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> Fine, here's how I would define woke: a political movement focusing on issues related to racial and social justice. > Are you happy with this definition? How

by feurio 5y ago

> Fine, here's how I would define woke: a political movement focusing on issues related to racial and social justice. > Are you happy with this definition? How does this help in any way? Absolutely happy. It helps because now that I know that if someone says that they are anti-woke then by definition they are anti racial and social justice. Kind of what I suspected, but good to have it confirmed. Look, I'm a middle aged, middle class, white, straight, cisgendered (whatever that means) male. It makes no difference to me. But I know that I'm not anti-woke. > Again, two wrongs don't make a right. You can't just resort to a whataboutism argument every time somebody points out something wrong your camp has done. It's not whataboutery, it's just an explanation. If you don't want people to be fired from a job for specious reasons then don't don't vote for those who want lax labour laws which allow people to be fired for specious reasons (or no reason at all - which is likely far more common than anything to do with white power signs, but doesn't make the news). If the people who don't want stronger protections for employees also happen to be the ones who are telling you that woke is the problem (definitely not the lack of rights for employees!), then maybe recalibrate your bullshit detector. If they are also the same people who are discouraging you from getting vaccinated or maybe bleach will cure covid then run like hell - they are the real sociopaths. If you think that woke is problem, you're being gaslit.

baobabKoodaa 5y ago
> Absolutely happy. It helps because now that I know that if someone says that they are anti-woke then by definition they are anti racial and social justice. Kind of what I suspected, but good to have it confirmed. If you don't support Antifa, you must be a literal nazi. If you don't support BLM, you must think black lives don't matter. If you don't support woke, you must be anti racial and social justice. We already visited this logical fallacy, I'm not gonna explain again what's wrong with it.
- feurio 5y ago
  Ahh, the capitals are important - they help you not to conflate things. I might not support Antifa beause of (some of) their activities. But I'm anti-fascist because I'm not fascist. I might not support BLM (although I'd struggle to see why) - I don't support them financially, if that counts. The opposite of beliving that black lives matter is believing that black lives don't mater. There is no Woke. There is only woke. Continue to vote for the Leopards Eating Faces party, and blame "woke" when leapords eat your face. As the LEF party encourages you to.
  - baobabKoodaa 5y ago
    > I might not support Antifa beause of (some of) their activities. But I'm anti-fascist because I'm not fascist. So then perhaps you might see how someone else might not support the woke movement because of some of their activities, even if they think the goals of the movement are good? > The opposite of beliving that black lives matter is believing that black lives don't mater. Yes, and? Where are the people saying "black lives don't matter"? Are you implying that people who don't support BLM (due to their activities of literally burning down cities) are thinking that black lives don't matter? Can you see how a person might agree with the statement "black lives matter", while simultaneously opposing a political movement that's literally named "black lives matter"? > There is no Woke. There is only woke. I have no idea what kind of pedantic nitpickery this is, but woke is a political movement just as BLM is, regardless of how you capitalize words.
    - feurio 5y ago
      Clearly it's not just pronouns that the anti-woke have a problem with, it's also proper nouns.
      - baobabKoodaa 5y ago
        I'm now the second non-native English speaker in this thread that you're making fun of, for my less-than-native ability of speaking English. We can continue this discussion in Finnish if you'd prefer that.
        feurio 5y ago
        Absolutely no idea that you were not a native English speaker - as far as I recall it's been impecable. Genuinely, hand on heart mean that (although the following sentence will be tongue in cheek). However, if you're looking for offence where none was intended ... doesn't that mean that you're woke? That's what they do, right? Let's just ... Finish. (And the Italian guy, I wasn't mocking - certainly not his English - I found the first message difficult to undertand what he meant, so wanted to make sure that he was referring to what I thought he was before contining. God knows his English is better than my Itaian. Or Finnish).

by feurio 5y ago

baobabKoodaa 5y ago

> Absolutely happy. It helps because now that I know that if someone says that they are anti-woke then by definition they are anti racial and social justice. Kind of what I suspected, but good to have it confirmed. If you don't support Antifa, you must be a literal nazi. If you don't support BLM, you must think black lives don't matter. If you don't support woke, you must be anti racial and social justice. We already visited this logical fallacy, I'm not gonna explain again what's wrong with it.

feurio 5y ago
Ahh, the capitals are important - they help you not to conflate things. I might not support Antifa beause of (some of) their activities. But I'm anti-fascist because I'm not fascist. I might not support BLM (although I'd struggle to see why) - I don't support them financially, if that counts. The opposite of beliving that black lives matter is believing that black lives don't mater. There is no Woke. There is only woke. Continue to vote for the Leopards Eating Faces party, and blame "woke" when leapords eat your face. As the LEF party encourages you to.
- baobabKoodaa 5y ago
  > I might not support Antifa beause of (some of) their activities. But I'm anti-fascist because I'm not fascist. So then perhaps you might see how someone else might not support the woke movement because of some of their activities, even if they think the goals of the movement are good? > The opposite of beliving that black lives matter is believing that black lives don't mater. Yes, and? Where are the people saying "black lives don't matter"? Are you implying that people who don't support BLM (due to their activities of literally burning down cities) are thinking that black lives don't matter? Can you see how a person might agree with the statement "black lives matter", while simultaneously opposing a political movement that's literally named "black lives matter"? > There is no Woke. There is only woke. I have no idea what kind of pedantic nitpickery this is, but woke is a political movement just as BLM is, regardless of how you capitalize words.
  - feurio 5y ago
    Clearly it's not just pronouns that the anti-woke have a problem with, it's also proper nouns.
    - baobabKoodaa 5y ago
      I'm now the second non-native English speaker in this thread that you're making fun of, for my less-than-native ability of speaking English. We can continue this discussion in Finnish if you'd prefer that.
      - feurio 5y ago
        Absolutely no idea that you were not a native English speaker - as far as I recall it's been impecable. Genuinely, hand on heart mean that (although the following sentence will be tongue in cheek). However, if you're looking for offence where none was intended ... doesn't that mean that you're woke? That's what they do, right? Let's just ... Finish. (And the Italian guy, I wasn't mocking - certainly not his English - I found the first message difficult to undertand what he meant, so wanted to make sure that he was referring to what I thought he was before contining. God knows his English is better than my Itaian. Or Finnish).