5 ms·

I’m so excited by this comment. 1) As gp said, the historical grammatical hermeneutic is the way to go for interpretation. And 2) the book of Ecclesiastes is

I’m so excited by this comment. 1) As gp said, the historical grammatical hermeneutic is the way to go for interpretation. And 2) the book of Ecclesiastes is definitely a beautiful way to stay grounded. Just the mere fact that Solomon, the author, had access to everything his age could offer and still ended up writing Ecclesiastes Ch 11 is mind blowing. Everything passes away. This world, your legacy, your wealth, memories of you, things you care for, everything. The only thing that doesn’t is God, his word, and your spirit. It puts this world and it’s fleeting pleasures in perspective. Of course, the natural reaction to this is “so what? Nihilism then?”. The Bible unabashedly says “yes, if you don’t have God” People search for the meaning of life in a variety of ways. The Bible answers this clearly: “To love God and worship him forever.” What do Christian’s do in this world? Ecclesiastes would say “to enjoy your lot with the one you love, to worship God and to accept what comes your way.”

tasty_freeze 5y ago
> Nihilism then?”. The Bible unabashedly says “yes, if you don’t have God” I am not trying to argue theology here, just giving another perspective. I was raised an an observant Catholic household, and I went every week from ages 5-19 and missed only a few times due to illness. But I never believed, I just don't have a spiritual bone in my body. None of what you quoted from Solomon about the impermanence of our material acquisitions sounds profound -- it seems obvious. But the main reason I'm commenting is this idea that non-believers must be nihilists [1]. I want to assure you that I find meaning and purpose in life, but it isn't dictated by some holy person. Pain and suffering and happiness are real and even though we are all reduced back to molecules when we die, what we do and how we act during out lives matters to the people (and wider world) around us during out lives and for a while after we die. I get the same impression from other non-believers. It is a colossal failure of imagination to think that without God people must believe nothing matters. [1] This footnote is to acknowledge that different people have their own interpretations of what "nihilism" means, and so any statement I make about nihilism will result in some group of people saying "you don't even know what it means!"
- RajT88 5y ago
  Humanism might he the term that you are describing. The idea that a deity is not needed to find meaning and derive morality.
  - insaider 5y ago
    What's the term for when the pursuit of knowledge is regarded as the highest morality? That's where I mostly get my meaning at least.
    - aklemm 5y ago
      There might not be one because a morality requires considering others, but simply pursuing knowledge does not. Unfortunately, you’ll soon have to reckon with how that knowledge affects your actions in order to call it a morality.
    - lars512 5y ago
      In Stoic virtue ethics, practical wisdom (phronesis) is the central virtue. But it doesn’t mean pursuing book knowledge, it means learning how to handle, think about and navigate all aspects of life well. In short, how to live “the kind of life worth living” (eudaimonia).
      - insaider 5y ago
        Ah yes, the Stoic 'considered life', exactly. I recommended Derren Brown's book 'Happiness' if anyone is interested in that.
- User23 5y ago
  > I was raised an an observant Catholic household, and I went every week from ages 5-19 and missed only a few times due to illness. But I never believed, I just don't have a spiritual bone in my body. None of what you quoted from Solomon about the impermanence of our material acquisitions sounds profound -- it seems obvious. I had a similar upbringing. I attended Catholic schools until college. And the whole time it all just struck me as pageantry. I perceived that it was very real for many of the others, but to me it was as you imply. Thank God the scales fell from my eyes. Interestingly it was not preaching, but my meditations on the three normative sciences that convinced me of the necessity of God. I realized that culturally Christian atheists conception of ethics is just a more or less attenuated Christian one that will continue to wither as any plant cut from its roots will. I further concluded that the same holds for the other two normative sciences. This was so unsatisfactory to me that I had an epiphany.

tasty_freeze 5y ago

> Nihilism then?”. The Bible unabashedly says “yes, if you don’t have God” I am not trying to argue theology here, just giving another perspective. I was raised an an observant Catholic household, and I went every week from ages 5-19 and missed only a few times due to illness. But I never believed, I just don't have a spiritual bone in my body. None of what you quoted from Solomon about the impermanence of our material acquisitions sounds profound -- it seems obvious. But the main reason I'm commenting is this idea that non-believers must be nihilists [1]. I want to assure you that I find meaning and purpose in life, but it isn't dictated by some holy person. Pain and suffering and happiness are real and even though we are all reduced back to molecules when we die, what we do and how we act during out lives matters to the people (and wider world) around us during out lives and for a while after we die. I get the same impression from other non-believers. It is a colossal failure of imagination to think that without God people must believe nothing matters. [1] This footnote is to acknowledge that different people have their own interpretations of what "nihilism" means, and so any statement I make about nihilism will result in some group of people saying "you don't even know what it means!"

RajT88 5y ago
Humanism might he the term that you are describing. The idea that a deity is not needed to find meaning and derive morality.
- insaider 5y ago
  What's the term for when the pursuit of knowledge is regarded as the highest morality? That's where I mostly get my meaning at least.
  - aklemm 5y ago
    There might not be one because a morality requires considering others, but simply pursuing knowledge does not. Unfortunately, you’ll soon have to reckon with how that knowledge affects your actions in order to call it a morality.
  - lars512 5y ago
    In Stoic virtue ethics, practical wisdom (phronesis) is the central virtue. But it doesn’t mean pursuing book knowledge, it means learning how to handle, think about and navigate all aspects of life well. In short, how to live “the kind of life worth living” (eudaimonia).
    - insaider 5y ago
      Ah yes, the Stoic 'considered life', exactly. I recommended Derren Brown's book 'Happiness' if anyone is interested in that.
User23 5y ago
> I was raised an an observant Catholic household, and I went every week from ages 5-19 and missed only a few times due to illness. But I never believed, I just don't have a spiritual bone in my body. None of what you quoted from Solomon about the impermanence of our material acquisitions sounds profound -- it seems obvious. I had a similar upbringing. I attended Catholic schools until college. And the whole time it all just struck me as pageantry. I perceived that it was very real for many of the others, but to me it was as you imply. Thank God the scales fell from my eyes. Interestingly it was not preaching, but my meditations on the three normative sciences that convinced me of the necessity of God. I realized that culturally Christian atheists conception of ethics is just a more or less attenuated Christian one that will continue to wither as any plant cut from its roots will. I further concluded that the same holds for the other two normative sciences. This was so unsatisfactory to me that I had an epiphany.