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I think that their leaders should sit down and negotiate, rather than stick weapons in the hands of ordinary people and deter Russia with the threat of causing
by marcus_cemes 5y ago
I think that their leaders should sit down and negotiate, rather than stick weapons in the hands of ordinary people and deter Russia with the threat of causing genocide. Nobody wins in that scenario, unless Russia backs down which seems unlikely at this point in time. Dialogue is the way forward, not improvised video game weapons.
- XorNot 5y agoNegotiate what exactly? It's a war of aggression.
- s1artibartfast 5y agoPutin articulated his ultimatums for Kyiv: Recognize Crimea as Russian - Rejection of NATO accession - No weapons supplies from the West - LNR and DNR gain territory that the regions had pre 2014
- XorNot 5y agoOr, and this might be a wild idea, Russia could mind it's own god damn business in it's own god damn territory seeing as how 50% of that list is "respect our previous wars of aggression against your territory" and "don't join alliances which would've prevented our wars of aggression against your territory". But the internet is rife with Russian shills at every turn right now.
- s1artibartfast 5y agoI'm sure the internet is rife with Russian shills, but there are also a number of non-interventionists who don't want to get whipped up into a war frenzy and get involved another foreign war. I wish Russia and NATO/US could agree to a basic Neutrality and non-intervention treaty for Georgia and Ukraine.
- XorNot 5y agoWell golly gee, I guess the last 20 years of Ukraine not being in NATO was just too much of a risk. Nothing says "don't try and join NATO" like ongoingly and continually trying to invade and conquer a country because they're not a member of NATO.
- s1artibartfast 5y agoHey, I wish we lived in a perfect world too. I really do, but countries have conflicting interests, and always put their security first. The first step in navigating the real world is understanding that things are not perfect, and trying to understand the motivations of others. Russia has an agenda, NATO has an agenda, and Ukraine has an agenda. The more people are in denial about this fact, the more suffering there will be.
- XorNot 5y agoThe nefarious Ukrainian agenda of checks notes "continuing to exist as a sovereign democratic entity by the self-determination of its people".
- __s 5y agoDialogue & militarization isn't a mutually exclusive choice as in some video game either Ukraine needs to be able to threaten a costly conquest for Russia, as other countries are showing they won't intervene with their own military. Only when they can demonstrate that cost will there be incentive for dialogue from an attacking force
- wowokay 5y agoThe Ukrainian president was open to discussing a ceasefire and dialog, sounds like Russia isn’t interested at this time.
- UltraViolence 5y agoEveryone only wants to discuss a ceasefire on their terms. Not very useful. Let's just settle this through a fair fight.
- conradfr 5y agoRussia just said Ukraine said no to a ceasefire and dialog. https://twitter.com/ASLuhn/status/1497553764517036035?t=5WjHKBLxfqQgXdNSkvgxvA https://twitter.com/ASLuhn/status/1497553764517036035?t=5WjH... It's almost a parody, but with real innocent deaths.
- nine_zeros 5y agoIf anything has been proven in the last one month, it's that Putin says one thing and does another. I bet the exact opposite happened. Ukraine must have offered ceasefire and Russia said no.
- mrlonglong 5y agoI can confirm that. BBC says this was offered by the Ukrainians but Russia chose not to engage.
- 0x737368 5y agoThank you for your expert confirmation and no less from such a reliable source as BBC.
- throwoutway 5y agoI don’t believe that for a second
- risyachka 5y agoNegotiate on whether to invade Ukraine or not?