6 ms·

That’s not the end state anyone who knows anything about this virus is expecting or aiming at at the moment. And it hasn’t been for months and months. Universa

by arrrg 5y ago

That’s not the end state anyone who knows anything about this virus is expecting or aiming at at the moment. And it hasn’t been for months and months. Universal vaccination can make the transition of this virus from pandemic to endemic much more pleasant. In terms of deaths, serious cases (with potential long term effects), but also in terms of smoothing out hospital and infrastructure load. In that respect the vaccines are an awesomely effective tool that can greatly reduce suffering with minimal or no real downsides. Side note: an omicron infection is no replacement for the vaccination. Omicron doesn’t confer great immunity against delta and other, “older” virus variants which are still out there, potentially ready to come back next winter.

inglor_cz 5y ago
"Omicron doesn’t confer great immunity against delta" It is my impression that it actually does, and that is why Delta was outcompeted so fast. If it didn't, both strains would likely co-circulate together.
- andai 5y ago
  Does anyone know where I can find graphs that show the % of infections that each variant represents over time?
  - inglor_cz 5y ago
    I used to see them all the time on Reddit in the r/Coronavirus subreddit. Searching very quickly, I found this from Dec 21, 2021: https://www.statnews.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/12/c7efM-omicron-is-likely-the-most-common-variant-in-the-u-s-2.png https://www.statnews.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/12/c7efM-om...
  - YZF 5y ago
    BC, Canada: http://www.bccdc.ca/Health-Info-Site/Documents/VoC/VoC_Weekly_20220128.pdf http://www.bccdc.ca/Health-Info-Site/Documents/VoC/VoC_Weekl...
  - nradov 5y ago
    The CDC publishes weekly data on variant percentages. https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#variant-proportions https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#variant-proportion...
- LASR 5y ago
  Outcompeting is an immediate association between the two variants. Conferring x-variant immunity means that once you've recovered from one, you will have lasting immunity to other variants. There is a possibility that the large majority of the population has been infected with omicron, and recovered. But then delta could come in at that point and produce another wave. At this time, the body would be much more successful at holding off omicron, but maybe not so much with delta. So purely from the fractions of current infections, you cannot draw conclusions about x-variant immunity.
roenxi 5y ago
Why should I care what "anyone who knows anything about this virus" is expecting? The people writing the policies around vaccination are the ones who matter. There have been mass firings on the basis that this vaccination will end the pandemic and people who don't get vaccinated are actively harming everyone else. The truth of that claim is far too murky to justify the agressive policies that are being used to force people to get vacinated. Policies which, I note, appear to be deploy what are effectively human rights violations. These are not policieis that should be used. The policy response is what is important here.
- arrrg 5y ago
  People who are not vaccinate are definitely behaving in a deeply antisocial way and enforcing vaccines is very much a justified policy in my eyes, even if “only” to smooth over the transition from pandemic to endemic. To my eyes vaccine mandates are not, in general, human rights violations. They just are not.
  - nsxwolf 5y ago
    Tie them down and forcibly inject them then. Have some courage. Quit pussy footing around with economic threats and shaming.
    - spankalee 5y ago
      Why?
      - nsxwolf 5y ago
        Because morally it's the same thing, and it would get done faster and more effectively.
        mr_toad 5y ago
        Depends whether you are more concerned about vaccination rates, or with punishing people for being antisocial.
yetanotherath 5y ago
headsoup 5y ago
> Minimal to no real downsides Yet... Guess we gave up caring about full research and monitoring a couple of years ago. We're even at the point where we want to vaccinate our small children because 'it's marginally better than nothing' ignoring that side effects are also marginally more than nothing and we have very little good long term data.
rastignack 5y ago
> Omicron doesn’t confer great immunity against delta and other, “older” virus variants which are still out there, potentially ready to come back next winter. Care to share a paper to back this up ? This statement seems hard to prove right now.

by arrrg 5y ago

inglor_cz 5y ago

"Omicron doesn’t confer great immunity against delta" It is my impression that it actually does, and that is why Delta was outcompeted so fast. If it didn't, both strains would likely co-circulate together.

andai 5y ago
Does anyone know where I can find graphs that show the % of infections that each variant represents over time?
- inglor_cz 5y ago
  I used to see them all the time on Reddit in the r/Coronavirus subreddit. Searching very quickly, I found this from Dec 21, 2021: https://www.statnews.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/12/c7efM-omicron-is-likely-the-most-common-variant-in-the-u-s-2.png https://www.statnews.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/12/c7efM-om...
- YZF 5y ago
  BC, Canada: http://www.bccdc.ca/Health-Info-Site/Documents/VoC/VoC_Weekly_20220128.pdf http://www.bccdc.ca/Health-Info-Site/Documents/VoC/VoC_Weekl...
- nradov 5y ago
  The CDC publishes weekly data on variant percentages. https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#variant-proportions https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#variant-proportion...
LASR 5y ago
Outcompeting is an immediate association between the two variants. Conferring x-variant immunity means that once you've recovered from one, you will have lasting immunity to other variants. There is a possibility that the large majority of the population has been infected with omicron, and recovered. But then delta could come in at that point and produce another wave. At this time, the body would be much more successful at holding off omicron, but maybe not so much with delta. So purely from the fractions of current infections, you cannot draw conclusions about x-variant immunity.

roenxi 5y ago

Why should I care what "anyone who knows anything about this virus" is expecting? The people writing the policies around vaccination are the ones who matter. There have been mass firings on the basis that this vaccination will end the pandemic and people who don't get vaccinated are actively harming everyone else. The truth of that claim is far too murky to justify the agressive policies that are being used to force people to get vacinated. Policies which, I note, appear to be deploy what are effectively human rights violations. These are not policieis that should be used. The policy response is what is important here.

arrrg 5y ago
People who are not vaccinate are definitely behaving in a deeply antisocial way and enforcing vaccines is very much a justified policy in my eyes, even if “only” to smooth over the transition from pandemic to endemic. To my eyes vaccine mandates are not, in general, human rights violations. They just are not.
- nsxwolf 5y ago
  Tie them down and forcibly inject them then. Have some courage. Quit pussy footing around with economic threats and shaming.
  - spankalee 5y ago
    Why?
    - nsxwolf 5y ago
      Because morally it's the same thing, and it would get done faster and more effectively.
      - mr_toad 5y ago
        Depends whether you are more concerned about vaccination rates, or with punishing people for being antisocial.

yetanotherath 5y ago

headsoup 5y ago

> Minimal to no real downsides Yet... Guess we gave up caring about full research and monitoring a couple of years ago. We're even at the point where we want to vaccinate our small children because 'it's marginally better than nothing' ignoring that side effects are also marginally more than nothing and we have very little good long term data.

rastignack 5y ago

> Omicron doesn’t confer great immunity against delta and other, “older” virus variants which are still out there, potentially ready to come back next winter. Care to share a paper to back this up ? This statement seems hard to prove right now.