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> Snide doesn't win Javelins do. > it's a losers attitude Losing their lives is what those Russian tankers are doing. People laughing at dead Russian tanker

> Snide doesn't win Javelins do. > it's a losers attitude Losing their lives is what those Russian tankers are doing. People laughing at dead Russian tankers on the internet aren't losing much of anything, except maybe their innocence.

lm28469 5y ago
> aren't losing much of anything, except maybe their innocence. I'd say they're, and we're, losing much more than that, the current trend is kind of worrying, nothing better than 12 years old reddit users calling for the death of Russian soldiers and very often even Russian civilians. It's funny how little time it takes to go from "never again" to "lmao kill them all" and the whole war porn surrounding the conflict, which seems unquestioned, is equally worrying. People, including kids, are sharing almost real time pictures and videos of charred and shredded bodies while cheering as if they were watching a soccer game
- RobertMiller 5y ago
  That's what I mean by losing their innocence. This war (probably not unlike any other war) is desensitizing a ton of people to violence. The ramifications of this will be felt for generations. But this sort of harm needs to be considered in the context of all the other harm being done by the war. Reddit teenagers laughing at the charred corpses of conscripts their own age is saddening, but the people who are actually doing the dying are losing much more than just their innocence and dignity. The real losers are those that are dead, maimed, had their country invaded, etc.
  - s1artibartfast 5y ago
    An argument could be made that cultural fallout from the conflict may be much more damaging than the conflict itself - perhaps even in terms of death count. It is a short step from laughing at charred Russian corpses, to charred BLM/alt-right corpses. The saddest part is that all of this animal rage is entirely unnecessary. A decent argument can be made for the US support of Ukraine without resorting to base emotions.
    - SauciestGNU 5y ago
      Yeah I saw a tweet the other day that was something like "good thing my enemies are ontologically evil, so there's no action I can take against them that is wrong" and I think that's the dangerous place we're headed toward. Elimination rhetoric against our perceived enemies, rhetoric of mass dehumanization of our enemies, and so forth.
- xdennis 5y ago
  > users calling for the death of Russian soldiers What's wrong with that? How is the killing going to stop without eliminating all invaders? > and very often even Russian civilians. Show me where you've seen that. > It's funny how little time it takes to go from "never again" to "lmao kill them all" "Never again" is about genocide. It's ridiculous to say we should care about the lives of invaders. Russians are bombing Holocaust memorials and you're pretending Russians are the victims. They are the nazis. > videos of charred and shredded bodies while cheering as if they were watching a soccer game Those orcs are bombing civilians and committing genocide. When you see innocent pregnant women and children being murdered by Russians you can't help but rejoice at the murderers getting their just rewards.
  - lm28469 5y ago
  - hidudeurcool 5y ago
motohagiography 5y ago
Arguably, NATO airstrikes and paratroopers win, but if they haven't acted yet, they're not going to act, and what's more likely is the western countries are more likely to keep the conflict drawn out, as the invasion is going to go on anyway, so they might as well use it for their domestic news cycle narratives. Russia is tolerating the resistance because it doesn't cost very much and it draws out volunteers now who would be more difficult to manage as a long term insurgency under a new government. The only reason anyone in the west without family there cares about Ukraine is because it's far. This war is a circus. It is an issue between Russia and Ukraine, and while everyone likes something to be concerned about, it's wasted, and worse, a distraction from borderline existential domestic policy issues.
- NicoJuicy 5y ago
  NATO is a defensive cause. I'd be very suprised if anything is going to be drawn out as soon as a missle can invoke article 5.
  - RobertMiller 5y ago
    I think NATO would look the other way for a stray missile that could in any way be construed as an accident. Open war between NATO and Russia, weak as it is, could be disastrous for Europe, if not the whole world. It's much safer to ruin Russia by giving weapons to Ukraine while skirting around open conflict. It's a way of depleting Russian resources (manpower, military hardware, money, mindshare, etc) while keeping the possibility of nukes to a relative minimum.
    - staticman2 5y ago
      I would expect a stray missile to be met with a proportionate response. You shoot a missile at us, we shoot a missile at you.
    - aforwardslash 5y ago
      Wars by proxy only work when they arent on your backyard. What NATO seems to be doing is taking "military time" to prepare and reinforce their ranks, while ukrania depletes some russia's military resources. Meanwhile winter is almost over, and Moscow would be a nice tank ride from ukraine, if NATO actually lacked the capability of turning Moscow into a parking lot from afar (they dont). But for things to get back to the way they used to be, either Russia changes the regime or Russia changes size. It will happen one way or the other.

lm28469 5y ago

> aren't losing much of anything, except maybe their innocence. I'd say they're, and we're, losing much more than that, the current trend is kind of worrying, nothing better than 12 years old reddit users calling for the death of Russian soldiers and very often even Russian civilians. It's funny how little time it takes to go from "never again" to "lmao kill them all" and the whole war porn surrounding the conflict, which seems unquestioned, is equally worrying. People, including kids, are sharing almost real time pictures and videos of charred and shredded bodies while cheering as if they were watching a soccer game

RobertMiller 5y ago
That's what I mean by losing their innocence. This war (probably not unlike any other war) is desensitizing a ton of people to violence. The ramifications of this will be felt for generations. But this sort of harm needs to be considered in the context of all the other harm being done by the war. Reddit teenagers laughing at the charred corpses of conscripts their own age is saddening, but the people who are actually doing the dying are losing much more than just their innocence and dignity. The real losers are those that are dead, maimed, had their country invaded, etc.
- s1artibartfast 5y ago
  An argument could be made that cultural fallout from the conflict may be much more damaging than the conflict itself - perhaps even in terms of death count. It is a short step from laughing at charred Russian corpses, to charred BLM/alt-right corpses. The saddest part is that all of this animal rage is entirely unnecessary. A decent argument can be made for the US support of Ukraine without resorting to base emotions.
  - SauciestGNU 5y ago
    Yeah I saw a tweet the other day that was something like "good thing my enemies are ontologically evil, so there's no action I can take against them that is wrong" and I think that's the dangerous place we're headed toward. Elimination rhetoric against our perceived enemies, rhetoric of mass dehumanization of our enemies, and so forth.
xdennis 5y ago
> users calling for the death of Russian soldiers What's wrong with that? How is the killing going to stop without eliminating all invaders? > and very often even Russian civilians. Show me where you've seen that. > It's funny how little time it takes to go from "never again" to "lmao kill them all" "Never again" is about genocide. It's ridiculous to say we should care about the lives of invaders. Russians are bombing Holocaust memorials and you're pretending Russians are the victims. They are the nazis. > videos of charred and shredded bodies while cheering as if they were watching a soccer game Those orcs are bombing civilians and committing genocide. When you see innocent pregnant women and children being murdered by Russians you can't help but rejoice at the murderers getting their just rewards.
- lm28469 5y ago
- hidudeurcool 5y ago

motohagiography 5y ago

Arguably, NATO airstrikes and paratroopers win, but if they haven't acted yet, they're not going to act, and what's more likely is the western countries are more likely to keep the conflict drawn out, as the invasion is going to go on anyway, so they might as well use it for their domestic news cycle narratives. Russia is tolerating the resistance because it doesn't cost very much and it draws out volunteers now who would be more difficult to manage as a long term insurgency under a new government. The only reason anyone in the west without family there cares about Ukraine is because it's far. This war is a circus. It is an issue between Russia and Ukraine, and while everyone likes something to be concerned about, it's wasted, and worse, a distraction from borderline existential domestic policy issues.

NicoJuicy 5y ago
NATO is a defensive cause. I'd be very suprised if anything is going to be drawn out as soon as a missle can invoke article 5.
- RobertMiller 5y ago
  I think NATO would look the other way for a stray missile that could in any way be construed as an accident. Open war between NATO and Russia, weak as it is, could be disastrous for Europe, if not the whole world. It's much safer to ruin Russia by giving weapons to Ukraine while skirting around open conflict. It's a way of depleting Russian resources (manpower, military hardware, money, mindshare, etc) while keeping the possibility of nukes to a relative minimum.
  - staticman2 5y ago
    I would expect a stray missile to be met with a proportionate response. You shoot a missile at us, we shoot a missile at you.
  - aforwardslash 5y ago
    Wars by proxy only work when they arent on your backyard. What NATO seems to be doing is taking "military time" to prepare and reinforce their ranks, while ukrania depletes some russia's military resources. Meanwhile winter is almost over, and Moscow would be a nice tank ride from ukraine, if NATO actually lacked the capability of turning Moscow into a parking lot from afar (they dont). But for things to get back to the way they used to be, either Russia changes the regime or Russia changes size. It will happen one way or the other.