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There is probably at least 1000 electrical engineers in the Gothenburg, Sweden area alone that would disagree with you. Companies like VCC, Geely, CEVT, Volvo,

There is probably at least 1000 electrical engineers in the Gothenburg, Sweden area alone that would disagree with you. Companies like VCC, Geely, CEVT, Volvo, Polestar and first tier electronics, digital, system and software consultants are sweeping the job market clean to be able to handle all in-house electronic design work. The pendulum from just sourcing from companies like Bosch, Continental turned hard about five years ago. Now electronic and SW design is critical diversification, and part of what creates core value in automotive.

lnsru 5y ago
Sounds logical to me. I never understood this subcontracting thing with many layers. At the end somebody must do the job and has only fraction of original order revenue. On the other hand if car companies would buy the few remaining components for electrical vehicles from subcontractors… well, all the cars and brands would be exactly the same with minor adjustments.
- JoachimS 5y ago
  Going back 10-ish years or so, basically everybody was writing requirement specifications to be included in RFQs. Primarily sent to the multinational suppliers like Continental. Sourcing and integration was the technical focus. And project management etc. Now it is 100% in the other direction. There are engineers everywhere. Basically, if there is a space (under stairs even), there is a desk with an engineer. Doing serious design work. The new automotive cybersecurity requirements also contribute to renewed need for control and detailed knowledge of subsystems.
amelius 5y ago
> Now electronic and SW design is critical diversification, and part of what creates core value in automotive. It is also the part that sucks most from a consumer's point of view. As a consumer, I want choice, not lock-in by the manufacturer after I buy a car.
- JoachimS 5y ago
  That is sort of orthogonal to what we are talking about. Cars are getting more digital based functionality - driver assist, entertainment, connection to third party services. They could be developed by some supplier, or the car manufacturer. If they are based on open protocols, standards, provide API, is released as open source could happen in either of those two scenarios. I know manufacturers that use, promote and contribute to open source and standards. Do you think the big automotive suppliers are better or worse in this regard? Also, choice here is kind of fuzzy. Choice in car brand and model? Choice in apps running in the enterrainment system? Choice in what SW is being executed by one or more of all the hundreds of CPUs, MCUs, GPUs, NPUs in the car?
  - amelius 5y ago
    There's nothing difficult about it. If Apple builds a car media/navigation system, I'm sure they can agree with car manufacturers about an interface. The problem is: manufacturers don't want this.
    - JoachimS 5y ago
      For entertainment, car services like they most certainly do. Look at what VCC, Polestar is doing with Apple in CarPlay and apps. They also provide APIs to allow third party value add services. It is a booming market.

lnsru 5y ago

Sounds logical to me. I never understood this subcontracting thing with many layers. At the end somebody must do the job and has only fraction of original order revenue. On the other hand if car companies would buy the few remaining components for electrical vehicles from subcontractors… well, all the cars and brands would be exactly the same with minor adjustments.

JoachimS 5y ago
Going back 10-ish years or so, basically everybody was writing requirement specifications to be included in RFQs. Primarily sent to the multinational suppliers like Continental. Sourcing and integration was the technical focus. And project management etc. Now it is 100% in the other direction. There are engineers everywhere. Basically, if there is a space (under stairs even), there is a desk with an engineer. Doing serious design work. The new automotive cybersecurity requirements also contribute to renewed need for control and detailed knowledge of subsystems.

amelius 5y ago

> Now electronic and SW design is critical diversification, and part of what creates core value in automotive. It is also the part that sucks most from a consumer's point of view. As a consumer, I want choice, not lock-in by the manufacturer after I buy a car.

JoachimS 5y ago
That is sort of orthogonal to what we are talking about. Cars are getting more digital based functionality - driver assist, entertainment, connection to third party services. They could be developed by some supplier, or the car manufacturer. If they are based on open protocols, standards, provide API, is released as open source could happen in either of those two scenarios. I know manufacturers that use, promote and contribute to open source and standards. Do you think the big automotive suppliers are better or worse in this regard? Also, choice here is kind of fuzzy. Choice in car brand and model? Choice in apps running in the enterrainment system? Choice in what SW is being executed by one or more of all the hundreds of CPUs, MCUs, GPUs, NPUs in the car?
- amelius 5y ago
  There's nothing difficult about it. If Apple builds a car media/navigation system, I'm sure they can agree with car manufacturers about an interface. The problem is: manufacturers don't want this.
  - JoachimS 5y ago
    For entertainment, car services like they most certainly do. Look at what VCC, Polestar is doing with Apple in CarPlay and apps. They also provide APIs to allow third party value add services. It is a booming market.