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This is a rabbit hole that I spent considerate amount of time and money and I’d like to warn some of those who are interested into going in. > Professional mus

by xlii 5y ago

This is a rabbit hole that I spent considerate amount of time and money and I’d like to warn some of those who are interested into going in. > Professional musicians don’t play on crappy equipment, right? ;-) With this article sentence I wholeheartedly stand. It’s important to know and optimize tools you’re using most of waking time. Keyboard promises improvement both health and performance wise. Same with layout. Yet both unorthodox keyboards and layouts are considerate investments. Even more so if they are customizable. And it might be possible that they’ll never pay off. I had situations that match common theme: I’m heavily focused on a problem. I’m coding away and that at some point I stumble and fall. I can’t remember combination for some shortcut I’ve been using in ages. Instead of working furiously on the problem I’m solving “where is the key” problem now. The other situation is the stressful one. I found out that under situations that stress me I forgot complex customizations. Keyboard layouts? They don’t work. This get amplified if you have multiple keyboards to work with. I’ve used Dvorak for more then a year - didn’t stick. Split keyboards with standard layout - same. Non orthodox keyboards - even after more than year of using it didn’t work. For keyboard.io I went so far that I got multiple ones to try to avoid “switch fatigue” and ended giving them out. Right now I’m using standard full size low key keyboard with numpad and additional F-keys for bindings. It works, has low latency (latency IS an issue with many keyboards), my hands don’t get tired because there is almost non pressure required (and I type a lot while getting older every day) and that’s the best keyboard I have. Right now I’m considering actually getting rid of tenkeyless keyboard for my gaming pc because lack of keys and all those combos to get to F-s just annoys me when I want to script something. It simply puts a problem in front of me that I didn’t intend to solve. Craftsman has to care for their tools. I agree. But choosing battles is important too.

swiftcoder 5y ago
> Right now I’m considering actually getting rid of tenkeyless keyboard for my gaming pc because lack of keys and all those combos to get to F-s just annoys me when I want to script something. Tenkeyless are supposed to have function keys - they only lack the numpad cluster. Sounds like you went down to a 65% or so?
- xlii 5y ago
  Yes, you're absolutely right! Forgot the name. That's 65% keyboard that I have.
red_trumpet 5y ago
I never understood the trend of keyboards without numpad, F-keys or even arrows. Sure, it's nice if you carry your keyboard in your backpack, but on a desk I think it's more useful to have those keys.
- Rezilli 5y ago
  The problem with numpad is, that it is usually on between your keyboard and mouse so it is more comfortable for me to just remove it entirely. But I think I would like to have it on left side of my keyboard.
  - red_trumpet 5y ago
    Oh right, as a left-handed person I always forget this totally valid point :D
- johnebgd 5y ago
  Non technical people don’t need most of those keys, kind of how non car mechanics generally don’t need pneumatic tools. I’d never buy a keyboard without them but the trend is logical.
  - red_trumpet 5y ago
    > Non technical people don’t need most of those keys I disagree. A numpad can be nice to have if you have to input lots of numbers, or use a calculator app. I often use the END-key when editing text to jump to the end of a line, similarly for POS1. So IMO this has not so much to do with being technical or not.
    - medstrom 5y ago
      A numpad is one thing as it's visually obvious, but the End key? Lots of people don't even know about ctrl+w to close window or ctrl+t to create new tab in browser. The End key is advanced black magic.
awelxtr 5y ago
> Craftsman has to care for their tools. I agree. Except for the part that programmers spend far more time reading than writing. An ajustable monitor and a good chair payoff way more than an expensive keyboard. I still don't get the keyboard hype.
- xmaayy 5y ago
  It depends a lot on where you work I've found. I recently had the chance to experience a team where they were given the full implementation logic by a product team, and your job was to turn it from business logic to code almost 1:1. I spent nearly all my time writing and testing, which was an interesting change.
- darkerside 5y ago
  Someone here does not Vim
- AtlasBarfed 5y ago
  You're right statistically, but think back to what your most "productive" moments of your developer career involved. It was probably typing furiously. Maybe not a constant dictation stream 150+WPM, but it was surges of input in response to a creative flow in your mind.
  - awelxtr 5y ago
    Call me cheap or stinky, but I tend to invest on stuff I use on a regular basis. Buying stuff for a one off ocasion when it might become handy, isn't my philosophy.
- balefrost 5y ago
  Do you read code while sitting on your hands? Or do you perhaps print out code before reading it? When I read code, it's not a passive activity. I'm navigating and searching. Sometimes I bring up external documentation. In short, I'm interacting with my computer. For me, reading code requires typing.
  - 5y ago
mszcz 5y ago
I tried to love mechanical keyboards, I really did. I think I romanticized it too much. Maybe it was a form of procrastination ("I'm sure I'll finally stop slacking off when I have the right keyboard!"). In the end however, hundreds of dollars later, no matter what I tried I always came back to Logitech MX Keys. It's low profile, wireless and pleasant to type on. The only mechanical keyboard I think came close to a daily driver, that I still have, is Keychron K1. That's probably because of it's low profile keys. Other than that I sold all others and kinda gave up. That of course doesn't mean I shit on the whole keyboard industry. I can appreciate a wonderful, thoughtful design that's tailored to someone's specific need. However, turns out that in that particular area I'm a basic bitch :P
- gompertz 5y ago
  Logitech MX Keys user here as well. It's an excellent keyboard... And I dabbled in lots of mechanical keyboards as well. The ability to switch between 3 computers is also brilliant. The keyboard looks mature and professional, which somewhat matters to me too.
gilbetron 5y ago
> Professional musicians don’t play on crappy equipment, right? ;-) Jack White (of White Stripes) makes and plays a guitar with a bottle, a board, a string, and a pickup: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r_F7aiOvdwE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r_F7aiOvdwE
- brimble 5y ago
  That's a variant of a diddley bow guitar (there are other names, too). There's a larger variety that goes by a bunch of names that you lean against a wall to play. Traditionally, you'd source the wire from a worn-out broom. It was the first instrument for a lot of early blues guitarists. (obviously, the old-school versions don't have electric pick-ups, but this is otherwise pretty much a standard build for one)
yonaguska 5y ago
I've recently made the switch to Colemak on an ortholinear split keyboard. It's different enough that I can switch back to qwerty on a standard keyboard without my brain getting too confused, but Colemak is similar enough that I was able to learn it relatively quickly. An added bonus, learning a new layout actually made me a better qwerty typist on standard keyboards, even if I'm a little slower now when I switch back, I've noticed I do a lot less reaching and moving off the home row.

by xlii 5y ago

swiftcoder 5y ago

> Right now I’m considering actually getting rid of tenkeyless keyboard for my gaming pc because lack of keys and all those combos to get to F-s just annoys me when I want to script something. Tenkeyless are supposed to have function keys - they only lack the numpad cluster. Sounds like you went down to a 65% or so?

xlii 5y ago
Yes, you're absolutely right! Forgot the name. That's 65% keyboard that I have.

red_trumpet 5y ago

I never understood the trend of keyboards without numpad, F-keys or even arrows. Sure, it's nice if you carry your keyboard in your backpack, but on a desk I think it's more useful to have those keys.

Rezilli 5y ago
The problem with numpad is, that it is usually on between your keyboard and mouse so it is more comfortable for me to just remove it entirely. But I think I would like to have it on left side of my keyboard.
- red_trumpet 5y ago
  Oh right, as a left-handed person I always forget this totally valid point :D
johnebgd 5y ago
Non technical people don’t need most of those keys, kind of how non car mechanics generally don’t need pneumatic tools. I’d never buy a keyboard without them but the trend is logical.
- red_trumpet 5y ago
  > Non technical people don’t need most of those keys I disagree. A numpad can be nice to have if you have to input lots of numbers, or use a calculator app. I often use the END-key when editing text to jump to the end of a line, similarly for POS1. So IMO this has not so much to do with being technical or not.
  - medstrom 5y ago
    A numpad is one thing as it's visually obvious, but the End key? Lots of people don't even know about ctrl+w to close window or ctrl+t to create new tab in browser. The End key is advanced black magic.

awelxtr 5y ago

> Craftsman has to care for their tools. I agree. Except for the part that programmers spend far more time reading than writing. An ajustable monitor and a good chair payoff way more than an expensive keyboard. I still don't get the keyboard hype.

xmaayy 5y ago
It depends a lot on where you work I've found. I recently had the chance to experience a team where they were given the full implementation logic by a product team, and your job was to turn it from business logic to code almost 1:1. I spent nearly all my time writing and testing, which was an interesting change.
darkerside 5y ago
Someone here does not Vim
AtlasBarfed 5y ago
You're right statistically, but think back to what your most "productive" moments of your developer career involved. It was probably typing furiously. Maybe not a constant dictation stream 150+WPM, but it was surges of input in response to a creative flow in your mind.
- awelxtr 5y ago
  Call me cheap or stinky, but I tend to invest on stuff I use on a regular basis. Buying stuff for a one off ocasion when it might become handy, isn't my philosophy.
balefrost 5y ago
Do you read code while sitting on your hands? Or do you perhaps print out code before reading it? When I read code, it's not a passive activity. I'm navigating and searching. Sometimes I bring up external documentation. In short, I'm interacting with my computer. For me, reading code requires typing.
- 5y ago

mszcz 5y ago

I tried to love mechanical keyboards, I really did. I think I romanticized it too much. Maybe it was a form of procrastination ("I'm sure I'll finally stop slacking off when I have the right keyboard!"). In the end however, hundreds of dollars later, no matter what I tried I always came back to Logitech MX Keys. It's low profile, wireless and pleasant to type on. The only mechanical keyboard I think came close to a daily driver, that I still have, is Keychron K1. That's probably because of it's low profile keys. Other than that I sold all others and kinda gave up. That of course doesn't mean I shit on the whole keyboard industry. I can appreciate a wonderful, thoughtful design that's tailored to someone's specific need. However, turns out that in that particular area I'm a basic bitch :P

gompertz 5y ago
Logitech MX Keys user here as well. It's an excellent keyboard... And I dabbled in lots of mechanical keyboards as well. The ability to switch between 3 computers is also brilliant. The keyboard looks mature and professional, which somewhat matters to me too.

gilbetron 5y ago

> Professional musicians don’t play on crappy equipment, right? ;-) Jack White (of White Stripes) makes and plays a guitar with a bottle, a board, a string, and a pickup: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r_F7aiOvdwE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r_F7aiOvdwE

brimble 5y ago
That's a variant of a diddley bow guitar (there are other names, too). There's a larger variety that goes by a bunch of names that you lean against a wall to play. Traditionally, you'd source the wire from a worn-out broom. It was the first instrument for a lot of early blues guitarists. (obviously, the old-school versions don't have electric pick-ups, but this is otherwise pretty much a standard build for one)

yonaguska 5y ago

I've recently made the switch to Colemak on an ortholinear split keyboard. It's different enough that I can switch back to qwerty on a standard keyboard without my brain getting too confused, but Colemak is similar enough that I was able to learn it relatively quickly. An added bonus, learning a new layout actually made me a better qwerty typist on standard keyboards, even if I'm a little slower now when I switch back, I've noticed I do a lot less reaching and moving off the home row.