4 ms·

I still want to know who goes to prison when a pedestrian or cyclist is killed. Because no-one is arguing someone will be killed, only that "human drivers kill

by ck2 5y ago

I still want to know who goes to prison when a pedestrian or cyclist is killed. Because no-one is arguing someone will be killed, only that "human drivers kill people too" or "machines will kill fewer, eventually". Will it be the passenger? The coder for bad code? The person who assembled the hardware for improperly tested malfunctioning sensors? The person who made the malfunctioning sensors? Who? Because someone is responsible. You can't just spread the blame around and the corporation just pays a fine and shrugs after someone's life is ended.

seanmcdirmid 5y ago
Unless the driver is drunk, has malice, or willfully breaking a bunch of other rules, I don’t think they go to prison now.
- defaultprimate 5y ago
  Virtually all auto accidents in which a third-party fatality occurs result in criminal liability. It's extremely rare for a third-party fatality in an auto accident to be caused by something other than criminal negligence or intent.
  - seanmcdirmid 5y ago
    Most auto accidents that cause death don’t involve third parties. And there are shockingly a lot of people killed in auto accidents, only a very small percentage of those result in prison time.
    - defaultprimate 5y ago
      Exactly why I specified. Multi-party fatal accidents are rare, but they usually involve drunk driving or gross negligence/recklessness
      - seanmcdirmid 5y ago
        Right, but the original comment didn't specify that, so sounded a bit weird to me.
- ck2 5y ago
  If someone is playing with their phone and they kill someone, they are doing prison time. No "oops oh well, I'll do better next time, sorry you're dead but it's your fault for being there". 2+ ton machine, willful negligence. There's even a connection log with handy timestamps proving the phone was in use.
pcurve 5y ago
I don't think it will result in jail time for anyone, unless there is gross negligence and/or reckless disregard for safety by those who worked on it. Even so, due to benefit associated with autonomous vehicles, unless court can find deliberate and malicious attempt to endanger people, I doubt anyone would see a jail time. There are plenty of similar precedents for this, and it's airline industry. Literally hundreds of planes have fallen out of sky and thousands of people perished due to design flaws, improper maintenance, be it using wrong parts, bad repairs, failing to inspect, etc. Yet, individuals working at plane makers or mechanics rarely get jail time. Sure, companies are held responsible, can pay restitutions, but jail time is exceedingly rare.

by ck2 5y ago

seanmcdirmid 5y ago

Unless the driver is drunk, has malice, or willfully breaking a bunch of other rules, I don’t think they go to prison now.

defaultprimate 5y ago
Virtually all auto accidents in which a third-party fatality occurs result in criminal liability. It's extremely rare for a third-party fatality in an auto accident to be caused by something other than criminal negligence or intent.
- seanmcdirmid 5y ago
  Most auto accidents that cause death don’t involve third parties. And there are shockingly a lot of people killed in auto accidents, only a very small percentage of those result in prison time.
  - defaultprimate 5y ago
    Exactly why I specified. Multi-party fatal accidents are rare, but they usually involve drunk driving or gross negligence/recklessness
    - seanmcdirmid 5y ago
      Right, but the original comment didn't specify that, so sounded a bit weird to me.
ck2 5y ago
If someone is playing with their phone and they kill someone, they are doing prison time. No "oops oh well, I'll do better next time, sorry you're dead but it's your fault for being there". 2+ ton machine, willful negligence. There's even a connection log with handy timestamps proving the phone was in use.

pcurve 5y ago

I don't think it will result in jail time for anyone, unless there is gross negligence and/or reckless disregard for safety by those who worked on it. Even so, due to benefit associated with autonomous vehicles, unless court can find deliberate and malicious attempt to endanger people, I doubt anyone would see a jail time. There are plenty of similar precedents for this, and it's airline industry. Literally hundreds of planes have fallen out of sky and thousands of people perished due to design flaws, improper maintenance, be it using wrong parts, bad repairs, failing to inspect, etc. Yet, individuals working at plane makers or mechanics rarely get jail time. Sure, companies are held responsible, can pay restitutions, but jail time is exceedingly rare.