4 ms·

If something is required to survive, it is by definition not a free market. Texas either needs to go all the way and let people freeze to death without getting

If something is required to survive, it is by definition not a free market. Texas either needs to go all the way and let people freeze to death without getting bailed out or they need to re-regulate. This middle ground where the market is free until there's a market failure is simply moral hazard.

MisterBastahrd 5y ago
Even not quite so extreme, going without power for an extended period of time basically forces you to throw all your refrigerated and frozen food away. It takes months each times this happens for the supply chain to catch up with the new and unexpected demand.
- sokoloff 5y ago
  If it’s -2°F outside, many people can figure out a way to save their frozen food.
  - seanmcdirmid 5y ago
    Small hole in the wall stores in Harbin don’t bother putting ice cream in freezer sun the winter.
ryan93 5y ago
How are you so sure that regulators would have required protection against a once in a hundred year storm? What doesnt the Democratic republic of the Congo regulate the poverty out of existence? Hindsight is 20/20
- simfree 5y ago
  Rolling blackouts occured during the Groundhog Day Blizzard in 2011 as well: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2021_Texas_power_crisis#Background https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2021_Texas_power_crisis#Back... Competent regulators can see the past and prepare for things that happened a decade ago to reoccur.
- xxpor 5y ago
  ERCOT/TX explicitly creating their own grid so they're not regulated by FERC (which covers literally the entire rest of the country) suggests that perhaps they don't have ratepayer's best interests at heart. I'd love to know if anyone's written anything about say, FERC vs ERCOT's gas pipeline winterization requirements.
  - salawat 5y ago
    I'd advise looking into some Texas history first. Part of the isolated grid was in response to the unreliability of other actors on the National grid. Yeah. When you go independent it sucks when you set yourself up to not be helped by anyone else; but in general you at least know squarely where to place blame when it blows up in your face.
    - thephyber 5y ago
      As someone who grew up in Texas, Texas history (not just of their electric grid) is crazy. The Alamo was about illegal immigrants from the USA fighting for the right to keep cotton-picking slaves in Mexican territory, then revolting when the Mexican military came to enforce the law. And it was a tactical loss for the revolution. It’s crazy that it managed to become a rallying cry.
      - vorpalhex 5y ago
        You have over-simplified to the point of being incorrect. The Alamo is one of many battles during the Texas revolution which primarily occurred due to the move of Mexico to a centralized power instead of a federalized one. Texas had already endured a constitutional change, increased taxes, immigration being made illegal and changes in the legality of slavery. While Santa Anna blamed "illegal immigrants" heavily, he also was basically conscripting anyone and everyone to form his army which likely tied into his continual set of losses. The Alamo is the first to fall when the Mexican army, coming from the heart of Mexico, re-enters Texas. During the fighting, Texas formally declared independence from Mexico. The Alamo falls. A few days later the Texan army catches up with the Mexican army and crushes them, with claims the men are shouting "Remember the Alamo".
- JaimeThompson 5y ago
  The Texas grid had similar issues in 1989 and very little was done to fix the issues. If the rumors I have heard are true then Texas lost the new Intel fab in large part because of the unreliable power grid.
- trinovantes 5y ago
  You mean the "hundred year storms" that happened in 1989, 2011, and 2021?
  - thephyber 5y ago
    I think this should be discussed more. The frequency of outlier storms is higher than the actuarial tables were designed for. The line that delineates “hundred year storm” seems to be mislocated in the actuarial tables. This seems to happen with hurricanes, floods, fires, and these polar vortex storms bringing extreme cold down into the lower continental US.

MisterBastahrd 5y ago

Even not quite so extreme, going without power for an extended period of time basically forces you to throw all your refrigerated and frozen food away. It takes months each times this happens for the supply chain to catch up with the new and unexpected demand.

sokoloff 5y ago
If it’s -2°F outside, many people can figure out a way to save their frozen food.
- seanmcdirmid 5y ago
  Small hole in the wall stores in Harbin don’t bother putting ice cream in freezer sun the winter.

ryan93 5y ago

How are you so sure that regulators would have required protection against a once in a hundred year storm? What doesnt the Democratic republic of the Congo regulate the poverty out of existence? Hindsight is 20/20

simfree 5y ago
Rolling blackouts occured during the Groundhog Day Blizzard in 2011 as well: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2021_Texas_power_crisis#Background https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2021_Texas_power_crisis#Back... Competent regulators can see the past and prepare for things that happened a decade ago to reoccur.
xxpor 5y ago
ERCOT/TX explicitly creating their own grid so they're not regulated by FERC (which covers literally the entire rest of the country) suggests that perhaps they don't have ratepayer's best interests at heart. I'd love to know if anyone's written anything about say, FERC vs ERCOT's gas pipeline winterization requirements.
- salawat 5y ago
  I'd advise looking into some Texas history first. Part of the isolated grid was in response to the unreliability of other actors on the National grid. Yeah. When you go independent it sucks when you set yourself up to not be helped by anyone else; but in general you at least know squarely where to place blame when it blows up in your face.
  - thephyber 5y ago
    As someone who grew up in Texas, Texas history (not just of their electric grid) is crazy. The Alamo was about illegal immigrants from the USA fighting for the right to keep cotton-picking slaves in Mexican territory, then revolting when the Mexican military came to enforce the law. And it was a tactical loss for the revolution. It’s crazy that it managed to become a rallying cry.
    - vorpalhex 5y ago
      You have over-simplified to the point of being incorrect. The Alamo is one of many battles during the Texas revolution which primarily occurred due to the move of Mexico to a centralized power instead of a federalized one. Texas had already endured a constitutional change, increased taxes, immigration being made illegal and changes in the legality of slavery. While Santa Anna blamed "illegal immigrants" heavily, he also was basically conscripting anyone and everyone to form his army which likely tied into his continual set of losses. The Alamo is the first to fall when the Mexican army, coming from the heart of Mexico, re-enters Texas. During the fighting, Texas formally declared independence from Mexico. The Alamo falls. A few days later the Texan army catches up with the Mexican army and crushes them, with claims the men are shouting "Remember the Alamo".
JaimeThompson 5y ago
The Texas grid had similar issues in 1989 and very little was done to fix the issues. If the rumors I have heard are true then Texas lost the new Intel fab in large part because of the unreliable power grid.
trinovantes 5y ago
You mean the "hundred year storms" that happened in 1989, 2011, and 2021?
- thephyber 5y ago
  I think this should be discussed more. The frequency of outlier storms is higher than the actuarial tables were designed for. The line that delineates “hundred year storm” seems to be mislocated in the actuarial tables. This seems to happen with hurricanes, floods, fires, and these polar vortex storms bringing extreme cold down into the lower continental US.