4 ms·

They do. And so does United, SWA, AA, etc. The thought process is that an unruly passenger on United, for example, should be banned from all airlines and air l

They do. And so does United, SWA, AA, etc. The thought process is that an unruly passenger on United, for example, should be banned from all airlines and air lines so they can’t go cause trouble elsewhere. I think the airlines are asking the government to step in because they’re not sure they can legally work together to ban people from all air travel. I believe a government process is the correct answer here but only with due process and guard rails.

imroot 5y ago
They share common reservations systems, so, it wouldn't surprise me if SABRE or another GDS shares no-fly lists. I seem to recall that American, United, and Delta all use/implement Sabre in some form or another, and possibly shared a no-fly/ban list...but, my memory is a bit hazy on that.
quantified 5y ago
Right, cartel-like denial of service behavior raises real issues. Suppose all payment systems, or Facebook, Tiktok, and Substack together decided on deplatforming alliances?
- zionic 5y ago
  Oh just you wait, someone is gonna try it. “CommonBan” will try to aggregate bans across huge swaths of disparate entities one day.
  - bitwize 5y ago
    The head of Microsoft's Xbox division is urging Sony and Nintendo to ban players that Microsoft deems ban-worthy. I won't be surprised if entire industries have Shinigami Eyes style blacklists of people considered too toxic to be allowed any kind of business involving whatever that industry provides within a decade or so.
- ryandrake 5y ago
  In the event that an airline-shared no-fly list takes hold: In a free market, anyone is free to start an alternative airline that ignores the shared no-fly list. I'll leave it as an exercise to the reader to think about how that airline's average passenger will behave. You could call it ParlerAir.
ClumsyPilot 5y ago
And if a company put you on that list by mistake or plain lies, what is tour recourse and how much compensation do they owe you? Which neutral party will listen to your side of the story?
- soneil 5y ago
  It does specify "convicted" in the article, which seems like a sane bar to set.
  - ipaddr 5y ago
    Mistakes get made. Who monitors if the list valid?
nilsbunger 5y ago
Is it true that the airlines can’t offer a way to share the list? I understand how that would be misused since there’s no due process, but I’m curious if there’s a legal reason that prevents them
- chii 5y ago
  casinos do it for known cheaters and card counters etc. The airline just wants the gov't to do something for free so that they don't have to put any work or expend resources doing it!
  - sigstoat 5y ago
    > The airline just wants the gov't to do something for free so that they don't have to put any work or expend resources doing it! probably also lets them dodge blame. "oh you're on the no-fly list, take it up with the feds."
- heavyset_go 5y ago
  I doubt it. Retailers share lists of problem customers with other local store owners. If someone takes products at one store without paying, owners figure that they'll probably try to take products from another store nearby.
coin 5y ago
> not sure they can legally work together to ban people from all air trave This is sort of already done with consumer credit agencies
- jquery 5y ago
  How so?
Ekaros 5y ago
Hmm, what about using it for other reasons. Say payment dispute or other disputes. Should airlines be allowed to add those passengers on the list too and share the list with others. I see no reason why not.
- quantified 5y ago
  Social credit scores, anyone?

imroot 5y ago

They share common reservations systems, so, it wouldn't surprise me if SABRE or another GDS shares no-fly lists. I seem to recall that American, United, and Delta all use/implement Sabre in some form or another, and possibly shared a no-fly/ban list...but, my memory is a bit hazy on that.

quantified 5y ago

Right, cartel-like denial of service behavior raises real issues. Suppose all payment systems, or Facebook, Tiktok, and Substack together decided on deplatforming alliances?

zionic 5y ago
Oh just you wait, someone is gonna try it. “CommonBan” will try to aggregate bans across huge swaths of disparate entities one day.
- bitwize 5y ago
  The head of Microsoft's Xbox division is urging Sony and Nintendo to ban players that Microsoft deems ban-worthy. I won't be surprised if entire industries have Shinigami Eyes style blacklists of people considered too toxic to be allowed any kind of business involving whatever that industry provides within a decade or so.
ryandrake 5y ago
In the event that an airline-shared no-fly list takes hold: In a free market, anyone is free to start an alternative airline that ignores the shared no-fly list. I'll leave it as an exercise to the reader to think about how that airline's average passenger will behave. You could call it ParlerAir.

ClumsyPilot 5y ago

And if a company put you on that list by mistake or plain lies, what is tour recourse and how much compensation do they owe you? Which neutral party will listen to your side of the story?

soneil 5y ago
It does specify "convicted" in the article, which seems like a sane bar to set.
- ipaddr 5y ago
  Mistakes get made. Who monitors if the list valid?

nilsbunger 5y ago

Is it true that the airlines can’t offer a way to share the list? I understand how that would be misused since there’s no due process, but I’m curious if there’s a legal reason that prevents them

chii 5y ago
casinos do it for known cheaters and card counters etc. The airline just wants the gov't to do something for free so that they don't have to put any work or expend resources doing it!
- sigstoat 5y ago
  > The airline just wants the gov't to do something for free so that they don't have to put any work or expend resources doing it! probably also lets them dodge blame. "oh you're on the no-fly list, take it up with the feds."
heavyset_go 5y ago
I doubt it. Retailers share lists of problem customers with other local store owners. If someone takes products at one store without paying, owners figure that they'll probably try to take products from another store nearby.

coin 5y ago

> not sure they can legally work together to ban people from all air trave This is sort of already done with consumer credit agencies

jquery 5y ago
How so?

Ekaros 5y ago

Hmm, what about using it for other reasons. Say payment dispute or other disputes. Should airlines be allowed to add those passengers on the list too and share the list with others. I see no reason why not.

quantified 5y ago
Social credit scores, anyone?