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In case it wasn't obvious the studies and this article is being written by people in the West who do not consume octopus. These articles almost always seem to d

In case it wasn't obvious the studies and this article is being written by people in the West who do not consume octopus. These articles almost always seem to derive to us-vs-them narrative, the idea that the West is somehow the forefront of moral novelty and the rest of the world is behind. When the irony is that the same random argument applied towards Octopus can be done on just about any sentient beings like cow and pigs. As a german, my understanding of Western narratives are almost always aimed at patting themselves on the back. I still remember Western media going in to overdrive to condemn masks during the onset of the pandemic, deriding Asian countries practice of wearing masks when you are sick as some sort of a backward psuedoscience. Let's just call this article what it is: To reassure non-octopus eaters on their superior moral creed and a license to preach this narrative to people who consume octopus, namely Asian and European countries. Already the comments on reddit are poking fun at Asian countries for eating octopus when in fact its Western Europe that consumes the largest amount. Octopus isn't just that delicious as a sashimi in large amounts.

jmcgough 5y ago
The growth in octopus consumption is being driven largely by the USA. It's super healthy so I see more middle / upper class Americans eating it. Years ago it was a rare delicacy, now I can walk into most poke bowl restaurants in SF and get octopus. Tapas restaurants have become trendy as well.
- fouc 5y ago
  I think the only time I've had octopus was when I tried Takoyaki a few times in Japan & Thailand. But honestly I found the diced octopus meat chewy and boring. Not very interested in it. As for health benefits? I doubt it.
  - pc86 5y ago
    It probably depends on what you compare it to. Same caloric amount of 80/20 ground beef? Octopus is almost certainly healthier. Vegetables? Unlikely unless you're really in need of some omega-3s or something.
bane 5y ago
Octopus is a pretty great cooked food, not as a sashimi. In Korean cuisine, at least, you find it stir fried, with noodles, in rice bowls, in soups...all sorts of things. There's several different kinds commonly eaten, from very small bite-sized to ones where a tentacle has to be cut into several bite sized pieces. It's often kept live until cooked, a practice that ensures both freshness and offended Western sensibilities at the same time. All that being said, Octopus is also often found cuisines of Western countries that are coastal and some of the best I've ever had was in Greece and Mexico. I've also had it in Japan on a stick as a street food, fried in the Bahamas, grilled over a campfire in Italy, and a few other places. In the U.S. I've only ever encountered it either at ethnic Asian or Greek places, or at high-end western dining experiences where the palettes are assumed to be more "adventurous". It's almost complete unknown as a food to most people and considered quite exotic and scary. But Americans are largely people who consider seafood to start and stop at canned tuna so...
- seanmcdirmid 5y ago
  > But Americans are largely people who consider seafood to start and stop at canned tuna so... That isn’t very accurate. Coastal Americans have had plenty of seafood to choose from, consider when they would serve lobsters to prisoners. Alaska is full of seafood to the point that it is a staple (and considering many of the Inuit communities who have been on that diet for thousands of years). Just because the customs are different from other coastal communities in other countries doesn’t make America’s any less sophisticated.
  - bane 5y ago
    Yeah, I'm being reductive. But my impression as an American is that you don't have to get very far from a coastal area for seafood to pretty quickly diminish on the plates of the average person...and there's a lot of the U.S. that is very far from any coastal area. In other words, it's not unusual at all to hear people say "I don't really like seafood" or will eat it very minimally like in fried fish sticks and tuna salad only.
    - 5y ago
gopher_space 5y ago
We’ve felt morally superior for ages over the whole whaling issue.
Tomis02 5y ago
As a European, I think you're wrong on several levels. > When the irony is that the same random argument applied towards Octopus can be done on just about any sentient beings like cow and pigs. Or like humans! It doesn't take a PhD to figure out that animals are biologically very similar to us and that they're likely sentient and intelligent. As far as I'm concerned, the burden of proof is on anyone claiming otherwise. We share so much biology with animals (this is proven, not conjectured) but you're trying to tell me that somehow it's just humans who are sentient and feel pain? Then prove it. > Let's just call this article what it is: To reassure non-octopus eaters on their superior moral creed and a license to preach this narrative to people who consume octopus Doesn't mean they're wrong. > These articles almost always seem to derive to us-vs-them narrative, the idea that the West is somehow the forefront of moral novelty and the rest of the world is behind. That may be the case sometimes, and their patronising tone irks me as well, but that doesn't mean they're wrong about this topic. Also, they're not the first ones to voice this idea, not by a longshot. So feel free to decouple your annoyance at "the West" (by which I assume you mean the Anglosphere) from what we can assume to be true until proven otherwise (animal sentience).
- deutschewelle 5y ago
  Do you actually believe that you would be able to enjoy the same level of human relationships with an octopus? How about a cow? Or a coackroach? You can attach romantic feelings towards anything since if you were so traumatized by having destroyed an sentient thing for your own benefit you would simply not allow yourself to exist. I did not engage with your comment further since it signaled the same amount of moral depth like someone who will claim that homeless meth addicts are humans too and they will invite them to a warm dinner with your family. I seriously somehow doubt that octopus is a hill that animal activists will die on seeing they failed to stop the whaling industry or a certain anti-oil virtue signaling girl with parents who work for the EGR industry who successfully convinced a bunch of people buy EVs. I'm willing to bet that YC is probably going fund a company that will be able to produce imitations of Crustacean meat once the narrative Octopus Lives Matter have disseminated into coastal cities.
  - Tomis02 5y ago
lentil_soup 5y ago
I'm sorry dude, but you're the only one here talking about us-vs-them and about Asia, the West or whatever. The article is about a farm in Spain in a region well known for it's octopus dishes. Not everything has to be about geopolitical ideologies.

jmcgough 5y ago

The growth in octopus consumption is being driven largely by the USA. It's super healthy so I see more middle / upper class Americans eating it. Years ago it was a rare delicacy, now I can walk into most poke bowl restaurants in SF and get octopus. Tapas restaurants have become trendy as well.

fouc 5y ago
I think the only time I've had octopus was when I tried Takoyaki a few times in Japan & Thailand. But honestly I found the diced octopus meat chewy and boring. Not very interested in it. As for health benefits? I doubt it.
- pc86 5y ago
  It probably depends on what you compare it to. Same caloric amount of 80/20 ground beef? Octopus is almost certainly healthier. Vegetables? Unlikely unless you're really in need of some omega-3s or something.

bane 5y ago

Octopus is a pretty great cooked food, not as a sashimi. In Korean cuisine, at least, you find it stir fried, with noodles, in rice bowls, in soups...all sorts of things. There's several different kinds commonly eaten, from very small bite-sized to ones where a tentacle has to be cut into several bite sized pieces. It's often kept live until cooked, a practice that ensures both freshness and offended Western sensibilities at the same time. All that being said, Octopus is also often found cuisines of Western countries that are coastal and some of the best I've ever had was in Greece and Mexico. I've also had it in Japan on a stick as a street food, fried in the Bahamas, grilled over a campfire in Italy, and a few other places. In the U.S. I've only ever encountered it either at ethnic Asian or Greek places, or at high-end western dining experiences where the palettes are assumed to be more "adventurous". It's almost complete unknown as a food to most people and considered quite exotic and scary. But Americans are largely people who consider seafood to start and stop at canned tuna so...

seanmcdirmid 5y ago
> But Americans are largely people who consider seafood to start and stop at canned tuna so... That isn’t very accurate. Coastal Americans have had plenty of seafood to choose from, consider when they would serve lobsters to prisoners. Alaska is full of seafood to the point that it is a staple (and considering many of the Inuit communities who have been on that diet for thousands of years). Just because the customs are different from other coastal communities in other countries doesn’t make America’s any less sophisticated.
- bane 5y ago
  Yeah, I'm being reductive. But my impression as an American is that you don't have to get very far from a coastal area for seafood to pretty quickly diminish on the plates of the average person...and there's a lot of the U.S. that is very far from any coastal area. In other words, it's not unusual at all to hear people say "I don't really like seafood" or will eat it very minimally like in fried fish sticks and tuna salad only.
  - 5y ago

gopher_space 5y ago

We’ve felt morally superior for ages over the whole whaling issue.

Tomis02 5y ago

As a European, I think you're wrong on several levels. > When the irony is that the same random argument applied towards Octopus can be done on just about any sentient beings like cow and pigs. Or like humans! It doesn't take a PhD to figure out that animals are biologically very similar to us and that they're likely sentient and intelligent. As far as I'm concerned, the burden of proof is on anyone claiming otherwise. We share so much biology with animals (this is proven, not conjectured) but you're trying to tell me that somehow it's just humans who are sentient and feel pain? Then prove it. > Let's just call this article what it is: To reassure non-octopus eaters on their superior moral creed and a license to preach this narrative to people who consume octopus Doesn't mean they're wrong. > These articles almost always seem to derive to us-vs-them narrative, the idea that the West is somehow the forefront of moral novelty and the rest of the world is behind. That may be the case sometimes, and their patronising tone irks me as well, but that doesn't mean they're wrong about this topic. Also, they're not the first ones to voice this idea, not by a longshot. So feel free to decouple your annoyance at "the West" (by which I assume you mean the Anglosphere) from what we can assume to be true until proven otherwise (animal sentience).

deutschewelle 5y ago
Do you actually believe that you would be able to enjoy the same level of human relationships with an octopus? How about a cow? Or a coackroach? You can attach romantic feelings towards anything since if you were so traumatized by having destroyed an sentient thing for your own benefit you would simply not allow yourself to exist. I did not engage with your comment further since it signaled the same amount of moral depth like someone who will claim that homeless meth addicts are humans too and they will invite them to a warm dinner with your family. I seriously somehow doubt that octopus is a hill that animal activists will die on seeing they failed to stop the whaling industry or a certain anti-oil virtue signaling girl with parents who work for the EGR industry who successfully convinced a bunch of people buy EVs. I'm willing to bet that YC is probably going fund a company that will be able to produce imitations of Crustacean meat once the narrative Octopus Lives Matter have disseminated into coastal cities.
- Tomis02 5y ago

lentil_soup 5y ago

I'm sorry dude, but you're the only one here talking about us-vs-them and about Asia, the West or whatever. The article is about a farm in Spain in a region well known for it's octopus dishes. Not everything has to be about geopolitical ideologies.