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Author compares meditation to doing LSD, then states that doing LSD can be helpful but super hurtful to possibly schizophrenic people. Some part of me can't sto

by gleenn 5y ago

Author compares meditation to doing LSD, then states that doing LSD can be helpful but super hurtful to possibly schizophrenic people. Some part of me can't stop thinking that it's nuts to tell people to not sit quietly and try and clear your mind because it might trigger schizophrenia.

nerdponx 5y ago
A lot of people here seem to be assuming that "meditation" has to be "intense Buddhist practices deliberately designed to destroy your sense of self." Maybe that's the problem? People read about "meditation" and don't realize what they're getting into? I don't get it.
- zozbot234 5y ago
  I'm pretty sure that "destroy your sense of self" is an anti-pattern, even in Buddhist practices. The "dark night" arises out of the very fear and despair that your sense of self could somehow be broken or destroyed, but the goal is to realize that your "senses" are all there, and that "awakening" is about giving yourself the choice of abandoning a flawed understanding of what those weird "senses" are all about. I respect the fact that most people by far will want to stay the f--- away from the "dark night"; it should only be explored by those who have the prereqs and the ethical maturity and wisdom to get past it smoothly. But the idea that the whole thing must be unreservedly bad or "destructive" is just too limiting.
labrador 5y ago
It's not nuts, it's Christian. The author states he is a Christian. Some Christian sects think that Yoga and meditation are rituals that open up the dark side. I hear all the time how meditation lets the demons in. 6 Reasons to Reject Eastern Meditation and Yoga https://rosilindjukic.com/eastern-meditation-differs-biblical-meditation/ https://rosilindjukic.com/eastern-meditation-differs-biblica... I'm bipolar and I meditate - I sit queitly, focus on my breath and try to let my thoughts quiet down. It's a way of relaxing. The end goal is to be at peace in the moment, not some crazy drug-like experience
- 1_player 5y ago
  I don't know. They're Christian but their argument is more nuanced than just thinking meditation is opening up to the dark side. I think it's worth talking about, especially given the experiences shared by other posters in the comments.
  - krageon 5y ago
    > their argument is more nuanced than just thinking meditation is opening up to the dark side Is it? Viewed through that lens, it doesn't seem like there is a lot of nuance.
    - 1_player 5y ago
      The point I'm making is I'm not sure they're viewing it through that lens, but rather GP is dismissing the article because the author is Christian and _some_ of them are known to be against meditation. It does not segue that all Christians are against it. GP seems to be the biased one here with a preconceived opinion.
      - krageon 5y ago
        I'm not unsympathetic with that stance, as every Christian I've ever met is fast to claim "there are also tolerant ones" - the majority are simply not. That's what a reputation does: It informs someone about what to expect. In this case it colours what is also said, both parties need to acknowledge this.
      - labrador 5y ago
        My interpretation is that the author is Christian (he says this) and he is against meditation for reasons commonly given by many Christians to discourage people from meditating
        1_player 5y ago
        > he is against meditation for reasons Again, this is _your_ interpretation. They only said they're Christian, and you've decided this must be the reason they're against, and their opinion is worthless. You're just colouring their opinion with YOUR preconceptions. Their opinion matches my experience, and other commenters, and I'm not Christian at all. Why are you taking it so personally? It's an intellectually stimulating topic, you're free to disagree without dismissing the person based on their religion.

by gleenn 5y ago

nerdponx 5y ago

A lot of people here seem to be assuming that "meditation" has to be "intense Buddhist practices deliberately designed to destroy your sense of self." Maybe that's the problem? People read about "meditation" and don't realize what they're getting into? I don't get it.

zozbot234 5y ago
I'm pretty sure that "destroy your sense of self" is an anti-pattern, even in Buddhist practices. The "dark night" arises out of the very fear and despair that your sense of self could somehow be broken or destroyed, but the goal is to realize that your "senses" are all there, and that "awakening" is about giving yourself the choice of abandoning a flawed understanding of what those weird "senses" are all about. I respect the fact that most people by far will want to stay the f--- away from the "dark night"; it should only be explored by those who have the prereqs and the ethical maturity and wisdom to get past it smoothly. But the idea that the whole thing must be unreservedly bad or "destructive" is just too limiting.

labrador 5y ago

It's not nuts, it's Christian. The author states he is a Christian. Some Christian sects think that Yoga and meditation are rituals that open up the dark side. I hear all the time how meditation lets the demons in. 6 Reasons to Reject Eastern Meditation and Yoga https://rosilindjukic.com/eastern-meditation-differs-biblical-meditation/ https://rosilindjukic.com/eastern-meditation-differs-biblica... I'm bipolar and I meditate - I sit queitly, focus on my breath and try to let my thoughts quiet down. It's a way of relaxing. The end goal is to be at peace in the moment, not some crazy drug-like experience

1_player 5y ago
I don't know. They're Christian but their argument is more nuanced than just thinking meditation is opening up to the dark side. I think it's worth talking about, especially given the experiences shared by other posters in the comments.
- krageon 5y ago
  > their argument is more nuanced than just thinking meditation is opening up to the dark side Is it? Viewed through that lens, it doesn't seem like there is a lot of nuance.
  - 1_player 5y ago
    The point I'm making is I'm not sure they're viewing it through that lens, but rather GP is dismissing the article because the author is Christian and _some_ of them are known to be against meditation. It does not segue that all Christians are against it. GP seems to be the biased one here with a preconceived opinion.
    - krageon 5y ago
      I'm not unsympathetic with that stance, as every Christian I've ever met is fast to claim "there are also tolerant ones" - the majority are simply not. That's what a reputation does: It informs someone about what to expect. In this case it colours what is also said, both parties need to acknowledge this.
    - labrador 5y ago
      My interpretation is that the author is Christian (he says this) and he is against meditation for reasons commonly given by many Christians to discourage people from meditating
      - 1_player 5y ago
        > he is against meditation for reasons Again, this is _your_ interpretation. They only said they're Christian, and you've decided this must be the reason they're against, and their opinion is worthless. You're just colouring their opinion with YOUR preconceptions. Their opinion matches my experience, and other commenters, and I'm not Christian at all. Why are you taking it so personally? It's an intellectually stimulating topic, you're free to disagree without dismissing the person based on their religion.