4 ms·
Something controls the software that would ask for instructions, and that could be hacked. I'd also suggest a default of auto-reject after a minute, not auto-ac
by Communitivity 5y ago
Something controls the software that would ask for instructions, and that could be hacked. I'd also suggest a default of auto-reject after a minute, not auto-accept.
When people think about attack surfaces in devices they often think about the things making repeated connections out. The thing is, every piece of reachable mutable code in the device is an attack surface, not just the software making connections.
You may have heard of ATM car collectors that attach to real ATMs, or people that have hacked an ATM to collect cards. Your smart car connects to a number of systems throughout its life: your dealer's diagnostics, every time you charge, every time you play music through the bluetooth connection on your phone. Each one of these is a potential attack vector.
Let's say one of these things is using JAVA, and somehow does not have an updated log4j [1]. Now that thing can be used to compromise other subsystems of your car. And these attack vectors do not have the antivirus and other protections your desktop computer or laptop do.
As bizarre and backward as it sounds, I think the best bet is burned immutable firmware on a physical module that can be easily swapped out by an authorized dealer (or with a key of some sort to allow people to service their own cars). This would reduce the vulnerability quite a bit, though not eliminate it. It also would eliminate over the air firmware updates, which are insane in my opinion. It's kind of how if you want a more secure computer you burn a live CD with a minimal hardened distro of linux, rip out the hard drive, make sure you have a fast CD, and have the computer boot to CD. This is part of what I used to do for a DMZ PC. There's always a risk your firmware will be hacked, but that is harder, and can be checked on startup depending on what you have on the system [2].
[1] https://www.trendmicro.com/en_us/research/21/l/examining-log4j-vulnerabilities-in-connected-cars.html https://www.trendmicro.com/en_us/research/21/l/examining-log...
[2] https://crypto.stackexchange.com/questions/59965/tpm-and-remote-attestation https://crypto.stackexchange.com/questions/59965/tpm-and-rem...
- Dylan16807 5y ago> I'd also suggest a default of auto-reject after a minute, not auto-accept. You're suggesting that if a self-driving car has a feature to remotely summon it, such a feature should need a passenger inside to click "accept"?
- salawat 5y agoYes. Especially if it's being summoned for some sort of service. I'd argue no vehicle should be on the road sans occupant to be honest. What? You think that it's totally okay to have a vehicle titled to you auto -accept a request that could be coming from any moron out there? How many levels of optimism are you on?
- Dylan16807 5y ago> I'd argue no vehicle should be on the road sans occupant to be honest. So someone napping in the passenger seat is fine, but empty isn't? Why? > Especially if it's being summoned for some sort of service. Especially? When it's doing some sort of service is when it's the most ridiculous to have someone hanging around doing nothing. If you don't want a summon button, just say so. Don't say summon should need a passenger. > You think that it's totally okay to have a vehicle titled to you auto -accept a request that could be coming from any moron out there? I didn't say that. I don't think even a ride share would go to anyone, but I wasn't even suggesting that, I was talking about any kind of summon at all, so by default that would be the owner.