4 ms·

After running Windows 8 on my laptop for a while, I'm struck by how poorly-suited Metro is to a traditional (mouse/keyboard) computing experience. My sense is

After running Windows 8 on my laptop for a while, I'm struck by how poorly-suited Metro is to a traditional (mouse/keyboard) computing experience. My sense is that traditional PCs should boot to the traditional Windows desktop and tablets should only have Metro. It would be seen as a nice benefit that traditional x86 computers can ALSO run Metro apps but I don't think anyone will lament the fact that you can't run Excel on your tablet...

r00fus 15y ago
This sounds just very similar to the route Apple has chosen (though their trackpad tech + latest OSX blurs the lines a bit). If iOS apps could exist as say, dashboard widgets, there would be no difference (Apple probably thinks this is a silly and sales-reducing idea).
- roadnottaken 15y ago
  Well, there's nothing wrong with copying something that works. Sometimes others get things right first and the best move is to follow. Innovation at the expense of functionality is stupid.
shimonamit 15y ago
I completely concur. I am beginning to suspect another release flop ala Windows Me and Windows Vista... if Microsoft default to Metro on traditional workstations. I say 'if' because they're still a bit vague on their roadmap. There's lots of hype in the air now, but once the dust begins to settle I think more people will come to this realization. EDIT: Changed Windows 2000 to Windows Me. Windows 2000 was generally considered to be a successful release.
jerf 15y ago
"It would be seen as a nice benefit that traditional x86 computers can ALSO run Metro apps but I don't think anyone will lament the fact that you can't run Excel on your tablet..." Counterpoint: The next IMHO-blindingly-obvious step in computer evolution is that your tablet/cell phone becomes your desktop when plugged into a probably-USB-based dock that adds a keyboard, mouse, and real desktop monitor (or more). Tablets that can't run real OSes days are numbered. Having a well-delineated tablet UI layer is good. We've got over a decade of proof that just smashing a conventional desktop onto a tablet doesn't work. But I would not want to massively commit to the idea that tablets will never run Excel. They will... just not in their touch-only mode. It's all about how committed you end up to it, though; in the short term, if only Metro is on the tablet of 2012, that's OK, as long as you can pivot, potentially as soon as early 2013. (Prototypes of this ought to exist somewhere now if MS is going to pull this off.) But if you've written this requirement deep into the tech stack, you're in trouble.
- dctoedt 15y ago
  The next IMHO-blindingly-obvious step in computer evolution is that your tablet/cell phone becomes your desktop when plugged into a probably-USB-based dock that adds a keyboard, mouse, and real desktop monitor (or more). Thanks for publicly mentioning that (seriously): Your mention in itself is now "prior art" for pretty much anyone who might later try to patent the idea. (IIRC, Arthur C. Clarke described something much like that in one of his Rama novels back in the late 1970s or early 1980s.)
  - orangecat 15y ago
    It's been mentioned many times before, including by ESR in 2008: http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=614 http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=614. Not that I expect that to stop the patent office from handing a lawsuit factory to the next Lodsys.
- Someone 15y ago
  "The next IMHO-blindingly-obvious step in computer evolution is that your tablet/cell phone becomes your desktop when plugged into a probably-USB-based dock" The idea is obvious, yes, but USB? Thunderbolt is, IMO, much more likely to be _the_ connector. It has the speed to do the video that USB (even USB 3) lacks (power requirements may be a problem, but I think USB 3 has the same problem) I also think that the parties building those docks will want to include a 'cloud connection', for which they will charge whatever they can, because, in general, hardware is not a business to make money in anymore. I am not sure whether they will get away with that. One thing that will depend on is what the economy will be doing.
joebadmo 15y ago
I agree. It's almost the exact reverse of what they tried to do with Tablet PCs before the iPad: wedge a fundamentally inappropriate UI into a place that demands something else. Apple also seems to be headed in the same direction with its introduction iOS features into Lion: http://blog.byjoemoon.com/post/3556631202/touch-ui-is-not-the-future-of-everything http://blog.byjoemoon.com/post/3556631202/touch-ui-is-not-th...

r00fus 15y ago

This sounds just very similar to the route Apple has chosen (though their trackpad tech + latest OSX blurs the lines a bit). If iOS apps could exist as say, dashboard widgets, there would be no difference (Apple probably thinks this is a silly and sales-reducing idea).

roadnottaken 15y ago
Well, there's nothing wrong with copying something that works. Sometimes others get things right first and the best move is to follow. Innovation at the expense of functionality is stupid.

shimonamit 15y ago

I completely concur. I am beginning to suspect another release flop ala Windows Me and Windows Vista... if Microsoft default to Metro on traditional workstations. I say 'if' because they're still a bit vague on their roadmap. There's lots of hype in the air now, but once the dust begins to settle I think more people will come to this realization. EDIT: Changed Windows 2000 to Windows Me. Windows 2000 was generally considered to be a successful release.

jerf 15y ago

"It would be seen as a nice benefit that traditional x86 computers can ALSO run Metro apps but I don't think anyone will lament the fact that you can't run Excel on your tablet..." Counterpoint: The next IMHO-blindingly-obvious step in computer evolution is that your tablet/cell phone becomes your desktop when plugged into a probably-USB-based dock that adds a keyboard, mouse, and real desktop monitor (or more). Tablets that can't run real OSes days are numbered. Having a well-delineated tablet UI layer is good. We've got over a decade of proof that just smashing a conventional desktop onto a tablet doesn't work. But I would not want to massively commit to the idea that tablets will never run Excel. They will... just not in their touch-only mode. It's all about how committed you end up to it, though; in the short term, if only Metro is on the tablet of 2012, that's OK, as long as you can pivot, potentially as soon as early 2013. (Prototypes of this ought to exist somewhere now if MS is going to pull this off.) But if you've written this requirement deep into the tech stack, you're in trouble.

dctoedt 15y ago
The next IMHO-blindingly-obvious step in computer evolution is that your tablet/cell phone becomes your desktop when plugged into a probably-USB-based dock that adds a keyboard, mouse, and real desktop monitor (or more). Thanks for publicly mentioning that (seriously): Your mention in itself is now "prior art" for pretty much anyone who might later try to patent the idea. (IIRC, Arthur C. Clarke described something much like that in one of his Rama novels back in the late 1970s or early 1980s.)
- orangecat 15y ago
  It's been mentioned many times before, including by ESR in 2008: http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=614 http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=614. Not that I expect that to stop the patent office from handing a lawsuit factory to the next Lodsys.
Someone 15y ago
"The next IMHO-blindingly-obvious step in computer evolution is that your tablet/cell phone becomes your desktop when plugged into a probably-USB-based dock" The idea is obvious, yes, but USB? Thunderbolt is, IMO, much more likely to be _the_ connector. It has the speed to do the video that USB (even USB 3) lacks (power requirements may be a problem, but I think USB 3 has the same problem) I also think that the parties building those docks will want to include a 'cloud connection', for which they will charge whatever they can, because, in general, hardware is not a business to make money in anymore. I am not sure whether they will get away with that. One thing that will depend on is what the economy will be doing.

joebadmo 15y ago

I agree. It's almost the exact reverse of what they tried to do with Tablet PCs before the iPad: wedge a fundamentally inappropriate UI into a place that demands something else. Apple also seems to be headed in the same direction with its introduction iOS features into Lion: http://blog.byjoemoon.com/post/3556631202/touch-ui-is-not-the-future-of-everything http://blog.byjoemoon.com/post/3556631202/touch-ui-is-not-th...