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Likewise, it is easy to criticize coal, natural gas and nuclear for their shortcomings. But, its hard to create an alternative electricity generation/storage th

Likewise, it is easy to criticize coal, natural gas and nuclear for their shortcomings. But, its hard to create an alternative electricity generation/storage that can support constant base load and can ramp up in minutes to deal with additional load. Talk is easy, action is hard

xiphias2 5y ago
The problem with coal is that there’s an invisible CO2 quota that if we as a species overstep it will kill more people than help. If it was me, I would try to get rid all taxes, and tax imports and local goods based on average world CO2 output compared to the country that I’m in. As people don’t generally think long term, this policy is unpopular, so it won’t get implemented.
- catlikesshrimp 5y ago
  <<But, its hard to create an alternative electricity generation/storage that can support constant base load and can ramp up in minutes to deal with additional load. Talk is easy, action is hard>>
  - krageon 5y ago
    The fact of the matter is that it's not hard to do at all, it's just expensive, unpopular or only practical with sustained public support. Because they are human problems, talking about technical solutions is entirely the wrong approach.
asdfasgasdgasdg 5y ago
> But, its hard to create an alternative electricity generation/storage that can support constant base load and can ramp up in minutes to deal with additional load. We are actually doing that, though. Across the globe, the fraction of energy generated by non-renewables has been falling consistently for more than a decade. We went from being less than 5% solar + wind a decade ago to more than 10% now, and the trend is accelerating. By 2026 we're expected to be nearing 20% of all power generation renewable. Things aren't going fast, but infrastructure doesn't go fast, and no proponent of renewable energy expected it to. I think this is in no way comparable to the symbolic learning thing where there is no sign of relative progress.
- Georgelemental 5y ago
  And there have already been hiccups in reliability from some of that renewable ramp-up. Solar and wind can't guarantee output, and the storage technology just doesn't exist yet, so for now there is a hard cap on how much more % solar/wind we can go without serious reliability issues.
  - asdfasgasdgasdg 5y ago
    I'm not aware of such hiccoughs. Could you please provide some examples that are specifically traceable to renewables? I mean excluding cases of general underprovisioning where renewables happen to be part of the energy mix -- this has been happening since before renewables were big and I reckon it will keep happening. As far as the hard cap you mentioned, I think there's no danger of us hitting that cap in the next decade or so. Later on, maybe. Battery technology is also improving rapidly, so perhaps it will never be a true limiting factor.
    - erosenbe0 5y ago
      There is no hard cap because you can always grow and burn ethanol. Brazil does it at scale.
      - cik2e 5y ago
        Which leads to deforestation, the depletion of ground water supplies and still produces CO2 on both then front end and back end. Renewables aren't interesting just because they are renewable. We're not going to run out of fossils today so burning something else instead makes no sense. Especially when it becomes a form of geewnwashing to cover for a lack of progress in wind and solar.
  - 7952 5y ago
    In the UK there is around 1.4 GW installed battery storage capacity and a further 20GW+ in the pipeline. The technology does exist and is mass producible and scaleable. Hiccups in supply are usually more complex than just blaming a single source. It is the responsibility of the grid to maintain supply across different types of generator.
raverbashing 5y ago
Hydro / Pumped-hydro

xiphias2 5y ago

The problem with coal is that there’s an invisible CO2 quota that if we as a species overstep it will kill more people than help. If it was me, I would try to get rid all taxes, and tax imports and local goods based on average world CO2 output compared to the country that I’m in. As people don’t generally think long term, this policy is unpopular, so it won’t get implemented.

catlikesshrimp 5y ago
<<But, its hard to create an alternative electricity generation/storage that can support constant base load and can ramp up in minutes to deal with additional load. Talk is easy, action is hard>>
- krageon 5y ago
  The fact of the matter is that it's not hard to do at all, it's just expensive, unpopular or only practical with sustained public support. Because they are human problems, talking about technical solutions is entirely the wrong approach.

asdfasgasdgasdg 5y ago

> But, its hard to create an alternative electricity generation/storage that can support constant base load and can ramp up in minutes to deal with additional load. We are actually doing that, though. Across the globe, the fraction of energy generated by non-renewables has been falling consistently for more than a decade. We went from being less than 5% solar + wind a decade ago to more than 10% now, and the trend is accelerating. By 2026 we're expected to be nearing 20% of all power generation renewable. Things aren't going fast, but infrastructure doesn't go fast, and no proponent of renewable energy expected it to. I think this is in no way comparable to the symbolic learning thing where there is no sign of relative progress.

Georgelemental 5y ago
And there have already been hiccups in reliability from some of that renewable ramp-up. Solar and wind can't guarantee output, and the storage technology just doesn't exist yet, so for now there is a hard cap on how much more % solar/wind we can go without serious reliability issues.
- asdfasgasdgasdg 5y ago
  I'm not aware of such hiccoughs. Could you please provide some examples that are specifically traceable to renewables? I mean excluding cases of general underprovisioning where renewables happen to be part of the energy mix -- this has been happening since before renewables were big and I reckon it will keep happening. As far as the hard cap you mentioned, I think there's no danger of us hitting that cap in the next decade or so. Later on, maybe. Battery technology is also improving rapidly, so perhaps it will never be a true limiting factor.
  - erosenbe0 5y ago
    There is no hard cap because you can always grow and burn ethanol. Brazil does it at scale.
    - cik2e 5y ago
      Which leads to deforestation, the depletion of ground water supplies and still produces CO2 on both then front end and back end. Renewables aren't interesting just because they are renewable. We're not going to run out of fossils today so burning something else instead makes no sense. Especially when it becomes a form of geewnwashing to cover for a lack of progress in wind and solar.
- 7952 5y ago
  In the UK there is around 1.4 GW installed battery storage capacity and a further 20GW+ in the pipeline. The technology does exist and is mass producible and scaleable. Hiccups in supply are usually more complex than just blaming a single source. It is the responsibility of the grid to maintain supply across different types of generator.

raverbashing 5y ago

Hydro / Pumped-hydro