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Before anyone reads this and decides, "oh ya the NYT is lying to me and gas is fine", it's not. Gas in your home is objectively bad for your health, the environ

• primax 5y ago
  In my experience induction is wildly worse than gas for the cooking experience in just about every way. I'm very surprised to see the opposite suggested. It's slower, less flexible, makes some styles of sauce making impossible, and probably worst of all - invisible. Has there been some quantum leap in induction cooking I haven't experienced?
• DeathArrow 5y ago
  I would rather want to see what reputable scientists have to say than some random youtubers and activists.
  • ekianjo 5y ago
    Reputable scientists from the Lancet published hoaxes not too long ago. You cant trust anyone.
    • acdha 5y ago
      Here’s the difference: bad publications happen but when they’re discovered that leads to retractions and other professional consequences. For example, Andrew Wakefield did get a bad paper into The Lancet but it was retracted and he’s now a former doctor.
    • wolverine876 5y ago
      You can't trust anyone completely, not even one's Mom. But you can trust some people a lot more than others. If I have cancer, I trust my doctor a lot more than random people on Youtube.
      • ekianjo 5y ago
        You should be well aware then that doctors are educated by sales reps from companies who have been caught time and time again in spreading false information to doctors. Good luck. Oh. And more than half of published studies that are used to approve drugs cant be replicated. Oops ?
        • wolverine876 5y ago
          I know those things! And it doesn't disagree with my GP statement: > doctors are educated by sales reps ... That statement goes to the heart of it: "doctors" aren't educated by sales reps, different doctors are and to different degrees. You can trust different doctors to different degrees, and there is a very wide range - some are highly trustworthy, some the opposite. And you never know for sure and all you can do is observe and apply your best judgment. That's true for everyone, including Moms. One thing I can observe is that doctors obtain MDs, and I've rarely encountered doctors who didn't have deep expertise in medicine, and I know some about how much study is done at medical schools. I can't be absolutely sure, but that's a strong signal that they know far more than I do. Saying 'you can't trust anyone' is as serious and reasonable as saying 'you can trust everyone'. The world just isn't that simple, but finding who to trust is almost the most important skill.
• pdog 5y ago
  Do you know what isn't bad for your health? Good, clean healthy home-cooked food. Which, in millions of homes, is cooked swiftly and efficiently on gas ranges. Politicians and their media lackeys in the media need to stop trying to micro-manage peoples' lives.
  • jazzyjackson 5y ago
    I am a big fan of electrification but an induction range to replace my glasstop is on the order of $3-4,000 (and not in stock anywhere anyway) so I can't blame anyone for sticking with an old reliable gas range.
    • hackerfromthefu 5y ago
      I was able to get an induction glasstop for $300 on ebay (new), then needed to get it installed of course.
    • dzhiurgis 5y ago
      I use $30 single pot induction stove everyday. I cook for 3 people. It’s placed on top of old school electric one with spiral elements since we live in a rental. Sometimes I use both, but it’s my go to.
      • jon-wood 5y ago
        I spent a year and a bit raging at the electric hob in my rented flat every time I cooked something. Replaced it with dual ring plug in induction hob and it’s better in every way, I’m actually able to cook food in a controlled manner again rather than endlessly pulling pans on and off the hob to compensate for a lack of power control.
    • fy20 5y ago
      In Europe you can get 4 burner stoves for under €250. IKEA sell a portable single burner for €40. Why are they so expensive in the US?
      • 5y ago
• esperent 5y ago
  So essentially you should ignore this article and go find real scientifically researched info on this issue elsewhere. Anyone have any good links? And sorry, I watched the first 30 seconds of that YouTube video and don't see any reason why I'd trust it any more than the times article.
  • Timpy 5y ago
    The host Rollie Williams has a graduate degree in climate change, maybe his style isn't for everyone but he's clearly knowledge and passionate about the subject.
    • wolverine876 5y ago
      The NY Times has and talks to many people who are as well or more qualified. Look at the sources in their articles - not just graduate degrees, but leading experts with decades of experience.
    • esperent 5y ago
      Well, clearly passionate anyway. Joking aside, I'm glad he is making these videos in that case. However, I'd say the target audience is teenagers so maybe it's not the best suited for this forum?
      • creatonez 5y ago
        > However, I'd say the target audience is teenagers There's this weird generational gap on HN where HNers seem to think the generation born in 2000 are teenagers. They're not. They're 22 year olds.
      • yohannparis 5y ago
        Damn, I didn't knew that at 36 years old I was still a teenagers!? I knew North-American loved to class people by age group, but this is becoming silly.
        • mbg721 5y ago
• stickfigure 5y ago
  "The dose makes the poison." We should not accept any health claims without quantification. "Objectively bad for your health" is not particularly relevant, even if I accept that at face value. For example, in right-hand-drive countries, making left turns is "objectively worse" for your health than making right turns.
  • alexchamberlain 5y ago
    Even with quantification, you may still want to do it anyway. If I remember the numbers correctly, eating a bacon sandwich everyday increases your risk of dying from heart disease by 25% - that takes the risk in the UK from 4/10000 to 5/10000. ^ Given the second number, I don’t worry about having the odd bacon sandwich. The exact example is irrelevant, rather everything in life has pros and cons, risks and rewards - you have to choose which one works for you. (I write this as an induction hob convert :) ) ^ This is based on a vague memory of a lecture on Risk Communication from Prof David Spiegelhalter around 10 years ago.
    • wolverine876 5y ago
      > If I remember the numbers correctly, eating a bacon sandwich everyday increases your risk of dying from heart disease by 25% - that takes the risk in the UK from 4/10000 to 5/10000. ^ Given the second number, I don’t worry about having the odd bacon sandwich. The way to stay alive is to reduce a little here and a little there (unless you work as an amatuer bomb technician). Heart disease is a leading cause of death; a 25% improvement would be great. There's not any real relationship between "a bacon sandwich everyday" and "the odd bacon sandwich"; where does anyone talk about the latter?
• DyslexicAtheist 5y ago
  > environment and is overall worse than induction would love to see an induction stove with a usable UI. everything I have used is designed by a person that never had to cook for more than 1. the automatic off during the slightest spill, and the impossibility to operate buttons with wet/greasy hands, has to be one of the biggest design mistakes in the history of engineering. my idea of a great time is to invite this engineer to cook with me a 4 course dinner for 8, where everything is timing crucial, and I get to scream at them like Gordon Ramsey the minute the stove switches off and they lost momentum with the heat but can't operate the button because "wet fingers". the problem isn't induction and consumers cooking with gas, but that we have a culture operating on "ownership and exploitation" of the environment.
  • caslon 5y ago
    What kind of induction stove do you have? Mine just has knobs. I push down and turn them clockwise, physically, and it heats up. I push down and turn them counter-clockwise, it lessens the heat, or turns it off. It's the same as the gas stoves of my childhood; I'm not sure how it could be simpler. It even has the icons indicating which knob is for which burner. Is your stove postmodern?
    • sirwhinesalot 5y ago
      Most induction stoves have touch based inputs. They're awful. I used to have one of those, now I have one with knobs. Couldn't be happier about the change.
  • donw 5y ago
    God, this. I like induction stoves. Easier to clean, and do 90% of what I need doing in a kitchen. Not having to run gas lines is a plus, and for the other 10%, I'm probably working on a grill or using a dedicated burner anyway. But the UIs are awful. Stop turning yourself off. Yes, I do intend to cook the thing I put on you for six hours. Just fucking do it. Give me a knob. Gas stoves use knobs for good reasons. You don't need to invent new UX, just give me a motherfucking knob. A knob without complicated family issues is fine as well. My stove does not need Bluetooth or WiFi. It's a stove. I expect it to work with minor maintenance for 40+ years. Protocols are going to change a lot between here and there. I am not installing your app. Not today, not tomorrow, not ever. Baphomet will call up and tell me he got right with Jesus before I install your app. There has to be a market for people that want appliances that just... work. Addendum: there are a few induction stoves with knobs, but they are definitely the exception, rather than the rule: - https://www.bluestarcooking.com/cooking/cooktops/36-turn-induction-cooktop/ https://www.bluestarcooking.com/cooking/cooktops/36-turn-ind... - https://performwireless.com/7-best-induction-cooktops-with-knobs/ https://performwireless.com/7-best-induction-cooktops-with-k... (half of these are not full-size built-ins)
• Ntrails 5y ago
  > is overall worse than induction when it comes to the cooking experience in just about all ways. The way you would know this to be true is when professional kitchens are defaulting to induction instead of gas. (I think this has started to happen in a few high end places, which is exciting) I am putting in a new kitchen soon and it will have a gas hob + electric oven because I love cooking and gas is my default. Every electric hob I have ever used has been garbage, and I am not dropping 2 grand to try induction and maybe discover what sound like familiar issues (ha, I am turning myself off now). Gas always just works. Apply steady heat - perfect cooking experience. Maybe next time.
  • jstummbillig 5y ago
    > The way you would know this to be true is when professional kitchens are defaulting to induction instead of gas. That is not how you would know that. There are plenty of industries where people stick to the "tried and true" (for various reasons, some of which might even be reasonable) and chose to neglect efficiency gains or long term health of either their employees or customers.
    • Ntrails 5y ago
      I think I was unclear. If A then B true was my meaning, not If and only If A then B true Hence highlighting that we have seen some of this already! Side note. The high end ones move first as they discover something better. See the proliferation of technological machines in modern professional kitchens. But the trend gets set and the upper mid range starts to follow and then it will be what chefs want to use because it is best.
    • wolverine876 5y ago
      Hard to think of an industry where people use legacy technology instead of tearing it all out and replacing it with the newest thing.
  • Kliment 5y ago
    Get a standalone induction plate. They're cheap and portable and they let you try it out without a huge expense. I do 90% of all my cooking on a single induction plate I paid ~$60 for. Non-induction electric hobs are trash, and induction is much closer to gas, but more controllable, less messy, and less dangerous. That said, I would strongly recommend against a builtin induction hob. They're expensive as fuck, and eat lots of counter space. The standalone induction plates are amazing, much nicer to work with, and cheaper, and you can put them away when you need the extra space. Restaurant supply shops have standalone induction plates for ~3x the cost of the consumer ones which are phenomenally good, that's what the higher end new kitchens are going for.
• ekianjo 5y ago
  > Before anyone reads this and decides, "oh ya the NYT is lying to me and gas is fine", it's not. Gas in your home is objectively bad for your health, there is no such thing as "objectively bad". Risk is always measured in relative amounts vs something else.
  • Zenbit_UX 5y ago
    What a dumb thing to say. Your comment was objectively bad.
• joshuajill 5y ago
  Gas is the worst for air quality, in particular with certain types of cooking and the self cleaning cycle some have. But people with electric cooking devices can still have high pollutant levels without proper ventilation. https://ww2.arb.ca.gov/resources/documents/residential-cooking-exposure-study-finds-unhealthful-levels https://ww2.arb.ca.gov/resources/documents/residential-cooki...
• snowwrestler 5y ago
  I have had asthma since I was a toddler. I see a top-rated immunologist 3 times a year. Not once have they ever asked what kind of stove I have. When I asked about it recently, they laughed about it.
  • Zenbit_UX 5y ago
    So out of curiosity, did you grow up in a home with a gas stove?
• wolverine876 5y ago
  > It might not be as bad as living with a smoker (as the NYT asserted) They actually said, “For children who live in a home with a gas stove, the increased risk of asthma is on par with living in a home with a smoker,” she said.
• david38 5y ago
  Eh. Gas is not “objectively bad” unless you want to also say cars are “objectively bad”. How many people die every year from from short or long term effects of gas stoves? Compare that to cars. Every kitchen I’ve ever been in with a gas stove has some sort of ventilation. Open window, fan, hood, etc. Same for the environment. Let’s look at older style electric coil resistant heat elements. Largely inefficient and the power generated how? This is mostly propaganda. The