6 ms·

Answer: Dogs kill 25 thousand people a year - they are not safe and people are allergic. Edit: It isn’t rabies that makes them unsafe - just in the USA about 4

by jjcon 5y ago

Answer: Dogs kill 25 thousand people a year - they are not safe and people are allergic. Edit: It isn’t rabies that makes them unsafe - just in the USA about 4.5 million Americans are attacked by dogs every year resulting in thousands of hospitalizations. https://www.wemjournal.org/article/S1080-6032(09)70079-1/fulltext https://www.wemjournal.org/article/S1080-6032(09)70079-1/ful...

Etheryte 5y ago
This is highly misleading without context. Humans kill roughly 475,000 humans every year [0]. Should we avoid having humans at the doctor's office? [0] https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/the-animals-that-kill-most-humans.html https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/the-animals-that-kill-mo...
- patall 5y ago
  What is so misleading about that number? That's 8 times 9/11, every year! Your comment is whataboutism.
- tick_tock_tick 5y ago
  What kind of take is this? You need to interact with humans.....
- jjcon 5y ago
  So if something kills less than 475k people we should consider it safe? What kind of reasoning is that?
- petee 5y ago
  I think thats a fantastic idea +1
- themgt 5y ago
  Well, the chance that your doctor would intentionally murder you is likely higher than the chance your doctor would be using a rabid feral dog from a 3rd world country, which are responsible for nearly all of the "kill 25 thousand people a year" you cited.
  - jjcon 5y ago
    And the 4.5 million annual attacks in the USA alone?
    - bigDinosaur 5y ago
      Break it down by dog breed - it isn't Beagles doing those attacks (with extremely rare exception). Of course, one area where total delusion enters the debate is with people who think all dog breeds are equally inherently aggressive and likely to attack and thus any dog can be substituted with any other and be equally dangerous.
- saghm 5y ago
  Even as someone who absolutely adores dogs and always is happy when one is around, this is a pretty silly argument. It's clearly possible to operate a doctor's office with zero dogs present, but I've yet to see one successfully operate without at least one. That said, for the past two years, every time I've been to a doctor's office, there _have_ been measures in place to keep the number of humans there as small as possible, which I think is entirely reasonable.
  - Spooky23 5y ago
    Dogs are definitely used for palliative and mental health purposes in hospitals they are pretty trivial to manage without any danger to humans with a marginally competent handler.
- kube-system 5y ago
  Hospitals near me have a security force which prohibits humans from entering unless they have a reason to be there, and removes any human who may exhibit dangerous behavior.
voxic11 5y ago
The vast majority of those deaths are from dog spread rabies right?
- patall 5y ago
  In most non-western countries, yes. Not so in the UK: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_dog_attacks_in_the_United_Kingdom https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_dog_attacks_in_t... A lot of those happened after an epileptic seizure. Which are not quite rare in doctors offices.
glitchc 5y ago
You seem to have a fear of dogs. Want to talk about it?
- jjoonathan 5y ago
  I'm allergic. Want to talk about it?
  - Jtsummers 5y ago
    If you read the article and not just the title, the majority of the discussion is using dogs for diagnostics of collected samples. They (for that use) would not be around patients like you so wouldn’t trigger your allergies.
    - patall 5y ago
      But for those applications, you would probably prefer giant pouched rats that are much cheaper to train and keep.
      - Jtsummers 5y ago
        If they work as well or better for the purpose, then sure.
  - glitchc 5y ago
    Sure, I get the allergies argument, especially if the reaction is a deadly one. It’s a good reason to avoid dogs. I have an allergy too, although not to dogs. It’s not EpiPen level, but I do keep a bottle of Benadryl handy at all times. I totally get the life or death vibe. But calling dogs killers because one is allergic to them is a bit disingenuous no? People are allergic to many things. It’s not the thing that’s the problem, rather the individual body’s overreaction in the presence of the thing. The problem is with the body, not the allergen, wouldn’t you agree?
- dheera 5y ago
  Well yes, I've been in far more life-or-death situations with dogs than humans, and they give me panic attacks. On multiple occasions I had a group of dogs chasing me on a mountain road while I was on my bike with trucks on one side and a cliff on another. Don't fault me, I had every right to be there in peace, and enjoy my bike ride. No wild animal bothered me, just the goddamn dogs. I don't want dogs anywhere near me. And yes, statistically they are far more dangerous than bears, mountain lions, and wolves combined, in terms of both injuries and deaths, even if you exclude rabies cases. Dogs were bred to fearlessly attack anything unknown and that's exactly what they do. Wild animals, on the other hand, generally fear the unknown and stay away from it.
paulcole 5y ago
Worldwide or in developed countries?
bandrade 5y ago
This is an incredibly disingenuous statistic. The 25,000 is from rabies due to bites from feral dogs. This would not be an issue in medical settings where the canines would be vaccinated.
avalys 5y ago
Dogs are not safe? As in, the therapy dog that comforts sick children in the hospital might actually bite their face off at any moment?
rubyn00bie 5y ago
Where did you get your numbers? I'm so confused because the paper you linked doesn't seem to support what you're saying in the slightest. It really just seems like you hate dogs. > [...] Dogs kill 25 thousand people a year I don't see it in the paper and it's a HUGE discrepancy. Do you mean globally? Again where did you even get that number? The ONLY reference I see is this from a CDC paper [1]: > From 1979 to 1994, dog attacks resulted in 279 deaths to humans in the United States, resulting in an average of 17 to 18 deaths per year. Sooo... Less than 20 deaths per year, up-to 21 in the worst case estimate, in a country (USA) where ~34 million households have dogs. I'm seriously perplexed, dawg. Did you read the paper or just link to it assuming no one will even skim it? [1] https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/9182209/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/9182209/
- jjcon 5y ago
  > the paper you linked doesn't seem to support what you're saying in the slightest. The paper was part of my edit just looking at the 4.5 million attacks in the USA alone (where rabies is essentially gone) to point out that it isn’t just rabies that makes them unsafe. Here you can read about the 25k deaths: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-36320744 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-36320744
  - codeyperson 5y ago
    > Dying from an actual dog bite is much more rare. There is no reliable worldwide data, but of the estimated 4.5 million dog bites in the US every year, only about 30 people die on average.
  - rubyn00bie 5y ago
    So you used an "estimate" as fact omitting that it's an estimate, from a BBC click-bait article, that offers NO citations. Pretty damn disingenuous, I think you should feel some shame for intentionally lying.
- trentgreene 5y ago
  I'd bet that high number of households that have dogs is one reason we have lower rates of dog related injuries. Well fed pets behave quite different to street dogs
Animats 5y ago
> Dogs kill 25 thousand people a year Huh? The cited article gives US statistics. "During this 27-year time period there were 504 deaths reported. An average of 18.67 deaths occurred per year, with a range of 11 to 33 deaths." That's about the same as US deaths from lightning strikes.[1] [1] https://www.weather.gov/safety/lightning-fatalities19 https://www.weather.gov/safety/lightning-fatalities19
- jjcon 5y ago
  That is worldwide - I added US attack statistics as part of my edit to point out that something can be dangerous without causing death. Here you can read about the 25k deaths: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-36320744 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-36320744
Spooky23 5y ago
That’s a nonsensical number from some clickbait article. The deaths are from impoverished countries like India where rabid dogs run rampant and people are too poor to get treatments. The 4.5 million bites (not individuals bit) is a discredited number based on some projections from ER visits and other reports where no standard protocol for reporting exists. It’s similar to the drunk driving related statistics, where if you are a drunk cab passenger and the car get into an accident it is considered “alcohol related”.
- jjcon 5y ago
  > That’s a nonsensical number from some clickbait article. Here are three sources: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-36320744 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-36320744 https://www.businessinsider.com/worlds-deadliest-animals-2016-9?r=US&IR=T https://www.businessinsider.com/worlds-deadliest-animals-201... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_deadliest_animals_to_humans https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_deadliest_animals_to_h... > The 4.5 million bites (not individuals bit) is a discredited number Care to provide a source? I provided mine but all you came in with is conjecture. In fact here is the stat again straight from the American Vetrinary Medicine Association. https://www.avma.org/resources-tools/pet-owners/dog-bite-prevention https://www.avma.org/resources-tools/pet-owners/dog-bite-pre...

by jjcon 5y ago

Etheryte 5y ago

This is highly misleading without context. Humans kill roughly 475,000 humans every year [0]. Should we avoid having humans at the doctor's office? [0] https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/the-animals-that-kill-most-humans.html https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/the-animals-that-kill-mo...

patall 5y ago
What is so misleading about that number? That's 8 times 9/11, every year! Your comment is whataboutism.
tick_tock_tick 5y ago
What kind of take is this? You need to interact with humans.....
jjcon 5y ago
So if something kills less than 475k people we should consider it safe? What kind of reasoning is that?
petee 5y ago
I think thats a fantastic idea +1
themgt 5y ago
Well, the chance that your doctor would intentionally murder you is likely higher than the chance your doctor would be using a rabid feral dog from a 3rd world country, which are responsible for nearly all of the "kill 25 thousand people a year" you cited.
- jjcon 5y ago
  And the 4.5 million annual attacks in the USA alone?
  - bigDinosaur 5y ago
    Break it down by dog breed - it isn't Beagles doing those attacks (with extremely rare exception). Of course, one area where total delusion enters the debate is with people who think all dog breeds are equally inherently aggressive and likely to attack and thus any dog can be substituted with any other and be equally dangerous.
saghm 5y ago
Even as someone who absolutely adores dogs and always is happy when one is around, this is a pretty silly argument. It's clearly possible to operate a doctor's office with zero dogs present, but I've yet to see one successfully operate without at least one. That said, for the past two years, every time I've been to a doctor's office, there _have_ been measures in place to keep the number of humans there as small as possible, which I think is entirely reasonable.
- Spooky23 5y ago
  Dogs are definitely used for palliative and mental health purposes in hospitals they are pretty trivial to manage without any danger to humans with a marginally competent handler.
kube-system 5y ago
Hospitals near me have a security force which prohibits humans from entering unless they have a reason to be there, and removes any human who may exhibit dangerous behavior.

voxic11 5y ago

The vast majority of those deaths are from dog spread rabies right?

patall 5y ago
In most non-western countries, yes. Not so in the UK: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_dog_attacks_in_the_United_Kingdom https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_dog_attacks_in_t... A lot of those happened after an epileptic seizure. Which are not quite rare in doctors offices.

glitchc 5y ago

You seem to have a fear of dogs. Want to talk about it?

jjoonathan 5y ago
I'm allergic. Want to talk about it?
- Jtsummers 5y ago
  If you read the article and not just the title, the majority of the discussion is using dogs for diagnostics of collected samples. They (for that use) would not be around patients like you so wouldn’t trigger your allergies.
  - patall 5y ago
    But for those applications, you would probably prefer giant pouched rats that are much cheaper to train and keep.
    - Jtsummers 5y ago
      If they work as well or better for the purpose, then sure.
- glitchc 5y ago
  Sure, I get the allergies argument, especially if the reaction is a deadly one. It’s a good reason to avoid dogs. I have an allergy too, although not to dogs. It’s not EpiPen level, but I do keep a bottle of Benadryl handy at all times. I totally get the life or death vibe. But calling dogs killers because one is allergic to them is a bit disingenuous no? People are allergic to many things. It’s not the thing that’s the problem, rather the individual body’s overreaction in the presence of the thing. The problem is with the body, not the allergen, wouldn’t you agree?
dheera 5y ago
Well yes, I've been in far more life-or-death situations with dogs than humans, and they give me panic attacks. On multiple occasions I had a group of dogs chasing me on a mountain road while I was on my bike with trucks on one side and a cliff on another. Don't fault me, I had every right to be there in peace, and enjoy my bike ride. No wild animal bothered me, just the goddamn dogs. I don't want dogs anywhere near me. And yes, statistically they are far more dangerous than bears, mountain lions, and wolves combined, in terms of both injuries and deaths, even if you exclude rabies cases. Dogs were bred to fearlessly attack anything unknown and that's exactly what they do. Wild animals, on the other hand, generally fear the unknown and stay away from it.

paulcole 5y ago

Worldwide or in developed countries?

bandrade 5y ago

This is an incredibly disingenuous statistic. The 25,000 is from rabies due to bites from feral dogs. This would not be an issue in medical settings where the canines would be vaccinated.

avalys 5y ago

Dogs are not safe? As in, the therapy dog that comforts sick children in the hospital might actually bite their face off at any moment?

rubyn00bie 5y ago

Where did you get your numbers? I'm so confused because the paper you linked doesn't seem to support what you're saying in the slightest. It really just seems like you hate dogs. > [...] Dogs kill 25 thousand people a year I don't see it in the paper and it's a HUGE discrepancy. Do you mean globally? Again where did you even get that number? The ONLY reference I see is this from a CDC paper [1]: > From 1979 to 1994, dog attacks resulted in 279 deaths to humans in the United States, resulting in an average of 17 to 18 deaths per year. Sooo... Less than 20 deaths per year, up-to 21 in the worst case estimate, in a country (USA) where ~34 million households have dogs. I'm seriously perplexed, dawg. Did you read the paper or just link to it assuming no one will even skim it? [1] https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/9182209/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/9182209/

jjcon 5y ago
> the paper you linked doesn't seem to support what you're saying in the slightest. The paper was part of my edit just looking at the 4.5 million attacks in the USA alone (where rabies is essentially gone) to point out that it isn’t just rabies that makes them unsafe. Here you can read about the 25k deaths: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-36320744 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-36320744
- codeyperson 5y ago
  > Dying from an actual dog bite is much more rare. There is no reliable worldwide data, but of the estimated 4.5 million dog bites in the US every year, only about 30 people die on average.
- rubyn00bie 5y ago
  So you used an "estimate" as fact omitting that it's an estimate, from a BBC click-bait article, that offers NO citations. Pretty damn disingenuous, I think you should feel some shame for intentionally lying.
trentgreene 5y ago
I'd bet that high number of households that have dogs is one reason we have lower rates of dog related injuries. Well fed pets behave quite different to street dogs

Animats 5y ago

> Dogs kill 25 thousand people a year Huh? The cited article gives US statistics. "During this 27-year time period there were 504 deaths reported. An average of 18.67 deaths occurred per year, with a range of 11 to 33 deaths." That's about the same as US deaths from lightning strikes.[1] [1] https://www.weather.gov/safety/lightning-fatalities19 https://www.weather.gov/safety/lightning-fatalities19

jjcon 5y ago
That is worldwide - I added US attack statistics as part of my edit to point out that something can be dangerous without causing death. Here you can read about the 25k deaths: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-36320744 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-36320744

Spooky23 5y ago

That’s a nonsensical number from some clickbait article. The deaths are from impoverished countries like India where rabid dogs run rampant and people are too poor to get treatments. The 4.5 million bites (not individuals bit) is a discredited number based on some projections from ER visits and other reports where no standard protocol for reporting exists. It’s similar to the drunk driving related statistics, where if you are a drunk cab passenger and the car get into an accident it is considered “alcohol related”.

jjcon 5y ago
> That’s a nonsensical number from some clickbait article. Here are three sources: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-36320744 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-36320744 https://www.businessinsider.com/worlds-deadliest-animals-2016-9?r=US&IR=T https://www.businessinsider.com/worlds-deadliest-animals-201... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_deadliest_animals_to_humans https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_deadliest_animals_to_h... > The 4.5 million bites (not individuals bit) is a discredited number Care to provide a source? I provided mine but all you came in with is conjecture. In fact here is the stat again straight from the American Vetrinary Medicine Association. https://www.avma.org/resources-tools/pet-owners/dog-bite-prevention https://www.avma.org/resources-tools/pet-owners/dog-bite-pre...