8 ms·

Regardless of the hack, ..."Wormhole said earlier that the network was down for maintenance." A great summary of so-called 'DeFi'. How can a system be decentr

Regardless of the hack, ..."Wormhole said earlier that the network was down for maintenance." A great summary of so-called 'DeFi'. How can a system be decentralized if someone can unilaterally decide to take it down for maintenance?

shp0ngle 5y ago
DeFi definition of “decentralized” is “everyone is anonymous and nobody pays taxes”, not “does not have central point of failure”.
- 2pEXgD0fZ5cF 5y ago
  The definitions (or rather, "goals") of most things from the cryptocurrency sphere appear to conveniently and arbitrarily change in adaptation to flaws being pointed out.
  - philosopher1234 5y ago
    DeFi is “decentralized” in that saying so increases its price.
- ALittleLight 5y ago
  They seem to have a similarly creative definition for security too.
xyst 5y ago
just the default response for the news/general public. Bad PR to say "we fucked up" or something to that effect.
kreeben 5y ago
The non-decentralization of DeFi is something that along with using too much energy while being very slow at processing transactions, will be fixed in the future. Way, way into the future. This is a good thing, btw. It means there's still plenty of time for you to "get in".
- adam_arthur 5y ago
  You say "get in" as if the goal is making money, and not the technology or capability that it enables. Which is a perfect example of why crypto is a bubble.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - dumbfoundded 5y ago
    I think your read on the parent is right but despite that, I'd encourage you to check it out. IMHO, the most interesting developments in computer science are happening right now in web3. Stay away from the NFTs/DEFI and just learn about the new systems being built. If you look into the technical details of these new distributed systems, game theory applications, and zero-knowledge proofs, I have a hard timing believing any programmer can't see the new features unlocked in how we build things. It's also socially important for well intentioned people to join the system right now. Web3 is a thing, it will happen. Mobile happened and now two companies worth roughly a trillion each control it entirely. Web3 is roughly on the same path. It's being built right now to gate keep and capture value. If you don't want to the internet to continue to dwindle down to a privatized button pushing consumption app, the battle ground is web3.
    - kreeben 5y ago
      Well played. Sarcasm on the internet, very hard to spot.
    - LittlePeter 5y ago
      Can you define web3?
      - knownjorbist 5y ago
        This does a better job than any comment could summarize: https://www.psl.com/feed-posts/web3-engineer-take https://www.psl.com/feed-posts/web3-engineer-take
patrickaljord 5y ago
Bridges like that are not decentralized and rely on trust, I don't think anyone consider them to be DeFi.
tsujp 5y ago
Everyone in the DeFi space knows Wormhole (which is on Solana) is not decentralised because Solana is banked, run, and paid for by VCs. Yet another out of touch comment on HackerNews -- a place where people should be doing even a modicum of research instead of making things up.
- darcys22 5y ago
  This, absolutely nobody thinks solana is decentralised
- Tenoke 5y ago
  Wormhole isn't centralized because it's on Solana (it's not like Sol devs/nodes will mess with the chain to stop it) but because it's a bridge which is an inherently centralized service since it cannot work fully on-chain by definition.
T0Bi 5y ago
No one says that bridges are DeFi or decentralized. Only people who don't understand what they're talking about sum up everything under one term and then complain that their definition doesn't fit.
- darcys22 5y ago
  Yeah the running joke about this chain is how centralised it is. To highlight solanas centralisation as a failure for crypto ignores how big the crypto space is and how much solana doesnt reflect the rest of the space
josu 5y ago
I wrote this a few years back. It is more relevant than ever: In cryptoland “decentralized” doesn’t mean what you think it does https://medium.com/@josusanmartin/in-cryptoland-decentralized-doesnt-mean-what-you-think-it-does-42d95a47d3f0 https://medium.com/@josusanmartin/in-cryptoland-decentralize...
- krmmalik 5y ago
  Very well written and explained and very helpful. Thank you.
baobabKoodaa 5y ago
It's 1984 and everything is called by opposite names.
lima 5y ago
You can shut down a centralized system when all node operators agree to do so, which happened here.

shp0ngle 5y ago

DeFi definition of “decentralized” is “everyone is anonymous and nobody pays taxes”, not “does not have central point of failure”.

2pEXgD0fZ5cF 5y ago
The definitions (or rather, "goals") of most things from the cryptocurrency sphere appear to conveniently and arbitrarily change in adaptation to flaws being pointed out.
- philosopher1234 5y ago
  DeFi is “decentralized” in that saying so increases its price.
ALittleLight 5y ago
They seem to have a similarly creative definition for security too.

xyst 5y ago

just the default response for the news/general public. Bad PR to say "we fucked up" or something to that effect.

kreeben 5y ago

The non-decentralization of DeFi is something that along with using too much energy while being very slow at processing transactions, will be fixed in the future. Way, way into the future. This is a good thing, btw. It means there's still plenty of time for you to "get in".

adam_arthur 5y ago
You say "get in" as if the goal is making money, and not the technology or capability that it enables. Which is a perfect example of why crypto is a bubble.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- dumbfoundded 5y ago
  I think your read on the parent is right but despite that, I'd encourage you to check it out. IMHO, the most interesting developments in computer science are happening right now in web3. Stay away from the NFTs/DEFI and just learn about the new systems being built. If you look into the technical details of these new distributed systems, game theory applications, and zero-knowledge proofs, I have a hard timing believing any programmer can't see the new features unlocked in how we build things. It's also socially important for well intentioned people to join the system right now. Web3 is a thing, it will happen. Mobile happened and now two companies worth roughly a trillion each control it entirely. Web3 is roughly on the same path. It's being built right now to gate keep and capture value. If you don't want to the internet to continue to dwindle down to a privatized button pushing consumption app, the battle ground is web3.
  - kreeben 5y ago
    Well played. Sarcasm on the internet, very hard to spot.
  - LittlePeter 5y ago
    Can you define web3?
    - knownjorbist 5y ago
      This does a better job than any comment could summarize: https://www.psl.com/feed-posts/web3-engineer-take https://www.psl.com/feed-posts/web3-engineer-take

patrickaljord 5y ago

Bridges like that are not decentralized and rely on trust, I don't think anyone consider them to be DeFi.

tsujp 5y ago

Everyone in the DeFi space knows Wormhole (which is on Solana) is not decentralised because Solana is banked, run, and paid for by VCs. Yet another out of touch comment on HackerNews -- a place where people should be doing even a modicum of research instead of making things up.

darcys22 5y ago
This, absolutely nobody thinks solana is decentralised
Tenoke 5y ago
Wormhole isn't centralized because it's on Solana (it's not like Sol devs/nodes will mess with the chain to stop it) but because it's a bridge which is an inherently centralized service since it cannot work fully on-chain by definition.

T0Bi 5y ago

No one says that bridges are DeFi or decentralized. Only people who don't understand what they're talking about sum up everything under one term and then complain that their definition doesn't fit.

darcys22 5y ago
Yeah the running joke about this chain is how centralised it is. To highlight solanas centralisation as a failure for crypto ignores how big the crypto space is and how much solana doesnt reflect the rest of the space

josu 5y ago

I wrote this a few years back. It is more relevant than ever: In cryptoland “decentralized” doesn’t mean what you think it does https://medium.com/@josusanmartin/in-cryptoland-decentralized-doesnt-mean-what-you-think-it-does-42d95a47d3f0 https://medium.com/@josusanmartin/in-cryptoland-decentralize...

krmmalik 5y ago
Very well written and explained and very helpful. Thank you.

baobabKoodaa 5y ago

It's 1984 and everything is called by opposite names.

lima 5y ago

You can shut down a centralized system when all node operators agree to do so, which happened here.