5 ms·

I love them, they make life easy and make great software. Why not pay a little for super usable software?

by bwb 5y ago

kadoban 5y ago
They already did "pay a little".
- bwb 5y ago
  Quality software takes persistent work and maintenance. If they misconstrued it that is on them, but they should be allowed to make some mistakes. I didn't buy Windows 95 thinking it would last until 2020?
  - kadoban 5y ago
    You didn't, but Microsoft didn't tell you it would be good "indefinitely" either.
    - bwb 5y ago
      true, and sometimes small software companies make mistakes in their early days for understanding a sustainable business model...
      - kadoban 5y ago
        They're not that small of a company. If they made the mistake why is their loyal customer eating it?
        bwb 5y ago
        Because that is where money comes from? And without money they can’t pay their people? And without their people the product fails to exist or keep up with competition? I do not understand, they made a business error for how they financially planned things it looks like. It sucks but we are talking very little money for something that is mission critical and we all use daily… Why is this so important to you?
thrtythreeforty 5y ago
OP did! Going so far as to buy a license that works indefinitely!
somenewaccount1 5y ago
happy to pay a little, that's whey we bought the lifetime license. We got hosed when they started charging "a lot", and then not sharing the product that we helped finance to build when we bought our indefinite license.
- bwb 5y ago
  I don't understand, wasn't that to version 6 per the Ops message? Can you explain? If you buy version 6, then they bring out version 7, wouldn't you buy it again or switch to SAAS?
Saris 5y ago
>I happen to like my indefinite license for 1password6 They did!
jrockway 5y ago
I also like 1password, but discovered them after unlimited licensing was dead and buried. The only offer that was ever clear to me was "you pay $X per month forever", and I'm personally fine with that. (My understanding is that you can go out of your way to find information about the non-hosted unlimited plan still; I never knew it existed and never bought it.) What did go wrong here was that their earliest adopters got screwed by the change in direction of the business. They are right to be angry, if you say "pay us $X to support you for the rest of time", then people should expect that their $X pays for support for the rest of time. That was the deal, and you can't alter the deal and expect people to be pleased. It is possible to structure the finances to support this pricing; set $X to how much money you'd invest in the stock market or a savings account such that the yearly interest covers the yearly support cost. Clearly, that didn't happen, or they want the interest for themselves instead of support, and that upsets the devoted early adopters who loved the product and the company. That is exactly the group of people you don't want to make mad, and that's the failing here. (Side note, I wanted to do some actual math on the pricing here. Say you hate SaaS and want an unlimited license for something. You can just do the financial hacks yourself! If a product costs $100 per month, that's $1200 per year. To get $1200 per year out of a savings account, just deposit... $145,000 at 0.7% APY. I guess this is why people don't actually do the "unlimited license" thing ;) I think it's a super easy misstep for any startup to make. Realize your business model doesn't work, pivot, and leave the early adopters in the dust. Most of the time, because you're growing so fast, it doesn't matter. But you will see rants like this on HN, and they could be avoided with a transition plan. ("We'll give you the SaaS version for free forever!") Just depends on how much you care. Remember how much "techies" liked Google back in the day? The sentiment on HN is a lot different today. That's what happens as you grow; you lose touch with the early users. Sometimes your vision might be better than them, and you don't need them. But nobody wants to be told by someone they love, "I don't need you anymore".
- bwb 5y ago
  Thank you for the detailed breakdown! This was helpful :) My guess is they made a mistake, and financially you can't build a business from that. So they moved to a SAAS model and now things are good. It sounds like they honored their commitment to version 6, and they are seeing 7 as a new product.

I love them, they make life easy and make great software. Why not pay a little for super usable software?

by bwb 5y ago

I love them, they make life easy and make great software. Why not pay a little for super usable software?

kadoban 5y ago

They already did "pay a little".

bwb 5y ago
Quality software takes persistent work and maintenance. If they misconstrued it that is on them, but they should be allowed to make some mistakes. I didn't buy Windows 95 thinking it would last until 2020?
- kadoban 5y ago
  You didn't, but Microsoft didn't tell you it would be good "indefinitely" either.
  - bwb 5y ago
    true, and sometimes small software companies make mistakes in their early days for understanding a sustainable business model...
    - kadoban 5y ago
      They're not that small of a company. If they made the mistake why is their loyal customer eating it?
      - bwb 5y ago
        Because that is where money comes from? And without money they can’t pay their people? And without their people the product fails to exist or keep up with competition? I do not understand, they made a business error for how they financially planned things it looks like. It sucks but we are talking very little money for something that is mission critical and we all use daily… Why is this so important to you?

thrtythreeforty 5y ago

OP did! Going so far as to buy a license that works indefinitely!

somenewaccount1 5y ago

happy to pay a little, that's whey we bought the lifetime license. We got hosed when they started charging "a lot", and then not sharing the product that we helped finance to build when we bought our indefinite license.

bwb 5y ago
I don't understand, wasn't that to version 6 per the Ops message? Can you explain? If you buy version 6, then they bring out version 7, wouldn't you buy it again or switch to SAAS?

Saris 5y ago

>I happen to like my indefinite license for 1password6 They did!

jrockway 5y ago

I also like 1password, but discovered them after unlimited licensing was dead and buried. The only offer that was ever clear to me was "you pay $X per month forever", and I'm personally fine with that. (My understanding is that you can go out of your way to find information about the non-hosted unlimited plan still; I never knew it existed and never bought it.) What did go wrong here was that their earliest adopters got screwed by the change in direction of the business. They are right to be angry, if you say "pay us $X to support you for the rest of time", then people should expect that their $X pays for support for the rest of time. That was the deal, and you can't alter the deal and expect people to be pleased. It is possible to structure the finances to support this pricing; set $X to how much money you'd invest in the stock market or a savings account such that the yearly interest covers the yearly support cost. Clearly, that didn't happen, or they want the interest for themselves instead of support, and that upsets the devoted early adopters who loved the product and the company. That is exactly the group of people you don't want to make mad, and that's the failing here. (Side note, I wanted to do some actual math on the pricing here. Say you hate SaaS and want an unlimited license for something. You can just do the financial hacks yourself! If a product costs $100 per month, that's $1200 per year. To get $1200 per year out of a savings account, just deposit... $145,000 at 0.7% APY. I guess this is why people don't actually do the "unlimited license" thing ;) I think it's a super easy misstep for any startup to make. Realize your business model doesn't work, pivot, and leave the early adopters in the dust. Most of the time, because you're growing so fast, it doesn't matter. But you will see rants like this on HN, and they could be avoided with a transition plan. ("We'll give you the SaaS version for free forever!") Just depends on how much you care. Remember how much "techies" liked Google back in the day? The sentiment on HN is a lot different today. That's what happens as you grow; you lose touch with the early users. Sometimes your vision might be better than them, and you don't need them. But nobody wants to be told by someone they love, "I don't need you anymore".

bwb 5y ago
Thank you for the detailed breakdown! This was helpful :) My guess is they made a mistake, and financially you can't build a business from that. So they moved to a SAAS model and now things are good. It sounds like they honored their commitment to version 6, and they are seeing 7 as a new product.