5 ms·

You can't make any conclusions on a 100 million podcast based off your personal experience talking to people in your bubble, unless your definition of 'plenty o

by iaml 5y ago

You can't make any conclusions on a 100 million podcast based off your personal experience talking to people in your bubble, unless your definition of 'plenty of people' is 0.00001% of audience (I'm estimating the number of people you surveyed at 1000, but do correct me if I'm wrong).

YEwSdObPQT 5y ago
I was expecting such a reply. It is really frustrating talking to people with an attitude such as yours. He has a large inter-national audience and the number of people that have watched his podcast is in the 10s if not 100s of millions. That is more people than a lot of countries in Europe. Yet you find it hard to believe that the audience can have diverse (in the truest sense of the word)? That is quite frankly moronic. As for the people I've talked to about it. These are people in aren't in my "bubble". I simply had a passing conversation with them in a break-room or on a Slack call (I work remote now) while waiting for people to filter in or some random people I've spoken to on Discord. These are not close friends, or people I even regularly speak to.
- iaml 5y ago
  > Yet you find it hard to believe that the audience can have diverse (in the truest sense of the word)? I find it hard to believe because up to this point you've made zero effort to offer any proof of that apart from 'trust me bro'. I'm skeptical that Joe has a diverse audience because to have that you need to make an effort, and from what podcasts I've listened of his he became noticeably less accepting of other viewpoints over time, on some topics like covid especially. This could easily lead towards radicalization of his audience, but you just dismiss this possibility. He should really follow his old advice and go to woods and do some ayahuasca, his third eye is fully closed at this point.
  - Sargos 5y ago
    It's obvious that Rogan has a diverse audience from looking at the facts. It's up to you to provide evidence to the contrary or you will have proven yourself to be arguing in bad faith which wastes people's time and harms discourse.
    - iaml 5y ago
      From what I could gather, this whole 'cancel jre' movement is fueled by his covid stance, which many consider contrary to current medical recommendations. Judging from the fact that democrats are more vaccinated [0] I'm making the assumption that they would be more likely to have a problem with his views, meaning his audience is less likely to be mostly bipartisan, reducing the diversity and increasing polarization. What can we call a diverse audience and does Joe have it? Only Joe and spotify know, but my point is it's trending downwards. [0] https://www.kff.org/coronavirus-covid-19/poll-finding/kff-covid-19-vaccine-monitor-february-2021/ https://www.kff.org/coronavirus-covid-19/poll-finding/kff-co...
      - YEwSdObPQT 5y ago
        The cancel JRE movement has been going on for a long time. He has been attacked for years by the same people. He is competition (and an effective competition) to traditional news and media. They don't like that because he is a self made man and not beholden to them they have nothing to control him with. His questioning of the official wisdom is just the latest thing they have attacked him on.
  - YEwSdObPQT 5y ago
    > find it hard to believe because up to this point you've made zero effort to offer any proof of that apart from 'trust me bro'. You and I both have no accurate metrics on his audience demographic. We are not privvy to it. However I can infer from the size and the fact it is inter-nation that the idea that only people that fit inline with the "US Conservative" viewpoint cannot be correct. Which was the original claim I was responding to. I am not asking you to "trust me bro". I am asking you to use some good judgement. As for Joe Rogan being conservative leaning is that is a nonsense. He is in support of socialised of healthcare, legalisation of cannabis and other viewpoints that many conservatives in the US are deeply opposed to. If you need any evidence of this watch his interview with Steven Crowder. They were at compete loggerheads about it. I was quite shocked at the time as the interview become extremely combative. > I'm skeptic that Joe has a diverse audience because to have that you need to make an effort, and from what podcasts I've listened of his he became much less accepting of other viewpoints over time, on some topics like covid especially. What Joe believe and his audience believes maybe different things. You are making the mistake that many people make of assuming that because somebody watches or supports somebody that they fall inline with the views of the host. Nothing could be further from the truth. What Joe Rogan brings to the table is long form discussions with a guests that are generally aren't combative. The listeners can make up their own minds. This idea that people are too stupid to make up their own minds has is the bigotry of low expectations. > This could easily lead towards radicalization of his audience, but you just dismiss this possibility. He should really follow his old advice and go to woods and do some ayahuasca, his third eye is fully closed at this point. The radicalisation accusations comes from older news media which he is in direct competition to. I can dismiss it on those grounds alone. Joe Rogan is only guilty of having conversations that are deemed to be verboten in the current political climate. What is deemed to be verboten and what isn't is subject to political expediency.
    - iaml 5y ago
      > You and I both have no accurate metrics on his audience demographic. We are not privvy to it. However I can infer from the size and the fact it is inter-nation that the idea that only people that fit inline with the "US Conservative" viewpoint cannot be correct. Which was the original claim I was responding to. I am not asking you to "trust me bro". I am asking you to use some good judgement. My opinion of him attracting more conservative (not just US by the way) audience is based on his antivax stance, which is very popular among them, and he seems to shoehorn this topic quite frequently in his recent episodes. > As for Joe Rogan being conservative leaning is that is a nonsense. He is in support of socialised of healthcare, legalisation of cannabis and other viewpoints that many conservatives in the US are deeply opposed to. If you need any evidence of this watch his interview with Steven Crowder. They were at compete loggerheads about it. I was quite shocked at the time as the interview become extremely combative. I didn't watch it before because it's Crowder but you piqued my interest here, I'll have to watch it later. > The radicalisation accusations comes from older news media which he is in direct competition to. I'm not taking this argument from older media, I don't read it. I have visited /r/JoeRogan a lot over the years, and the discussions there changed quite a bit. The difference between new and old listeners and the discussions/opinions they have is quite palpable, although not scientifically admissible sadly.
  - graderjs 5y ago
    Unforunately, nobody has to "prove" anything against your skepticism. It's up to you to educate yourself. To claim the reverse is not an argument tactic, it doesn't prove anything, besides the fact that you seem to be lazy and think other people should do your bidding/run errands for you. We're not your research assistants, hah! But for a more meta and enlightening take, check out dang's comments on why any sufficiently large community/audience can often incorrectly seem to one person as biased toward a certain stance, when in reality it's that person's bias, rather than the community, that skews their interpretation. Dang explains it way better than I could: https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&query=dang%20bias&sort=byDate&type=comment https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&qu... and https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&query=by%3Adang%20dislike%20notice&sort=byDate&type=story&type=comment https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que...
    - iaml 5y ago
      Thank you for linking the dislike-notice bias comments, dang makes a good point here.
      - graderjs 5y ago
        No worries! Yeah it is a good point, eh?! :)
misiti3780 5y ago
You just did above. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30219325#30221054 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30219325#30221054
- iaml 5y ago
  Did you link the correct comment? To be clear, I have no idea what objective audience he has, but I would like to know.

by iaml 5y ago

YEwSdObPQT 5y ago

I was expecting such a reply. It is really frustrating talking to people with an attitude such as yours. He has a large inter-national audience and the number of people that have watched his podcast is in the 10s if not 100s of millions. That is more people than a lot of countries in Europe. Yet you find it hard to believe that the audience can have diverse (in the truest sense of the word)? That is quite frankly moronic. As for the people I've talked to about it. These are people in aren't in my "bubble". I simply had a passing conversation with them in a break-room or on a Slack call (I work remote now) while waiting for people to filter in or some random people I've spoken to on Discord. These are not close friends, or people I even regularly speak to.

iaml 5y ago
> Yet you find it hard to believe that the audience can have diverse (in the truest sense of the word)? I find it hard to believe because up to this point you've made zero effort to offer any proof of that apart from 'trust me bro'. I'm skeptical that Joe has a diverse audience because to have that you need to make an effort, and from what podcasts I've listened of his he became noticeably less accepting of other viewpoints over time, on some topics like covid especially. This could easily lead towards radicalization of his audience, but you just dismiss this possibility. He should really follow his old advice and go to woods and do some ayahuasca, his third eye is fully closed at this point.
- Sargos 5y ago
  It's obvious that Rogan has a diverse audience from looking at the facts. It's up to you to provide evidence to the contrary or you will have proven yourself to be arguing in bad faith which wastes people's time and harms discourse.
  - iaml 5y ago
    From what I could gather, this whole 'cancel jre' movement is fueled by his covid stance, which many consider contrary to current medical recommendations. Judging from the fact that democrats are more vaccinated [0] I'm making the assumption that they would be more likely to have a problem with his views, meaning his audience is less likely to be mostly bipartisan, reducing the diversity and increasing polarization. What can we call a diverse audience and does Joe have it? Only Joe and spotify know, but my point is it's trending downwards. [0] https://www.kff.org/coronavirus-covid-19/poll-finding/kff-covid-19-vaccine-monitor-february-2021/ https://www.kff.org/coronavirus-covid-19/poll-finding/kff-co...
    - YEwSdObPQT 5y ago
      The cancel JRE movement has been going on for a long time. He has been attacked for years by the same people. He is competition (and an effective competition) to traditional news and media. They don't like that because he is a self made man and not beholden to them they have nothing to control him with. His questioning of the official wisdom is just the latest thing they have attacked him on.
- YEwSdObPQT 5y ago
  > find it hard to believe because up to this point you've made zero effort to offer any proof of that apart from 'trust me bro'. You and I both have no accurate metrics on his audience demographic. We are not privvy to it. However I can infer from the size and the fact it is inter-nation that the idea that only people that fit inline with the "US Conservative" viewpoint cannot be correct. Which was the original claim I was responding to. I am not asking you to "trust me bro". I am asking you to use some good judgement. As for Joe Rogan being conservative leaning is that is a nonsense. He is in support of socialised of healthcare, legalisation of cannabis and other viewpoints that many conservatives in the US are deeply opposed to. If you need any evidence of this watch his interview with Steven Crowder. They were at compete loggerheads about it. I was quite shocked at the time as the interview become extremely combative. > I'm skeptic that Joe has a diverse audience because to have that you need to make an effort, and from what podcasts I've listened of his he became much less accepting of other viewpoints over time, on some topics like covid especially. What Joe believe and his audience believes maybe different things. You are making the mistake that many people make of assuming that because somebody watches or supports somebody that they fall inline with the views of the host. Nothing could be further from the truth. What Joe Rogan brings to the table is long form discussions with a guests that are generally aren't combative. The listeners can make up their own minds. This idea that people are too stupid to make up their own minds has is the bigotry of low expectations. > This could easily lead towards radicalization of his audience, but you just dismiss this possibility. He should really follow his old advice and go to woods and do some ayahuasca, his third eye is fully closed at this point. The radicalisation accusations comes from older news media which he is in direct competition to. I can dismiss it on those grounds alone. Joe Rogan is only guilty of having conversations that are deemed to be verboten in the current political climate. What is deemed to be verboten and what isn't is subject to political expediency.
  - iaml 5y ago
    > You and I both have no accurate metrics on his audience demographic. We are not privvy to it. However I can infer from the size and the fact it is inter-nation that the idea that only people that fit inline with the "US Conservative" viewpoint cannot be correct. Which was the original claim I was responding to. I am not asking you to "trust me bro". I am asking you to use some good judgement. My opinion of him attracting more conservative (not just US by the way) audience is based on his antivax stance, which is very popular among them, and he seems to shoehorn this topic quite frequently in his recent episodes. > As for Joe Rogan being conservative leaning is that is a nonsense. He is in support of socialised of healthcare, legalisation of cannabis and other viewpoints that many conservatives in the US are deeply opposed to. If you need any evidence of this watch his interview with Steven Crowder. They were at compete loggerheads about it. I was quite shocked at the time as the interview become extremely combative. I didn't watch it before because it's Crowder but you piqued my interest here, I'll have to watch it later. > The radicalisation accusations comes from older news media which he is in direct competition to. I'm not taking this argument from older media, I don't read it. I have visited /r/JoeRogan a lot over the years, and the discussions there changed quite a bit. The difference between new and old listeners and the discussions/opinions they have is quite palpable, although not scientifically admissible sadly.
- graderjs 5y ago
  Unforunately, nobody has to "prove" anything against your skepticism. It's up to you to educate yourself. To claim the reverse is not an argument tactic, it doesn't prove anything, besides the fact that you seem to be lazy and think other people should do your bidding/run errands for you. We're not your research assistants, hah! But for a more meta and enlightening take, check out dang's comments on why any sufficiently large community/audience can often incorrectly seem to one person as biased toward a certain stance, when in reality it's that person's bias, rather than the community, that skews their interpretation. Dang explains it way better than I could: https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&query=dang%20bias&sort=byDate&type=comment https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&qu... and https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&query=by%3Adang%20dislike%20notice&sort=byDate&type=story&type=comment https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que...
  - iaml 5y ago
    Thank you for linking the dislike-notice bias comments, dang makes a good point here.
    - graderjs 5y ago
      No worries! Yeah it is a good point, eh?! :)

misiti3780 5y ago

You just did above. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30219325#30221054 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30219325#30221054

iaml 5y ago
Did you link the correct comment? To be clear, I have no idea what objective audience he has, but I would like to know.