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Context: JetBrains' founders are Russian. They have offices in Moscow and Saint Petersburg. Free speech isn't really a thing in Russia. To openly condemn the ac
by labrador 5y ago
Context: JetBrains' founders are Russian. They have offices in Moscow and Saint Petersburg. Free speech isn't really a thing in Russia. To openly condemn the actions of the Russian government could have serious repercussions for them, but they did it anyway.
Спаси́бо, JetBrains.
- Dylan Beattie
- w_t_payne 5y agoIt's going to be increasingly difficult to do business there over the coming few years. I can't see this situation becoming easier any time soon. What steps can founders in Russia seek to reduce the risks that they're facing?
- mrkwse 5y agoIn terms of business risks, I believe Jetbrains are based in Czechia, so while there is risk for their founders, I'm not sure there's any business risk (whether Russian retribution or international sanctions) for JetBrains itself.
- ch4s3 5y agoIt might become difficult to pay Russian employees very soon.
- hollandia 5y agoTheir presence in Czechia is really small, it's not a Czech company in normal sense. My guess it's just a way how to get better access to western markets. The business risk is that they might not be able to transfer money to Russia (where they probably have most employees) and western companies might not be comfortable using what is basically just Russian software with "Czech" sticker on it.
- Barrin92 5y agopersonal moral or poltiical views aside, built software for the Russian market that aligns broadly with the national agenda. From the looks of it the decoupling is going to necessitate a lot of domestic infrastructure.
- kache_ 5y agomonero
- jedberg 5y ago> What steps can founders in Russia seek to reduce the risks that they're facing? Honestly? Their best bet is to leave Russia for a neighboring NATO aligned country.
- chickenbane 5y agoBravo. Makes me proud as a happy IntelliJ user.
- adamnemecek 5y agoJetBrains is technically a Czech company though, as in the company is a legal entity in the Czech Republic.
- toyg 5y agoPhew. That would mean they'll never be completely cut off by measures like the proposed ban from SWIFT of all Russian interests.
- stjohnswarts 5y agoMost of their employees (by a long shot) are in Russia though.
- crate_barre 5y agoSadly they will have stay away from open windows now.
- kweinber 5y agoNice defenestration reference. Slow clap.
- crate_barre 5y agoNothing gets passed you, huh?
- qiskit 5y agoUsing that logic, we don't have free speech in the US either. Ask the Dixie Chicks, phil donahue, etc. > To openly condemn the actions of the Russian government could have serious repercussions for them, but they did it anyway. Considering most of jetbrains business is in the West, to support the russian government would have had serious repercussions. Condemning the russian government is actually a smart business decision on their part. JetBrains founders side with the West. Apple CEO sides with China. Saudi Arabia and Israel are our best friends. Wonder what the common denominator is.
- imwillofficial 5y agoMoney?
- rodgerd 5y ago> Using that logic, we don't have free speech in the US either. Only if you are so monumentally stupid as to equate being murdered by the state with people not buying your albums, I guess.
- mdoms 5y ago> Using that logic, we don't have free speech in the US either. Ask the Dixie Chicks, phil donahue, etc. Sorry, which Dixie Chicks were locked up, disappeared or physically assaulted by government officials?
- ushakov 5y ago> business decision the tweet isn’t about business, it’s to support families of JetBrains employees
- bin_bash 5y agohow could this impact JetBrains employees in Russia? I imagine I'd be worried if I were them
- adolph 5y agoThe band [formerly known as “Dixie Chicks”] said they had picked "that stupid name" as teenagers, and had wanted to change it for years; they said they were moved to change it when they saw the Confederate flag described as "the Dixie Swastika" on social media in June 2020. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Chicks https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Chicks
- jimbob45 5y agoI'm blown away that JetBrains hasn't been acquired by any other company yet. I've seen universally positive reviews on here about every one of their products and they're never publicly made a PR misstep to my knowledge. Shame that they're all stuck in Russia.
- native_samples 5y agoSupposedly, Google had tried to buy them many times. But the owner is sitting pretty and doesn't want to sell. Probably a good move.
- matsemann 5y agoThey got some backslash when introducing the new subscription model a while back. But they listened and changed it to what it is today (if you stop paying you can still use the version you originally bought). But yeah, I got nothing bad to say. Use their products every day and am a happy customer.
- Mikeb85 5y agoTheir head office is in Prague, Czech Republic and they're technically a Czech company... But point still stands, they're Russian and speaking against the war.
- sam_lowry_ 5y agoThey have thousands of employees in Russia.
- Mikeb85 5y agoDidn't stay they don't.
- contravariant 5y agoTrue but I for one still think it's valuable additional information.
- tailspin2019 5y agoNot to detract from the importance of their statement today, but I’ve always thought that they were really a “Czech company” on paper only. Take a look at their supposed Czech HQ office: https://www.jetbrains.com/company/contacts/prague/ https://www.jetbrains.com/company/contacts/prague/ And then compare to their St Petersburg, Russia office: https://www.jetbrains.com/company/contacts/st-petersburg/ https://www.jetbrains.com/company/contacts/st-petersburg/ Which one looks more like a HQ? The latter office is their largest [0] and also just happens to be where their CEO is based [1]. It’s always felt to me like their de facto HQ is in Russia. I’m not trying to insinuate anything, I like their products and I’m pleased to see their statement today, but the “we’re a Czech company” thing has always felt a bit odd to me. If anything though, it makes the stand they’re taking today even more significant. [0] https://officesnapshots.com/2020/01/16/jetbrains-offices-saint-petersburg/ https://officesnapshots.com/2020/01/16/jetbrains-offices-sai... [1] https://mobile.twitter.com/mshafirov https://mobile.twitter.com/mshafirov
- 5y ago
- ushakov 5y agoyes, people of HN need to realize what it takes for a Russian company to voice narratives not in line with the government (in this case supporting their war enemy) for JetBrains this could mean losing contracts with other (pro-government) Russian companies, house searches for their own employees and executives and targeted “investigation” campaigns they could be declared a “foreign agent” or “undesirable organization” which will make business impossible https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_foreign_agent_law https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_foreign_agent_law https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_undesirable_organizations_law https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_undesirable_organiza... for Russian government “a friend of my enemy is my enemy”
- ushakov 5y agoand if you’re still in doubt: one tweet is all it takes to build a case they prosecute people for liking content on VK or blowing up houses in Minecraft https://theguardian.com/world/2022/feb/10/russian-teenager-nikita-uvarov-jailed-over-minecraft-plot-to-blow-up-virtual-spy-hq https://theguardian.com/world/2022/feb/10/russian-teenager-n...
- 22c 5y ago> supporting their war enemy Condemning the attacks is not the same as supporting their governments war enemy.
- solarkraft 5y agoFor the russian government? GP implies that this is the case.
- southerntofu 5y ago> for JetBrains this could mean losing contracts with other (pro-government) Russian companies, house searches for their own employees and executives and targeted “investigation” campaigns This can be true in many countries. Supporting people like Julian Assange, anti-colonial struggles for Kurdistan/Palestine, or opposing your State in any other way can get you in a lot of legal and para-legal trouble. All the more reason to be supportive of people and organizations taking a stand, wherever they are.
- FpUser 5y agoI hope this statement would not turn lives of their developers located in Russia miserable. The owners are insulated from this danger. From what I read Russia already arrested 1700 protesters.
- xibalba 5y agoThis is a case of people putting their conscience before their wallets when it really matters–a true act of bravery. People of JetBrains, I salute you.
- ASalazarMX 5y agoAlso, could be a way to tell their customers that JetBrains is not a Russian cyberwar asset. A supply chain attack using JetBrains products would be scary, given their penetration.
- Siira 5y agoIt could be a deceptive signal, then. Condemning this invasion is cheap if it allows Putin to hold onto such a strategic espionage/supply chain attack vector.
- duxup 5y agoI like to think I would be brave enough to say something in that situation. But you never know until the chips are down. Kudos to the Jetbrains folks.
- jonsbu 5y agoSpeech is cheap. In the end it is just a PR. I doubt they'll have any serious repercussions because the message is vague on purpose. But everybody in the comments already give them credit for it. Actions/money are all that matter.
- Ancapistani 5y agoSpeech is cheap in the West. JetBrains has a large Russian presence.
- stjohnswarts 5y agoI hope the people in Russian cities will be okay after this. It's one thing to denounce it from outside the country if you don't have to suffer the consequences :( . Putin's operatives are known to disappear people without a whole lot of provocation.
- smsm42 5y agoIndeed, a very brave statement, which carries very serious risks. Respect.
- silexia 5y agoWhen Putin threatens the families of employees of Jetbrains in Russia, they will put spyware in your IDE. They probably already have done so. Switch immediately.