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I don't engage on Twitter out of fear. I sometimes see posts that I like and want to retweet but I don't because it means I'm endorsing everything the author h
by typeofhuman 5y ago
I don't engage on Twitter out of fear.
I sometimes see posts that I like and want to retweet but I don't because it means I'm endorsing everything the author has ever said or ever will say. It's not worth the risk.
People in my demographic face significant exposure to "cancelling" or ambushing for wrongthink. So it's best for me to avoid it entirely.
- happytoexplain 5y ago>People in my demographic face significant exposure to "cancelling" or ambushing for wrongthink. I don't use Twitter or pretty much say anything publicly for the same reason, but note that this is definitely a risk for people of all demographics.
- RobertRoberts 5y agoIt is far more risk for some than others. If you have a minority viewpoint, you get attacked far more easily.
- Ekaros 5y agoI would even say viewpoint of not the vocal minority. That is even near majority viewpoint, but if it is one not popular on twitter it is risky...
- aksss 5y agoIsn't the whole dynamic of twitter that it can make a highly vocal minority viewpoint seem like an oppressive majority viewpoint, where reality is that it's like a heckler's veto on amphetamines with a megaphone?
- Sebb767 5y ago> but if it is one not popular on twitter it is risky... Right now or at any point in the future. People have been canceled for things they said many years and opinion changes ago.
- ryandrake 5y agoThat’s the minefield of posting online. People measure your comments from 20 years ago with today’s sensitivity yardstick. I know I made wisecrack jokes decades ago that would get me fired today. Who knows whether some innocuous thing you say today will be horrendously taboo 20 years from now?
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- analyst74 5y agoTotally agree, being attacked for your viewpoint used to be just a problem for minority viewpoints/identities. But now even those who were previously safe are seeing increasing risk in backlashes. We have gone from silencing the minority to silencing the majority, this is terrible, but silver lining is that now maybe more people are invested in solving the problem.
- whathappenedto 5y agoMaybe instead of demographic, it's about people whose public image is part of their job. Like startup executives, academics, athletes, politicians (even "low-level" politicians like city councilman), product managers, or venture capitalists. That's a lot of people who are juicier targets than someone earlier in their career, like a student, an associate, or entry-level software developer.
- jamesfe 5y agoThis exactly. I once tried the twitter game, I thought it was important to have a big following or say clever things, whatever. I was lightly burned by a tweet (of my own authoring) once, and I thought "I make $XYZ per year, twitter pays me nothing, this joke tweet caused me a lot of stress, the odds that being on twitter will get me cancelled will cost me $XYZ are non-zero and I don't control them" Then I deleted all my tweets and my twitter account (8 years ago) and life has been really nice without it!
- vasco 5y agoExact same story except recently I created an empty account with private lists that I follow (so not even the people I "follow" is public), and I can still keep up with some topics from a source of information that generally is on the bleeding edge. Usually I find things in twitter / discord first, then they hit Reddit, then mainstream media. If you only follow reddit you have a slight delay currently, and for some of my interests, fresh information is helpful.
- alphabetting 5y agoThis is the way
- tayo42 5y agoIt's really easy to not be "canceled", just be a good person. What genuinely OK opinion are people being canceled for?
- theshrike79 5y agoPeople change. Your "edgy" tweets and shitty jokes from when you were young and stupid can still haunt you in your adult life. Case in point: James Gunn ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Gunn#Firing_from_Disney_and_reinstatement https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Gunn#Firing_from_Disney_... ) This is why I rarely interact on Twitter and I have a script that deletes all my tweets that are over X days old. If I say something truely insightful, I'll just make a blog post out of it.
- tstrimple 5y ago> "Firing from Disney *and reinstatement*" Yep, he's super cancelled. Great example.
- thinkingemote 5y agoDefine "good" and "ok" first. A good person who doesn't use Twitter (someone who might fix cars, or works on a fishing vessel for example) who is having this little discussion about what is "good" and "ok" might very easily use the wrong words and offend someone.
- tayo42 5y agoReally? This is easy, don't hurt other people.
- panzagl 5y agoYou're literally talking down to someone right now- that's not hurting other people?
- voakbasda 5y agoThat’s not possible. People take offense at everything. Or they will tomorrow. That’s the real problem: the standards of “good” and “decent” shift from time to time. What is fine today may get you canceled tomorrow. Thus, it is not safe to put your opinions out there in any form that could come back to bite you. If you want to take that risk, fine. But do not pretend that it is safe.
- bob1029 5y agoI don't think this is a healthy way to live. There was another conversation thread started about an hour ago that dives into this really well: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30602611 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30602611 I would reiterate my comment on that thread, verbatim: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30603008 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30603008
- blowski 5y agoOn the contrary, this seems to me a very healthy way to live. Until the last 15 years, very few people had their views expressed beyond a narrow circle. Standing on a public stage and shouting your every thought would have seemed crazy.
- cpach 5y agoWithout hesitation I dare say there is prior art in this question. I’m thinking of the Speakers’ Corner in Hyde Park. https://www.bbc.com/news/in-pictures-32703071 https://www.bbc.com/news/in-pictures-32703071
- blowski 5y agoI don't think Speakers' Corner is remotely comparable to how social media works today. Very few people spoke there, and very little of what they said was distributed beyond Hyde Park or recorded for posterity. I'm lucky enough to have seen a couple of people speak there, and they were both rather... eccentric. And even they didn't stand there all day, every day giving their opinions on everything that happened.
- cpach 5y agoI think that’s great. I don’t believe in living in fear of how people might react. Of course I choose my battles; and I don’t walk up to strangers and tell them their baby is ugly. But that’s not being suppressed, IMHO. And I don’t keep narrow-minded people among my close friends.
- fantod 5y ago
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- jquery 5y agoYou’re getting cancelled for your views? Which views are those, exactly?
- colordrops 5y agoSupporting free speech and support equal hiring practices will get you cancelled these days, or at least bucketed with right wing extremists.
- ggm 5y agoor supporting radical feminism. or socialism. it's easy to be in an out-group very quickly
- typeofhuman 5y agoThe point I was making was the risk exists. Consider the scenario: Author says something interesting; I retweet; Author later says something awful which I don't even know about; My retweet is still present and can make me guilty by association. This is very common on Twitter. It's not a place I can haphazardly navigate. I can't stay up to date on the latest outrage or who has fallen from glory.
- themaninthedark 5y ago“If you give me six lines written by the hand of the most honest of men, I will find something in them which will hang him.” - Cardinal Armand Jean du Plessis It doesn't matter what their views are. If someone decides they don't like them and that person have enough followers, they will find something.
- TechBro8615 5y agoYour comment implies that surely any cancellation of someone for their views must be justifiable. That's an insane premise, but even if we presume it to be true, it still doesn't cover the case of _future_ cancellation when someone finds your tweets 10 years later and decides they aged like milk. There are many comments I would have made 5-10 years ago, that I wouldn't make today. Sure, that's mostly due to maturity, but I've also adjusted my self-filter to account for a changing environment and audience. At this point, I write all political comments under pseudonyms. It's not because I'm scared of getting cancelled — on the contrary, I wish I could argue my positions from my real name. But there is a lot of risk, for little benefit – I'm not a "journalist" or blogger or anyone with a career that depends on my political viewpoints. So why bother? In general, online political comments gain me nothing, and there is no way to predict how those comments might look in a week, month, or even years from now. I do still write plenty of them, under pseudonyms (like this one), but it's more of a hobby to practice my writing. But I'm also not ashamed of anything I've written under any of the accounts – I would gladly defend all my opinions in person (to those close to me, who already know my feelings, and – btw, because they're sane – have never "cancelled" me). Who knows, maybe one day I'll even tweet my pseudonym usernames so I can show everyone how right I was five years ago.
- massysett 5y agoI’m so afraid of Twitter that I even created a distinct account with a default username—“user12345” or something of that nature. My old account had my photo and maybe my name. I can’t even risk having people see who I follow, and on Twitter who you follow is public.
- shadowgovt 5y agoThe golden rule of using Twitter is: everything said is said to everyone, in public. Turns out, there's a lot of stuff people just probably shouldn't broadcast.
- mattgreenrocks 5y agoTwitter is a massively multiplayer video game that is culturally overvalued and entrenched because journalism and other influential fields got sucked in. It is absolutely insane that it is taken so seriously. It's also super weird that everyone is so addicted to this game they play it out in public. To illustrate this: imagine your ideal day. It could be on vacation, or hanging out at home, anywhere really. The key: imagine you are happy, or at least content. Now, do your imaginings ever have you reading angry tweets by people you hardly know for longer than you'd like? I'd guess not.
- MattGaiser 5y agoI saw a post once for a journalism job with local media here. 4-6 articles a day. Not sure how you could do that job without Twitter.
- Ekaros 5y agoSing up for all the companies that provide press releases? Not sure if that is enough though...
- saiya-jin 5y agoNever joined the game, never will, see absolutely 0 reason. I don't care what he and she and he said, I guess you can say I am way more impressed by deeds than endless blabbing. Anytime I open it due to being embedded in news articles and wanting to see detailed photo being shown, I see basically news/youtube/whatever shallow and pathetic comment section. Echo chambers. Weird dynamics which don't happen in real life. Why would you do this to yourself? I mean if you are a balanced adult who knows what they want in life and are not affected by massive mood swings and insecurities for whatever reason. It is of course not black and white, it seems that ie right now Ukrainian defenders have a very good platform to inform whole world, no need to have BBC/CNN guys embedded in the heart of bombed city. That's cool and all. I just really don't like the rest of the whole society evolved around it.
- mattgreenrocks 5y ago
- TheSpiceIsLife 5y agoIs it accurate to label that fear, or simply a modicome of intelligence.
- colechristensen 5y agoI post publicly on forums with my real name and don’t endorse everything I have said. Just evict such absolutist moral nonsense people from your life and don’t allow them to control you. When you see them do it to others, block them. It’s exactly the same thing as when it was a certain sort of church people controlling much of society with fear of “canceling” which was just done by different people with different means in the past, fundamentally nothing changed when people left religion because they thought religion was the source of this kind of toxicity.
- scintill76 5y agoWhen you get “canceled”, it doesn’t matter who you’ve personally “evicted” or not. If people with power over you either agree with the absolutists or are afraid of offending them, you’re going to have a bad time.
- KerrAvon 5y agoI think you're failing to account for the specifically viral nature of Twitter. Even a forum like reddit is a relatively isolated space for opprobrium by comparison.
- Clubber 5y ago>I don't engage on Twitter out of fear. It seems in their effort to ban people for wrong think, they banned the wrong group. They should have been banning the cancellers. "I don't engage on Twitter out of fear," is not a good sign for retention or growth numbers. Twitter seems to be killing itself by allowing this cancer to grow. Have you ever been on a pretty great message board / forum and a bunch of spittle people join and makes the board suck to converse on? Eventually that board is nothing but spittle people, then the board dies. Twitters seems like it is going this way. FWIW, I cancelled all my social media accounts after the Snowden revelations in 2013. I'm just an outside observer, but I'm certainly glad I'm not inside.
- echelon 5y ago> I don't engage on Twitter out of fear. > it means I'm endorsing everything the author has ever said or ever will say. > People in my demographic face significant exposure to "cancelling" or ambushing for wrongthink. I totally get that this is the zeitgeist now (and I'm starting to behave this way now on HN since I don't really do other social media), but this is a horrible place we've worked ourselves into. People taking pop shots and then getting algorithmically amplified has reduced the surface area for having safe dialogue and has led to increasing tensions and polarization. In an ideal world, people talk about and discuss things they disagree about frequently and are at least respectful in dealing with those they don't see eye to eye with. We all have a different frame of reference, and that's not something to fight against. I think the pandemic increased stresses for a lot of people (myself included), but these trends really took hold with algorithmic amplification. It isn't just a passing fad, sadly. And it isn't just rooted in just the technology. There are real needs and causes for social angst that need to be met. Imagine if we also amplified inspiring and hopeful things. Nourished ourselves with stories of hope and overcoming difficulties. Science and technology, opportunity, a look to the future. (Especially for kids!) I know life isn't all sunshine and roses, but this would give us balance and perspective and wouldn't chip away at a person's inner drive and passion by replacing it with skepticism and dissatisfaction. I think we can swing back. People are noticing this and feeling displeasure.
- paulpauper 5y agoUnless u have a lot of followers, there is a 99.9% chance no one will even see your tweet. Almost all twitter engagement is just bot engagement. there are entire industries devoted to getting social media posts seen by humans. it isn't easy.
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- rvz 5y ago> So it's best for me to avoid it entirely. Good decision. To win the social media game it is to not play it at all.