5 ms·

Safari unfortunately goes too far the other way, it very aggressively caches the favicon so it can't be easily updated for things like unread counts. Gmail has

Safari unfortunately goes too far the other way, it very aggressively caches the favicon so it can't be easily updated for things like unread counts. Gmail has a useful feature you can turn where it shows you unread email count in the favicon, great for pined tabs. It's completely useless in Safari, just gets stuck for days at a time. https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/339350/safari-12-favicon-in-gmail-tab-shows-incorrect-e-mail-count https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/339350/safari-12-f...

capitainenemo 5y ago
That could be a tracking protection feature in Safari? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26051370 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26051370 The part where the author files a bug to get caching "fixed" in Firefox is also interesting. https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1618257 https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1618257 Edit... Sorry. Actually, I forgot how the abuse worked, it relies on persistent caching. So Firefox doesn't cache, preventing bookmark tracking. Safari aggressively caches, so would. Any amount of caching would be a problem. Hm... unless Safari never checks for updates to the Favicon at all. That would defeat the exploit as well. So very aggressive caching with no check for updates, also good? Ok. I stand by my original guess :)
- samwillis 5y ago
  If it's to prevent tracking I'm all for it, but I would love them to then provide an API to enable favicon overlays for badges/notifications (in a tracking abuse free way). Maybe, just maybe, with the news they are finally implementing Web Push Notifications and the suggestion it's the first step towards supporting PWAs, they might create a icon badge api for both the favicon but also PWA icons.
- SilasX 5y ago
  >That could be a tracking protection feature in Safari? Heh, that feels like the Web in a nutshell: Devs: "Hey, wouldn't it be convenient if we cached--" Advertisers: "Aha! Another means to track people!"
- soperj 5y ago
  Classic "that's not a bug that's a feature"
TrueGeek 5y ago
omg, thank you. I've always wondered why my work email count was wonky.
shazron 5y ago
Quoting Apple engineer Brady Eidson: "We (Apple) intentionally do not want the ability to script favicons." source 1: https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=95979 https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=95979 source 2: https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=75877#c1 https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=75877#c1
- samwillis 5y ago
  Thank you, I went looking for the bug report but couldn't find it. 2012 is a long time ago in the time of the web, hopefully opinions have changed. I think back then Safari didn't have the ability to show favicons in the bookmark toolbar where this is useful, it does now.
- londons_explore 5y ago
  This is part of apples model that the web is for static reference material, and anything more complex should be an app in the apple ecosystem. Apple goes to great lengths to make sure webapps can't be too useful for the user.
  - nefitty 5y ago
    Sound is weird on iOS web. Also, they basically unilaterally decided to say "nah, we're good" to web Bluetooth. I think that could have opened up a lot of awesome stuff. As it stands, getting that to work is possible but the steps to get there are multiplied ten-fold.
    - gbear605 5y ago
      Thank god that Apple never implemented web Bluetooth. One more thing that I don’t have to worry about my web browser mucking with. Please keep the browser out of my peripherals.
      - seanw444 5y ago
        Seriously. Why does everything have to be a web API.
Tempest1981 5y ago
Isn't caching a different issue than playing the animation? The Mozilla issue was (initially) focused on stopping ongoing distracting animations.
tjoff 5y ago
Or just use a native application instead of butchering the web to do a poor job of it.

capitainenemo 5y ago

That could be a tracking protection feature in Safari? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26051370 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26051370 The part where the author files a bug to get caching "fixed" in Firefox is also interesting. https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1618257 https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1618257 Edit... Sorry. Actually, I forgot how the abuse worked, it relies on persistent caching. So Firefox doesn't cache, preventing bookmark tracking. Safari aggressively caches, so would. Any amount of caching would be a problem. Hm... unless Safari never checks for updates to the Favicon at all. That would defeat the exploit as well. So very aggressive caching with no check for updates, also good? Ok. I stand by my original guess :)

samwillis 5y ago
If it's to prevent tracking I'm all for it, but I would love them to then provide an API to enable favicon overlays for badges/notifications (in a tracking abuse free way). Maybe, just maybe, with the news they are finally implementing Web Push Notifications and the suggestion it's the first step towards supporting PWAs, they might create a icon badge api for both the favicon but also PWA icons.
SilasX 5y ago
>That could be a tracking protection feature in Safari? Heh, that feels like the Web in a nutshell: Devs: "Hey, wouldn't it be convenient if we cached--" Advertisers: "Aha! Another means to track people!"
soperj 5y ago
Classic "that's not a bug that's a feature"

TrueGeek 5y ago

omg, thank you. I've always wondered why my work email count was wonky.

shazron 5y ago

Quoting Apple engineer Brady Eidson: "We (Apple) intentionally do not want the ability to script favicons." source 1: https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=95979 https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=95979 source 2: https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=75877#c1 https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=75877#c1

samwillis 5y ago
Thank you, I went looking for the bug report but couldn't find it. 2012 is a long time ago in the time of the web, hopefully opinions have changed. I think back then Safari didn't have the ability to show favicons in the bookmark toolbar where this is useful, it does now.
londons_explore 5y ago
This is part of apples model that the web is for static reference material, and anything more complex should be an app in the apple ecosystem. Apple goes to great lengths to make sure webapps can't be too useful for the user.
- nefitty 5y ago
  Sound is weird on iOS web. Also, they basically unilaterally decided to say "nah, we're good" to web Bluetooth. I think that could have opened up a lot of awesome stuff. As it stands, getting that to work is possible but the steps to get there are multiplied ten-fold.
  - gbear605 5y ago
    Thank god that Apple never implemented web Bluetooth. One more thing that I don’t have to worry about my web browser mucking with. Please keep the browser out of my peripherals.
    - seanw444 5y ago
      Seriously. Why does everything have to be a web API.

Tempest1981 5y ago

Isn't caching a different issue than playing the animation? The Mozilla issue was (initially) focused on stopping ongoing distracting animations.

tjoff 5y ago

Or just use a native application instead of butchering the web to do a poor job of it.