 different cultures they create. The posturing types want appearance of being strong and wise, they are those pseudo-scientists and fake saints, so they create a guilt society. The vanity types want to feel morally superior to others, they enjoy creating contrived dogmas and making others navigate these dogmatic mazes, and they create a shame society. Finally, the fear types create a fear society: in the final stage of every cycle, when the strongest of the fear types are ruling the world, they create a death cult, with dark temples and other attributes. The wiki page doesn't mention societies created by the 3 positive types, aka the "golden age" of every civilisation.

visarga 5y ago

Guilt–shame–fear spectrum of cultures https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guilt%E2%80%93shame%E2%80%93fear_spectrum_of_cultures https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guilt%E2%80%93shame%E2%80%93fe...

KarlKemp 5y ago
That's really interesting, thank you. I'd always considered guilt and shame to be correlated, as two sides of the same medal. And believe the person above also conflated the two, since their "shamelessness" is really an inability to experience guilt. So maybe the problem is that guilt (felt by the person without specific external input) stopped working, and shaming is taking its place?
- krageon 5y ago
  Why do you believe a lack of (feelings of) guilt is a problem?
akomtu 5y ago
This looks a lot like one occult classification of souls: there are 3 positive types (those driven by action/will, love/compassion and wisdom/knowledge) and 3 negative types (posturing, vanity and fear). Every cycle of civilization is started by the former types, and are gradually replaced by the latter types. This wiki page describes the 3 negative types, and the 3 different cultures they create. The posturing types want appearance of being strong and wise, they are those pseudo-scientists and fake saints, so they create a guilt society. The vanity types want to feel morally superior to others, they enjoy creating contrived dogmas and making others navigate these dogmatic mazes, and they create a shame society. Finally, the fear types create a fear society: in the final stage of every cycle, when the strongest of the fear types are ruling the world, they create a death cult, with dark temples and other attributes. The wiki page doesn't mention societies created by the 3 positive types, aka the "golden age" of every civilisation.