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AMD Receives Approval for Acquisition of Xilinx

122 points by transpute 5y ago

anonymous_they 5y ago
Recieved approval from the Chinese anti-trust body. Still waiting for the FTC sign-off, but that should be a rubberstamp at this point. This acquisition brings AMD up to par with Intel's market share in the chip market.
- gjsman-1000 5y ago
  To be fully honest, I don't understand why companies do so much business in China. Yes, there's money, but there's so much danger and risk involved it increasingly looks like betting on Bitcoin for your retirement. An example of this would be what happened to the ARM China division, which has gone completely rogue and the Chinese government couldn't care less. There's also the fact that, Intel and AMD for making the most high-performance parts should have the upper-hand. If they refused to do business in China, the Chinese government and citizens would be forced to mass-import their CPUs and not be able to control them. ARM is not even close to ready to run Chinese data centers. Of course, this would incentivize China to immediately do everything they could to replace Intel and AMD, but they could be forced to grovel in the meantime. And Intel and AMD can feel comfortable they aren't supporting genocide (at least according to the UN).
  - systemvoltage 5y ago
    Companies aren't to blame. Our lawmakers are. They need to pass laws that protect US interests but for last 3 decades, they've sold the American worker's soul to the CCP & private-gov enterprise in China. Apple spent $275 billion to boost Chinese manufacturing, but fuck-all to do anything in US. They could have built a whole ecosystem of US electronics manufacturers and make everything in US + Mexico, but their shareholders will never vote for it. So, laws must be passed to force them. The revolving door in DC has crushed the working class people of US and the same goes on in EU, the west generally. [1] https://www.theinformation.com/articles/facing-hostile-chinese-authorities-apple-ceo-signed-275-billion-deal-with-them https://www.theinformation.com/articles/facing-hostile-chine...
    - sangnoir 5y ago
      > They need to pass laws that protect US interests but for last 3 decades, they've sold the American worker's soul to the CCP & private-gov enterprise in China. Companies are not blameless - it's a 2-step process. Lawmakers sold the American worker's soul to capital (companies), and the companies sold them on to China, with a fat markup. The motivations are clear: politicians get donations and cushy jobs, the company executives get very rich due to increased short-term profits and increased valuations on the hope of establishing a foothold in a humongous growth market, China gets tech transfer, exports and a skilled workforce, and American workers get nothing, save perhaps a tiny sliver of company ownership through a 401k, if they are lucky to have one.
      - otherotherchris 5y ago
        Typical American narcissism. The reality is that China's farsighted rulers don't want to be a US client state/ colonial possession and have imposed strict rules on market participants in exchange for access to their 1.5 billion consumer market. American businesses can put up or shut up.
- duped 5y ago
  The current FTC and DoJ leadership are the most anti-trust since the (first) Roosevelt administration, it seems (nevermind that they were established after the fact, I'm being hyperbolic)
gjsman-1000 5y ago
If I have one wish for AMD, I wish that they would make FPGAs (and Xilinx) a more open and diverse platform like the PC. Not that the PC is perfect (there's still closed-source firmware), but any improvement to the current state of FPGAs would be welcomed.
- brian_herman 5y ago
  Yeah a co processor with fpga on it or even an expansion card I can buy at micro center for 100 bucks would be great!
  - gjsman-1000 5y ago
    Or even better, a useful FPGA that is inside the Ryzen processor itself. It might be very small, but if it was standardized, had an easier way to program it, and programs could load acceleration routines into it, that would be so cool.
    - rjsw 5y ago
      Intel has done the equivalent with some Xeon processors. The chiplet design of current AMD CPUs should make this even easier to do.
    - opportune 5y ago
      This is what I’ve been thinking about for ages. It could be a huge accomplishment and greatly improve efficiency for scientific computing, data analytics and OLAP, cloud gaming, general backend development, etc
- lnsru 5y ago
  What’s wrong with current state except that the chips have lead time of 52+ weeks?
  - colejohnson66 5y ago
    The development side. Compiling and simulating your Verilog/VHDL can be done with open source software, but to put it on the FPGA itself, you generally need closed source (and sometimes paid) tools to generate the bitstreams. Contrast that with microcontrollers such as the ATMega which can be programmed from start to finish using an entirely FOSS stack - even the bootloader and programmer. And for some reason, these companies consider the bitstream formats trade secrets and refuse to document them at all.
CountSessine 5y ago
Why? Has Intel done anything with Altera? I’m curious. AMD’s acquisition of ATI is generally viewed as a strategic error. Does this make more sense?
- Symmetry 5y ago
  There are some interesting datacenter interconnect implications, especially around the new CXL spec. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compute_Express_Link https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compute_Express_Link
- lnsru 5y ago
  Intel sold power electronics group(?) for 85 million dollar, that Altera bought for 140 million: https://www.anandtech.com/show/16257/mediatek-subsidiary-to-acquire-intel-enpirion-business-for-85-million https://www.anandtech.com/show/16257/mediatek-subsidiary-to-... I also know that many clients ditched SoCs with ARM cores from Altera when Intel acquired it being afraid that Intel does not like these alien cores.
- chomp 5y ago
  > AMD’s acquisition of ATI is generally viewed as a strategic error. Historically it was (when AMD was drowning in debt from the acquisition and had no competitive processors on the timeline), but is this still true? For instance, all of the major game consoles (ps4/ps5/xbone/xbox series x/switch) use AMD boards, and as I recall, those deals lifted the company's financials quite well.
  - KeyBoardG 5y ago
    Agreed, although Switch uses NVidia Tegra, not AMD this generation.
    - libertine 5y ago
      For now they do, honestly it would make more sense to maybe consider an AMD SoC.
msapaydin 5y ago
I was awarded an FPGA chip by Xilinx that I blogged about: http://msapaydin.wordpress.com http://msapaydin.wordpress.com They are making an effort to promote the use of Xilinx fpga's on machine learning, recently.
- homarp 5y ago
  https://msapaydin.wordpress.com/2021/11/01/xilinx-and-ai/ https://msapaydin.wordpress.com/2021/11/01/xilinx-and-ai/ right ?
  - msapaydin 5y ago
    Yes, thank you. Sorry I am on mobile, traveling and could not post the full link.
intricatedetail 5y ago
I hope they won't kill their CPLD line that has been obsoleted several times and then pushed back. It's a lifesaver for designing digital circuits if you don't want to use a ton of 74 chips.
- dragontamer 5y ago
  It was my understanding Lattice's FPGAs / CPLDs are more tailored for the smaller (possibly hobbyist scale) EEs out there. Bonus points: Lattice has turned a blind eye at the open source community, meaning Lattice's FPGAs / CPLDs have open-source toolsets. Kinda sad that "blind eye" is the best we can hope for from these companies, but that's how it is for now...
  - jlokier 5y ago
    Not all these companies. QuickLogic openly embraces open source tooling.for their FPGAs.
anthk 5y ago
This is bad.

122 points by transpute 5y ago

Recieved approval from the Chinese anti-trust body. Still waiting for the FTC sign-off, but that should be a rubberstamp at this point. This acquisition brings AMD up to par with Intel's market share in the chip market.

gjsman-1000 5y ago
To be fully honest, I don't understand why companies do so much business in China. Yes, there's money, but there's so much danger and risk involved it increasingly looks like betting on Bitcoin for your retirement. An example of this would be what happened to the ARM China division, which has gone completely rogue and the Chinese government couldn't care less. There's also the fact that, Intel and AMD for making the most high-performance parts should have the upper-hand. If they refused to do business in China, the Chinese government and citizens would be forced to mass-import their CPUs and not be able to control them. ARM is not even close to ready to run Chinese data centers. Of course, this would incentivize China to immediately do everything they could to replace Intel and AMD, but they could be forced to grovel in the meantime. And Intel and AMD can feel comfortable they aren't supporting genocide (at least according to the UN).
- systemvoltage 5y ago
  Companies aren't to blame. Our lawmakers are. They need to pass laws that protect US interests but for last 3 decades, they've sold the American worker's soul to the CCP & private-gov enterprise in China. Apple spent $275 billion to boost Chinese manufacturing, but fuck-all to do anything in US. They could have built a whole ecosystem of US electronics manufacturers and make everything in US + Mexico, but their shareholders will never vote for it. So, laws must be passed to force them. The revolving door in DC has crushed the working class people of US and the same goes on in EU, the west generally. [1] https://www.theinformation.com/articles/facing-hostile-chinese-authorities-apple-ceo-signed-275-billion-deal-with-them https://www.theinformation.com/articles/facing-hostile-chine...
  - sangnoir 5y ago
    > They need to pass laws that protect US interests but for last 3 decades, they've sold the American worker's soul to the CCP & private-gov enterprise in China. Companies are not blameless - it's a 2-step process. Lawmakers sold the American worker's soul to capital (companies), and the companies sold them on to China, with a fat markup. The motivations are clear: politicians get donations and cushy jobs, the company executives get very rich due to increased short-term profits and increased valuations on the hope of establishing a foothold in a humongous growth market, China gets tech transfer, exports and a skilled workforce, and American workers get nothing, save perhaps a tiny sliver of company ownership through a 401k, if they are lucky to have one.
    - otherotherchris 5y ago
      Typical American narcissism. The reality is that China's farsighted rulers don't want to be a US client state/ colonial possession and have imposed strict rules on market participants in exchange for access to their 1.5 billion consumer market. American businesses can put up or shut up.
duped 5y ago
The current FTC and DoJ leadership are the most anti-trust since the (first) Roosevelt administration, it seems (nevermind that they were established after the fact, I'm being hyperbolic)

gjsman-1000 5y ago

If I have one wish for AMD, I wish that they would make FPGAs (and Xilinx) a more open and diverse platform like the PC. Not that the PC is perfect (there's still closed-source firmware), but any improvement to the current state of FPGAs would be welcomed.

brian_herman 5y ago
Yeah a co processor with fpga on it or even an expansion card I can buy at micro center for 100 bucks would be great!
- gjsman-1000 5y ago
  Or even better, a useful FPGA that is inside the Ryzen processor itself. It might be very small, but if it was standardized, had an easier way to program it, and programs could load acceleration routines into it, that would be so cool.
  - rjsw 5y ago
    Intel has done the equivalent with some Xeon processors. The chiplet design of current AMD CPUs should make this even easier to do.
  - opportune 5y ago
    This is what I’ve been thinking about for ages. It could be a huge accomplishment and greatly improve efficiency for scientific computing, data analytics and OLAP, cloud gaming, general backend development, etc
lnsru 5y ago
What’s wrong with current state except that the chips have lead time of 52+ weeks?
- colejohnson66 5y ago
  The development side. Compiling and simulating your Verilog/VHDL can be done with open source software, but to put it on the FPGA itself, you generally need closed source (and sometimes paid) tools to generate the bitstreams. Contrast that with microcontrollers such as the ATMega which can be programmed from start to finish using an entirely FOSS stack - even the bootloader and programmer. And for some reason, these companies consider the bitstream formats trade secrets and refuse to document them at all.

CountSessine 5y ago

Why? Has Intel done anything with Altera? I’m curious. AMD’s acquisition of ATI is generally viewed as a strategic error. Does this make more sense?

Symmetry 5y ago
There are some interesting datacenter interconnect implications, especially around the new CXL spec. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compute_Express_Link https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compute_Express_Link
lnsru 5y ago
Intel sold power electronics group(?) for 85 million dollar, that Altera bought for 140 million: https://www.anandtech.com/show/16257/mediatek-subsidiary-to-acquire-intel-enpirion-business-for-85-million https://www.anandtech.com/show/16257/mediatek-subsidiary-to-... I also know that many clients ditched SoCs with ARM cores from Altera when Intel acquired it being afraid that Intel does not like these alien cores.
chomp 5y ago
> AMD’s acquisition of ATI is generally viewed as a strategic error. Historically it was (when AMD was drowning in debt from the acquisition and had no competitive processors on the timeline), but is this still true? For instance, all of the major game consoles (ps4/ps5/xbone/xbox series x/switch) use AMD boards, and as I recall, those deals lifted the company's financials quite well.
- KeyBoardG 5y ago
  Agreed, although Switch uses NVidia Tegra, not AMD this generation.
  - libertine 5y ago
    For now they do, honestly it would make more sense to maybe consider an AMD SoC.

msapaydin 5y ago

I was awarded an FPGA chip by Xilinx that I blogged about: http://msapaydin.wordpress.com http://msapaydin.wordpress.com They are making an effort to promote the use of Xilinx fpga's on machine learning, recently.

homarp 5y ago
https://msapaydin.wordpress.com/2021/11/01/xilinx-and-ai/ https://msapaydin.wordpress.com/2021/11/01/xilinx-and-ai/ right ?
- msapaydin 5y ago
  Yes, thank you. Sorry I am on mobile, traveling and could not post the full link.

intricatedetail 5y ago

I hope they won't kill their CPLD line that has been obsoleted several times and then pushed back. It's a lifesaver for designing digital circuits if you don't want to use a ton of 74 chips.

dragontamer 5y ago
It was my understanding Lattice's FPGAs / CPLDs are more tailored for the smaller (possibly hobbyist scale) EEs out there. Bonus points: Lattice has turned a blind eye at the open source community, meaning Lattice's FPGAs / CPLDs have open-source toolsets. Kinda sad that "blind eye" is the best we can hope for from these companies, but that's how it is for now...
- jlokier 5y ago
  Not all these companies. QuickLogic openly embraces open source tooling.for their FPGAs.

anthk 5y ago

This is bad.