19 ms·

It appears this was the result of terrible security at GiveSendGo. I'd agree it could be state sponsored, but I am certain there are enough people with the ski

by dade_ 5y ago

It appears this was the result of terrible security at GiveSendGo. I'd agree it could be state sponsored, but I am certain there are enough people with the skills to do this on their own downtown Ottawa (even if it turned out they work for the gov't). That said, I am thoroughly disappointed the Federal gov't and much of the media coverage. They have done nothing but make the situation worse. I think it is intentional (I assume some political end game), but their actions are fueling even more outlandish conspiracy theories. The most insane was that all layers of government did nothing to stop the noise (truck horns), but it ended when a 21 year old who simply filed a court injunction and the protesters complied. https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/injunction-ottawa-granted-1.6342468 https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/injunction-ottawa-granted-1... I've watched the Toronto Police Service play their A game through this entire debacle. They shut down the protests hard and were clearly visible throughout the city with heavy trucks and busses to block roads and maintain control of the situation. https://www.cp24.com/video?clipId=2376560 https://www.cp24.com/video?clipId=2376560 The idea that Justin Trudeau needs martial law to deal with parked trucks is outrageous. This isn't an insurrection (reference to an MOU was removed from their website and I agree with the assertion that it was a poorly thought out idea, not a threat), there is no violence, and no obvious danger. The last person to use martial law was Trudeau's father (Pierre) for an actual terrorist attack and kidnapping (the diplomat was later murdered). Get some proper police on the job and drop mandates for ineffective measures and let's move on with our lives.

HWR_14 5y ago
I didn't see (nonfringe) calls for martial law. I saw calls for the military to tow the trucks because the actual truck towing companies the police normally subcontracted to were unwillingness to piss off their customer base/risk of violence from truckers/agreement with the protests. And, of the various government agencies, only the military had access to the heavy vehicle movers that were needed. > I think it is intentional (I assume some political end game) Most media doesn't have a political endgame. They have a bias for sensationalism and clickbait.
- riskneutral 5y ago
  > of the various government agencies, only the military had access to the heavy vehicle movers that were needed I am 100% certain there are people who can easily pick whatever kind of ignition lock cylinders are used in these trucks. It would be far more efficient to "car jack" these trucks, drive them to an impound lot, and auction them off the next day, than trying to tow them with "military tow trucks" (whatever those are).
908B64B197 5y ago
> That said, I am thoroughly disappointed the Federal gov't and much of the media coverage. They have done nothing but make the situation worse. I think it is intentional (I assume some political end game), but their actions are fueling even more outlandish conspiracy theories. Didn't the father do the exact same thing back in the 70's? Of course there's political gains, as they say, never get a crisis go to waste.
TrispusAttucks 5y ago
WHAT! People standing up for their rights! Cue the media attack dog and smear campaign. We need some corporate approved misinformation to get ahead of this. It's such an obvious formula at this point. Does anyone still not see through it?
fsckboy 5y ago
> It appears this was the result of terrible security at GiveSendGo. Don't victim blame, and call a spade a spade. It was the result of targeted black hat hacking and identity theft, probably made easier by poor security at GiveSendGo.
eldaisfish 5y ago
>there is no violence, and no obvious danger While there is no outright violence, there is torture to local residents, there was attempted arson, there is continued intimidation and harassment of those wearing masks, there is intimidation of visible minorities, there are attacks on businesses.... Is that enough to convince you that the situation is out of hand and than stricter action is needed? The protestors haven't complied with not honking. Please, please be careful with how you frame this. There was severe inaction and dangerous incompetence displayed by Ottawa police but please don't spin this as the federal government overstepping. Edit - within seconds of posting, this is downvoted. Truly a shameful display by the folks here.
- wizzwizz4 5y ago
  > Edit - within seconds of posting, this is downvoted. Truly a shameful display by the folks here. Please don't comment on downvotes like this; it's not useful.
  - throw10920 5y ago
    Complaining about downvoting is straight-up against the HN guidelines https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html : > Please don't comment about the voting on comments. It never does any good, and it makes boring reading. And in this case, it's more than a little manipulative. "Truly a shameful display by the folks here."
- ctoth 5y ago
  > While there is no outright violence, there is torture to local residents Why did you use the word torture here? Torture is a well-defined word with an accepted meaning. Do you feel that it is appropriate? Or are you looking for an emotionally-loaded reaction? Can I also claim that my loud college neighbors are torturing me when they stay up too late on the weekend? Of course I can, but it sure is disingenuous to anyone who has actually been tortured.
  - BeefWellington 5y ago
BeefWellington 5y ago
> The most insane was that all layers of government did nothing to stop the noise (truck horns), but it ended when a 21 year old who simply filed a court injunction and the protesters complied. > https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/injunction-ottawa-granted-1 https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/injunction-ottawa-granted-1... This did not work though: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/protesters-violate-court-injunction-through-weekend-1.6349861 https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/protesters-violate-cou... The court order is just a threat and the Ottawa Police Service appear to not care to enforce the order.
- ryandrake 5y ago
  I think one point that the last two years has nailed home (around the world) is that how protestors are treated has little to do with what their tactics and behavior are, and more to do with simply whether their message ideologically aligns with the police. If the police agree with some group of protestors, then they're treated with kid gloves, and can get away with anything. The police will throw their hands up and say "nope, can't possibly enforce the law anymore, so sorry!" and stand back. If the police do not agree with some other group of protestors, they're going to get beaten, pepper sprayed, and shot with rubber bullets, no matter how they behave. All of a sudden, enforcement is no problem.
  - imwillofficial 5y ago
    Things I’ve seen this year. People who Molotov cocktailed a police van with people inside. Let off with probation. Police beat an unconscious person until they died. Internal investigation cleared them of wrongdoing. It definitely matters what the protest is supporting/fighting.
    - imwillofficial 5y ago
      My example #1 was a BLM protestor, #2 was at the capital protest.
    - FireBeyond 5y ago
      Portland Police Department is just one particularly egregious example. Numerous leaked text messages between officers and the Proud Boys. Letting them know to take cover before tear gas is deployed and that they'll be told when it's "all clear" to come back out, letting them know that though some of their leaders have active warrants for arrest, that they are clear to come to the protest because there's no "other agencies" involved in enforcement, so there's no risk.
vzidex 5y ago
Definition, martial law: Martial law is the temporary imposition of direct military control of normal civil functions or suspension of civil law by a government, especially in response to a temporary emergency where civil forces are overwhelmed, or in an occupied territory. [1] The key phrases are "imposition of direct military control of normal civil functions" and "suspension of civil law by a government". The Canadian Emergencies Act, which was invoked by the Liberal government today, specifically states the following: "For greater certainty, nothing in this Act derogates from the authority of the Government of Canada to deal with emergencies on any property, territory or area in respect of which the Parliament of Canada has jurisdiction" [2]. I'd do a deeper reading but I'm a bit lazy, but my understanding is that the EA does not allow, in any way, a shift in governance that could be described as "martial law" - where the military is in control of civil functions and can create or remove laws as military leadership desires. Even with the EA invoked, the federal government still controls the Canadian military (but can be assisted in enforcing civil law _by_ the military). I'm no fan of Trudeau either, but we should seek to be precise when discussing hot situations like this. People can get very inflamed off of internet posts and the idea that we're under "martial law" is riling people up. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martial_law https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martial_law [2] https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/e-4.5/page-1.html https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/e-4.5/page-1.html
- tablespoon 5y ago
  > I'd do a deeper reading but I'm a bit lazy, but my understanding is that the EA does not allow, in any way, a shift in governance that could be described as "martial law" - where the military is in control of civil functions and can create or remove laws as military leadership desires. Even with the EA invoked, the federal government still controls the Canadian military (but can be assisted in enforcing civil law _by_ the military). Is that martial law is? What you're describing sounds more like a coup to me ("where the military is in control of civil functions and can create or remove laws as military leadership desires"). My understanding of martial law (very colored by being an American) is basically direct enforcement of domestic government authority by the military with little or no recourse to normal civilian oversight (e.g. courts). However, the military isn't acting independently, but is still taking orders from some civilian leader in some part of the government.
RIMR 5y ago
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- ctoth 5y ago
  I'm just trying to understand here, you're advocating that people lose their livelihoods for donating to a protest movement you don't approve of? Not participating in illegal action, not physically hurting anyone, just giving money to the wrong people online? Can you possibly think of any circumstances where this sort of principle might backfire?
  - RIMR 5y ago
    Shutting down roadways into and out of cities is a little bit more than just a disagreement. These people are criminals.
  - FireBeyond 5y ago
    > not physically hurting anyone It's a good thing 140dB horns for 18 hours a day for weeks comes with zero risk of physical harm to people's hearing, apparently.
beebmam 5y ago
What sort of laws would you support against people that hack websites like this?
- imwillofficial 5y ago
  We have sufficient laws, it’s the uneven enforcement that I have a problem with.
  - beebmam 5y ago
    If I'm hearing you right, your belief is that law enforcement is not enforcing the current hacking laws that exist evenly. I'd like to understand this belief of yours. Who are they discriminating against?
99_00 5y ago
Also the Ambassador Bridge blockade was ordered by the court to clear on Friday midnight. Police cleared it Sunday with some arrests, some resistance but not much else. Pretty standard when it comes to Canadian protests.
ar_turnbull 5y ago
> "there is no violence, and no obvious danger." This is false and I would expect better of HN posters. A group of the protestors locked the doors to a downtown apartment building with handcuffs and then attempted to set that building on fire. Although nobody has been injured yet, there have been plenty of weapons seizures as well as incidents of protestors ramming police vehicles and/or attempting to arrest police officers. Residents of Ottawa are scared to leave their homes for simple tasks like buying groceries because the protestors have assaulted vulnerable individuals for wearing masks. The entire thing is a tinderbox just waiting for one unhinged protestor to make a wrong move. And even if we escape this incident peacefully, there are the toxic diesel fumes from idling trucks which have been polluting downtown Ottawa's air for the last two weeks and are likely to become trapped in the urban environment.
- twofornone 5y ago
  >A group of the protestors locked the doors to a downtown apartment building with handcuffs and then attempted to set that building on fire. For some reason the media failed to show the images in their stories, but the two arsonists on camera (not a group) had purple hair. With all the talk of white supremacist instigators at BLM riots, I wouldn't be surprised if this were a case of the opposite, anti-trucker instigators trying to give the protestors a bad name, and purple hair is more likely associated with the left...which ironically has taken a pro government stance on this issue. In any case afaik no actual tie to the protests has been reported.
- coolso 5y ago
  > Residents of Ottawa are scared to leave their homes for simple tasks Kind of like almost everyone in the US and Canada for a period of almost a year thanks to governmental policies? Another way to look at things is these protests will indirectly help flatten the curve, especially if they go on for two more weeks.
- skinkestek 5y ago
  Compared to the violence, burning and looting in front of the American election this is absolutely nothing and have only lasted a few days Those demonstrations were mostly peaceful according to those we are supposed to listen to, so obviously the current demonstrations are even more peaceful. Edit: I'm triple vaccinated myself and recommend it for everyone else, but if we have freedom to choose that also must include freedom to do what I think is less smart. In fact I think at this point the attempt to force people to vaccinate is scaring people away from it.
smnrchrds 5y ago
> there is no violence, and no obvious danger A number of illegal weapons, high capacity magazines, and a large quantity of ammunition were seized in a blockade in Alberta. I would not be surprised if there are people with weapons in Ottawa as well, waiting for an opportunity to strike. https://globalnews.ca/news/8618494/alberta-coutts-border-protest-weapons-ammunition-seized/ https://globalnews.ca/news/8618494/alberta-coutts-border-pro...
- newsclues 5y ago
  Painting with broad strokes is dangerous.
  - joseph8th 5y ago
    "How dare you use my words and actions against me!"
  - alex_anglin 5y ago
    When asking if anyone in the protest had firearms, a journalist was ejected from a news conference. Would have been a good opportunity to disavow violence, but here we are. In this case, it's not so much painting with broad strokes as much as judging by the company they keep. Source: https://twitter.com/alexboutilier/status/1493319507846176769?cxt=HHwWgoCplcaLq7kpAAAA https://twitter.com/alexboutilier/status/1493319507846176769...
- rpaldb 5y ago
- tablespoon 5y ago
  > A number of illegal weapons...were seized in a blockade in Alberta. > https://globalnews.ca/news/8618494/alberta-coutts-border-protest-weapons-ammunition-seized/ https://globalnews.ca/news/8618494/alberta-coutts-border-pro... Your link doesn't describe anything as "illegal weapons." It just says "long guns" and "handguns" which are both pretty broad terms that undoubtedly encompass guns that are legal in Canada.
rpaldb 5y ago
[flagged]
hamaluik 5y ago
- dang 5y ago
  Please don't cross into breaking the site guidelines. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- JacobThreeThree 5y ago
  Why couldn't three people independently reach the same conclusion?
ahthat 5y ago
Media coverage of these protests is vastly negative. I remember only a few years ago (2020) when protests were undoubtedly violent across the United States. Video evidence of this violence as well as mass crowd driven theft was widely documented and distributed. I have yet to see video evidence of any violence from freedom convoys, and the ground based video evidence I have seen appears vastly peaceful. This does not mean there isn’t violence. Indeed, blockading roads could be construed as violence based on an argument for different definitions of the word. Yet, from my personal observations, it seems that the protests are essentially peaceful, citizens living in these cities are in support in large numbers, and this is running counter to the narrative being espoused in mainstream media sources, with the possible exception of Fox News. More or less it seems as though media sources are mischaracterizing these protests overall. Furthermore, it can be effectively argued that forcing workers to get vaccinated or lose their jobs is inherently discriminatory and perhaps even anti-freedom. But these are only my personal observations and conclusions, be what they are, a single individuals insight into the times occurring around him, debate as you will.
- mplewis 5y ago
  There's a lot to unpack here, but Ottawa residents are largely against the truckers occupying the roads of their city.
  - gengelbro 5y ago
    How about citizens of Seattle when the CHAZ was operating? Were they majority for that?
    - seanmcdirmid 5y ago
      Considering that the CHAZ was in Capitol Hill, I assume the people in that neighborhood were supportive. As for the rest of us in Seattle, most of us never even visited or saw the place (how often does someone who doesn't live in Capitol Hill visit Capitol Hill?), so it was just something we would see on CNN if we were bothering to watch the news at all (it was cool to see FoxNews have some of our buildings burning down even if it wasn't true, their media narrative was pretty messed up).
Cd00d 5y ago
> "drop mandates" That little throw away at the end, where we just give in to people making demands outside of democratic methods says it all, I think.
- JackFr 5y ago
  That protests are 'outside of democratic methods' says quite a bit itself.

by dade_ 5y ago

HWR_14 5y ago

I didn't see (nonfringe) calls for martial law. I saw calls for the military to tow the trucks because the actual truck towing companies the police normally subcontracted to were unwillingness to piss off their customer base/risk of violence from truckers/agreement with the protests. And, of the various government agencies, only the military had access to the heavy vehicle movers that were needed. > I think it is intentional (I assume some political end game) Most media doesn't have a political endgame. They have a bias for sensationalism and clickbait.

riskneutral 5y ago
> of the various government agencies, only the military had access to the heavy vehicle movers that were needed I am 100% certain there are people who can easily pick whatever kind of ignition lock cylinders are used in these trucks. It would be far more efficient to "car jack" these trucks, drive them to an impound lot, and auction them off the next day, than trying to tow them with "military tow trucks" (whatever those are).

908B64B197 5y ago

> That said, I am thoroughly disappointed the Federal gov't and much of the media coverage. They have done nothing but make the situation worse. I think it is intentional (I assume some political end game), but their actions are fueling even more outlandish conspiracy theories. Didn't the father do the exact same thing back in the 70's? Of course there's political gains, as they say, never get a crisis go to waste.

TrispusAttucks 5y ago

WHAT! People standing up for their rights! Cue the media attack dog and smear campaign. We need some corporate approved misinformation to get ahead of this. It's such an obvious formula at this point. Does anyone still not see through it?

fsckboy 5y ago

> It appears this was the result of terrible security at GiveSendGo. Don't victim blame, and call a spade a spade. It was the result of targeted black hat hacking and identity theft, probably made easier by poor security at GiveSendGo.

eldaisfish 5y ago

>there is no violence, and no obvious danger While there is no outright violence, there is torture to local residents, there was attempted arson, there is continued intimidation and harassment of those wearing masks, there is intimidation of visible minorities, there are attacks on businesses.... Is that enough to convince you that the situation is out of hand and than stricter action is needed? The protestors haven't complied with not honking. Please, please be careful with how you frame this. There was severe inaction and dangerous incompetence displayed by Ottawa police but please don't spin this as the federal government overstepping. Edit - within seconds of posting, this is downvoted. Truly a shameful display by the folks here.

wizzwizz4 5y ago
> Edit - within seconds of posting, this is downvoted. Truly a shameful display by the folks here. Please don't comment on downvotes like this; it's not useful.
- throw10920 5y ago
  Complaining about downvoting is straight-up against the HN guidelines https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html : > Please don't comment about the voting on comments. It never does any good, and it makes boring reading. And in this case, it's more than a little manipulative. "Truly a shameful display by the folks here."
ctoth 5y ago
> While there is no outright violence, there is torture to local residents Why did you use the word torture here? Torture is a well-defined word with an accepted meaning. Do you feel that it is appropriate? Or are you looking for an emotionally-loaded reaction? Can I also claim that my loud college neighbors are torturing me when they stay up too late on the weekend? Of course I can, but it sure is disingenuous to anyone who has actually been tortured.
- BeefWellington 5y ago

BeefWellington 5y ago

> The most insane was that all layers of government did nothing to stop the noise (truck horns), but it ended when a 21 year old who simply filed a court injunction and the protesters complied. > https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/injunction-ottawa-granted-1 https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/injunction-ottawa-granted-1... This did not work though: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/protesters-violate-court-injunction-through-weekend-1.6349861 https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/protesters-violate-cou... The court order is just a threat and the Ottawa Police Service appear to not care to enforce the order.

ryandrake 5y ago
I think one point that the last two years has nailed home (around the world) is that how protestors are treated has little to do with what their tactics and behavior are, and more to do with simply whether their message ideologically aligns with the police. If the police agree with some group of protestors, then they're treated with kid gloves, and can get away with anything. The police will throw their hands up and say "nope, can't possibly enforce the law anymore, so sorry!" and stand back. If the police do not agree with some other group of protestors, they're going to get beaten, pepper sprayed, and shot with rubber bullets, no matter how they behave. All of a sudden, enforcement is no problem.
- imwillofficial 5y ago
  Things I’ve seen this year. People who Molotov cocktailed a police van with people inside. Let off with probation. Police beat an unconscious person until they died. Internal investigation cleared them of wrongdoing. It definitely matters what the protest is supporting/fighting.
  - imwillofficial 5y ago
    My example #1 was a BLM protestor, #2 was at the capital protest.
  - FireBeyond 5y ago
    Portland Police Department is just one particularly egregious example. Numerous leaked text messages between officers and the Proud Boys. Letting them know to take cover before tear gas is deployed and that they'll be told when it's "all clear" to come back out, letting them know that though some of their leaders have active warrants for arrest, that they are clear to come to the protest because there's no "other agencies" involved in enforcement, so there's no risk.

vzidex 5y ago

Definition, martial law: Martial law is the temporary imposition of direct military control of normal civil functions or suspension of civil law by a government, especially in response to a temporary emergency where civil forces are overwhelmed, or in an occupied territory. [1] The key phrases are "imposition of direct military control of normal civil functions" and "suspension of civil law by a government". The Canadian Emergencies Act, which was invoked by the Liberal government today, specifically states the following: "For greater certainty, nothing in this Act derogates from the authority of the Government of Canada to deal with emergencies on any property, territory or area in respect of which the Parliament of Canada has jurisdiction" [2]. I'd do a deeper reading but I'm a bit lazy, but my understanding is that the EA does not allow, in any way, a shift in governance that could be described as "martial law" - where the military is in control of civil functions and can create or remove laws as military leadership desires. Even with the EA invoked, the federal government still controls the Canadian military (but can be assisted in enforcing civil law _by_ the military). I'm no fan of Trudeau either, but we should seek to be precise when discussing hot situations like this. People can get very inflamed off of internet posts and the idea that we're under "martial law" is riling people up. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martial_law https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martial_law [2] https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/e-4.5/page-1.html https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/e-4.5/page-1.html

tablespoon 5y ago
> I'd do a deeper reading but I'm a bit lazy, but my understanding is that the EA does not allow, in any way, a shift in governance that could be described as "martial law" - where the military is in control of civil functions and can create or remove laws as military leadership desires. Even with the EA invoked, the federal government still controls the Canadian military (but can be assisted in enforcing civil law _by_ the military). Is that martial law is? What you're describing sounds more like a coup to me ("where the military is in control of civil functions and can create or remove laws as military leadership desires"). My understanding of martial law (very colored by being an American) is basically direct enforcement of domestic government authority by the military with little or no recourse to normal civilian oversight (e.g. courts). However, the military isn't acting independently, but is still taking orders from some civilian leader in some part of the government.

RIMR 5y ago

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
ctoth 5y ago
I'm just trying to understand here, you're advocating that people lose their livelihoods for donating to a protest movement you don't approve of? Not participating in illegal action, not physically hurting anyone, just giving money to the wrong people online? Can you possibly think of any circumstances where this sort of principle might backfire?
- RIMR 5y ago
  Shutting down roadways into and out of cities is a little bit more than just a disagreement. These people are criminals.
- FireBeyond 5y ago
  > not physically hurting anyone It's a good thing 140dB horns for 18 hours a day for weeks comes with zero risk of physical harm to people's hearing, apparently.

beebmam 5y ago

What sort of laws would you support against people that hack websites like this?

imwillofficial 5y ago
We have sufficient laws, it’s the uneven enforcement that I have a problem with.
- beebmam 5y ago
  If I'm hearing you right, your belief is that law enforcement is not enforcing the current hacking laws that exist evenly. I'd like to understand this belief of yours. Who are they discriminating against?

99_00 5y ago

Also the Ambassador Bridge blockade was ordered by the court to clear on Friday midnight. Police cleared it Sunday with some arrests, some resistance but not much else. Pretty standard when it comes to Canadian protests.

ar_turnbull 5y ago

> "there is no violence, and no obvious danger." This is false and I would expect better of HN posters. A group of the protestors locked the doors to a downtown apartment building with handcuffs and then attempted to set that building on fire. Although nobody has been injured yet, there have been plenty of weapons seizures as well as incidents of protestors ramming police vehicles and/or attempting to arrest police officers. Residents of Ottawa are scared to leave their homes for simple tasks like buying groceries because the protestors have assaulted vulnerable individuals for wearing masks. The entire thing is a tinderbox just waiting for one unhinged protestor to make a wrong move. And even if we escape this incident peacefully, there are the toxic diesel fumes from idling trucks which have been polluting downtown Ottawa's air for the last two weeks and are likely to become trapped in the urban environment.

twofornone 5y ago
>A group of the protestors locked the doors to a downtown apartment building with handcuffs and then attempted to set that building on fire. For some reason the media failed to show the images in their stories, but the two arsonists on camera (not a group) had purple hair. With all the talk of white supremacist instigators at BLM riots, I wouldn't be surprised if this were a case of the opposite, anti-trucker instigators trying to give the protestors a bad name, and purple hair is more likely associated with the left...which ironically has taken a pro government stance on this issue. In any case afaik no actual tie to the protests has been reported.
coolso 5y ago
> Residents of Ottawa are scared to leave their homes for simple tasks Kind of like almost everyone in the US and Canada for a period of almost a year thanks to governmental policies? Another way to look at things is these protests will indirectly help flatten the curve, especially if they go on for two more weeks.
skinkestek 5y ago
Compared to the violence, burning and looting in front of the American election this is absolutely nothing and have only lasted a few days Those demonstrations were mostly peaceful according to those we are supposed to listen to, so obviously the current demonstrations are even more peaceful. Edit: I'm triple vaccinated myself and recommend it for everyone else, but if we have freedom to choose that also must include freedom to do what I think is less smart. In fact I think at this point the attempt to force people to vaccinate is scaring people away from it.

smnrchrds 5y ago

> there is no violence, and no obvious danger A number of illegal weapons, high capacity magazines, and a large quantity of ammunition were seized in a blockade in Alberta. I would not be surprised if there are people with weapons in Ottawa as well, waiting for an opportunity to strike. https://globalnews.ca/news/8618494/alberta-coutts-border-protest-weapons-ammunition-seized/ https://globalnews.ca/news/8618494/alberta-coutts-border-pro...

newsclues 5y ago
Painting with broad strokes is dangerous.
- joseph8th 5y ago
  "How dare you use my words and actions against me!"
- alex_anglin 5y ago
  When asking if anyone in the protest had firearms, a journalist was ejected from a news conference. Would have been a good opportunity to disavow violence, but here we are. In this case, it's not so much painting with broad strokes as much as judging by the company they keep. Source: https://twitter.com/alexboutilier/status/1493319507846176769?cxt=HHwWgoCplcaLq7kpAAAA https://twitter.com/alexboutilier/status/1493319507846176769...
rpaldb 5y ago
tablespoon 5y ago
> A number of illegal weapons...were seized in a blockade in Alberta. > https://globalnews.ca/news/8618494/alberta-coutts-border-protest-weapons-ammunition-seized/ https://globalnews.ca/news/8618494/alberta-coutts-border-pro... Your link doesn't describe anything as "illegal weapons." It just says "long guns" and "handguns" which are both pretty broad terms that undoubtedly encompass guns that are legal in Canada.

rpaldb 5y ago

[flagged]

hamaluik 5y ago

dang 5y ago
Please don't cross into breaking the site guidelines. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
JacobThreeThree 5y ago
Why couldn't three people independently reach the same conclusion?

ahthat 5y ago

Media coverage of these protests is vastly negative. I remember only a few years ago (2020) when protests were undoubtedly violent across the United States. Video evidence of this violence as well as mass crowd driven theft was widely documented and distributed. I have yet to see video evidence of any violence from freedom convoys, and the ground based video evidence I have seen appears vastly peaceful. This does not mean there isn’t violence. Indeed, blockading roads could be construed as violence based on an argument for different definitions of the word. Yet, from my personal observations, it seems that the protests are essentially peaceful, citizens living in these cities are in support in large numbers, and this is running counter to the narrative being espoused in mainstream media sources, with the possible exception of Fox News. More or less it seems as though media sources are mischaracterizing these protests overall. Furthermore, it can be effectively argued that forcing workers to get vaccinated or lose their jobs is inherently discriminatory and perhaps even anti-freedom. But these are only my personal observations and conclusions, be what they are, a single individuals insight into the times occurring around him, debate as you will.

mplewis 5y ago
There's a lot to unpack here, but Ottawa residents are largely against the truckers occupying the roads of their city.
- gengelbro 5y ago
  How about citizens of Seattle when the CHAZ was operating? Were they majority for that?
  - seanmcdirmid 5y ago
    Considering that the CHAZ was in Capitol Hill, I assume the people in that neighborhood were supportive. As for the rest of us in Seattle, most of us never even visited or saw the place (how often does someone who doesn't live in Capitol Hill visit Capitol Hill?), so it was just something we would see on CNN if we were bothering to watch the news at all (it was cool to see FoxNews have some of our buildings burning down even if it wasn't true, their media narrative was pretty messed up).

Cd00d 5y ago

> "drop mandates" That little throw away at the end, where we just give in to people making demands outside of democratic methods says it all, I think.

JackFr 5y ago
That protests are 'outside of democratic methods' says quite a bit itself.