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> leetcode Please just don't. You're better than that. Here's a list of companies who don't participate in this bullshit: https://github.com/poteto/hiring-with

> leetcode Please just don't. You're better than that. Here's a list of companies who don't participate in this bullshit: https://github.com/poteto/hiring-without-whiteboards https://github.com/poteto/hiring-without-whiteboards At my current gig I was hired at staff level in Nov. 190k (please, let's normalize sharing salaries) . I could do better, but I am passionate about my job for the first time in 10 years. How much do you value happiness? You're not an imposter. Especially as an HN reader (you're actually interested in your job).

threeturn 5y ago
I tend to agree leetcode is not always reflecting fundamental skills. Some people just freeze even if they are good software engineers. I'm wondering how to assess the ability to write some code and decent problem-solving? What is your approach?
ozzythecat 5y ago
The leetcode companies will pay $500K+ easy for a staff level engineer. A Senior engineer will easily pull $400K. That’s over a 100% increase from your current rate. I’d personally recommend practicing leet code, if that’s the thing holding you back… maybe 1 problem a day. By the time you actually decide to change companies, you wont be interview prepping just before an interview.
- zamalek 5y ago
  > 500k+ Oh yes, I know, and I am envious. My soul and mental health is worth more. Solving problems makes me feel alive. Parroting answers does not. I was somewhat headhunted by UiPath. Huge money. Crazy salary. First round I had whiteboard problems with the most awesome engineer that there is. Absolutely aced that, the engineer missed a meeting over shooting shit about algorithms. Second and third leetcodes were engineers that were clearly running off known solutions, and couldn't rapport over best or alternative solutions. I absolutely made a fool of myself, and I'm really good at that stuff. Leetcode encourages parrots, and I need to believe that I'm better than that. Arriving at the thesis of a doctorate of a tenured scholar in the heat of a 1.5hr interview is hardly a representation of how valuable an engineer is. I am so glad I failed. I was kicking myself at the time for tolerating the bullshit (I had a gun/green card issues at my back), I knew that I should have walked away.
  - bpodgursky 5y ago
    This feels really confused. You know the leetcode answers are just during the interview, right? Once you get the job, it's a job that involves solving real problems.
    - noodle 5y ago
      What's the point of interviewing someone if it has nothing to do with the job they're actually about to be hired for? That feels really confused to me.
      - bpodgursky 5y ago
        It's a proxy for IQ + willingness to grind to learn a new skill, and those two attributes are highly cross-functional in an environment where job requirements frequently change.
      - wodenokoto 5y ago
        > What's the point of interviewing someone if it has nothing to do with the job Sounds like there are about 2-300,000 points …
    - zamalek 5y ago
      So you're telling me that an interview process that filters for rote knowledge yields candidates who who are, in general, not representative of that process?
      - salmonlogs 5y ago
        I've always thought of work as a game. How do I uncover the rules to maximise earnings within boundaries that provide suitable enjoyment and acceptable levels of stress. Spending a few months doing some leetcode revision to pass some interviews that could personally yields me hundreds of thousands, potentially millions, of dollars, is a very acceptable trade-off. Many people accept that because the risk/effort/reward ratio is very worthwhile. I've worked in two FAANG companies and the level of talent and skills is phenomenal, an order of magnitude over anywhere else I've ever worked. They all played the game, and continue to play the game, and receive the rewards for doing so. Choosing not to participate because you dislike the process isn't going to change the hiring process.
jnwatson 5y ago
You're literally asking this person to forgo potentially an extra quarter million dollars a year to avoid a couple dozen hours of study.

threeturn 5y ago

I tend to agree leetcode is not always reflecting fundamental skills. Some people just freeze even if they are good software engineers. I'm wondering how to assess the ability to write some code and decent problem-solving? What is your approach?

ozzythecat 5y ago

The leetcode companies will pay $500K+ easy for a staff level engineer. A Senior engineer will easily pull $400K. That’s over a 100% increase from your current rate. I’d personally recommend practicing leet code, if that’s the thing holding you back… maybe 1 problem a day. By the time you actually decide to change companies, you wont be interview prepping just before an interview.

zamalek 5y ago
> 500k+ Oh yes, I know, and I am envious. My soul and mental health is worth more. Solving problems makes me feel alive. Parroting answers does not. I was somewhat headhunted by UiPath. Huge money. Crazy salary. First round I had whiteboard problems with the most awesome engineer that there is. Absolutely aced that, the engineer missed a meeting over shooting shit about algorithms. Second and third leetcodes were engineers that were clearly running off known solutions, and couldn't rapport over best or alternative solutions. I absolutely made a fool of myself, and I'm really good at that stuff. Leetcode encourages parrots, and I need to believe that I'm better than that. Arriving at the thesis of a doctorate of a tenured scholar in the heat of a 1.5hr interview is hardly a representation of how valuable an engineer is. I am so glad I failed. I was kicking myself at the time for tolerating the bullshit (I had a gun/green card issues at my back), I knew that I should have walked away.
- bpodgursky 5y ago
  This feels really confused. You know the leetcode answers are just during the interview, right? Once you get the job, it's a job that involves solving real problems.
  - noodle 5y ago
    What's the point of interviewing someone if it has nothing to do with the job they're actually about to be hired for? That feels really confused to me.
    - bpodgursky 5y ago
      It's a proxy for IQ + willingness to grind to learn a new skill, and those two attributes are highly cross-functional in an environment where job requirements frequently change.
    - wodenokoto 5y ago
      > What's the point of interviewing someone if it has nothing to do with the job Sounds like there are about 2-300,000 points …
  - zamalek 5y ago
    So you're telling me that an interview process that filters for rote knowledge yields candidates who who are, in general, not representative of that process?
    - salmonlogs 5y ago
      I've always thought of work as a game. How do I uncover the rules to maximise earnings within boundaries that provide suitable enjoyment and acceptable levels of stress. Spending a few months doing some leetcode revision to pass some interviews that could personally yields me hundreds of thousands, potentially millions, of dollars, is a very acceptable trade-off. Many people accept that because the risk/effort/reward ratio is very worthwhile. I've worked in two FAANG companies and the level of talent and skills is phenomenal, an order of magnitude over anywhere else I've ever worked. They all played the game, and continue to play the game, and receive the rewards for doing so. Choosing not to participate because you dislike the process isn't going to change the hiring process.

jnwatson 5y ago

You're literally asking this person to forgo potentially an extra quarter million dollars a year to avoid a couple dozen hours of study.