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ICUs are at max capacity all the time pre-pandemic. In fact a study done in 2013 IIRC showed that you could pick any random date and any random hospital in the

by toolz 5y ago

ICUs are at max capacity all the time pre-pandemic. In fact a study done in 2013 IIRC showed that you could pick any random date and any random hospital in the U.S. and there was a 16% chance it was at max capacity. So again, my question is this - if hospital capacity is truly a crisis, why have staffed beds been in decline since the beginning of the pandemic? Half a million healthcare workers have left their jobs since just the start of the pandemic. If this is a crisis, why isn't there any initiative to get them back? Instead the only initiative we've seen with regards to healthcare workers is massive layoffs firstly because of lockdowns, but then later also massive layoffs because of vaccinate rules. So either this is a terrible problem with no solution, or the problem is exaggerated and it's not really a crisis.

tempnow987 5y ago
I like how the public health folks don't connect the dots. MEDICAL PROFESSIONALS are tired of the stuff they are hearing. I know some folks who had covid, and just don't want to trigger their bodies systems again with a series of shots. For some reason, if you have other diseases your immune system likely provides some protection against re-infection, but we are being told covid is different. This just seems so likely to be a lie its mind boggling. Let healthcare works test their blood for cross-reactivity with omicron / antibodies. If you are equal or better than some threshold (pfizer vaccine from 10 months ago) you get a card and are good to go.
- Dylan16807 5y ago
  > For some reason, if you have other diseases your immune system likely provides some protection against re-infection, but we are being told covid is different. This just seems so likely to be a lie its mind boggling. I don't know what you're talking about. There is some protecction, it's not enough to make things safe, what's the lie? If you're talking about those people still having to get a vaccine, that's a whole mess of tradeoffs but also not based on lying.
cdot2 5y ago
"So either this is a terrible problem with no solution, or the problem is exaggerated and it's not really a crisis." Either of these means this isnt something to worry about
alar44 5y ago
Thats just not true. I found the study you're referencing and it says in 2013 mean ICU occupancy was 68%. If you zoom out on the map you'll see the US avg is 83%. Did you even look at it? Some states are like 9/10 at 100% capacity. Staffed beds are not in decline, and of course hospitals are trying to get more workers, they are offering crazy pay incentives right now.
- toolz 5y ago
  https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3840149/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3840149/ The mean capacity doesn't disprove what I said in the slightest. https://i.imgur.com/s8RRK76.png https://i.imgur.com/s8RRK76.png the dark gray represents ICUs in the studied time window (which wasn't 2013, it was a study done in 2013, the study measured ICUs from 05-07) Here's an interesting fact[1]. 2020 hospital capacity in the US after the start of the pandemic never even got up to the projected capacity as projected using data from 2015-2019. So no, I don't believe these scary-tale anecdotes I've been reading the entire pandemic. They are not backed in data they are backed, at best, in bullet points without context designed to scare the ignorant. [1]https://www.kff.org/health-costs/issue-brief/trends-in-overall-and-non-covid-19-hospital-admissions/ https://www.kff.org/health-costs/issue-brief/trends-in-overa... Here's a really good breakdown in canada of capacity with ventilators - you'll note almost every single graph shows higher numbers in 2019 https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1479547900598366220.html https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1479547900598366220.html

by toolz 5y ago

tempnow987 5y ago

I like how the public health folks don't connect the dots. MEDICAL PROFESSIONALS are tired of the stuff they are hearing. I know some folks who had covid, and just don't want to trigger their bodies systems again with a series of shots. For some reason, if you have other diseases your immune system likely provides some protection against re-infection, but we are being told covid is different. This just seems so likely to be a lie its mind boggling. Let healthcare works test their blood for cross-reactivity with omicron / antibodies. If you are equal or better than some threshold (pfizer vaccine from 10 months ago) you get a card and are good to go.

Dylan16807 5y ago
> For some reason, if you have other diseases your immune system likely provides some protection against re-infection, but we are being told covid is different. This just seems so likely to be a lie its mind boggling. I don't know what you're talking about. There is some protecction, it's not enough to make things safe, what's the lie? If you're talking about those people still having to get a vaccine, that's a whole mess of tradeoffs but also not based on lying.

cdot2 5y ago

"So either this is a terrible problem with no solution, or the problem is exaggerated and it's not really a crisis." Either of these means this isnt something to worry about

alar44 5y ago

Thats just not true. I found the study you're referencing and it says in 2013 mean ICU occupancy was 68%. If you zoom out on the map you'll see the US avg is 83%. Did you even look at it? Some states are like 9/10 at 100% capacity. Staffed beds are not in decline, and of course hospitals are trying to get more workers, they are offering crazy pay incentives right now.

toolz 5y ago
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3840149/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3840149/ The mean capacity doesn't disprove what I said in the slightest. https://i.imgur.com/s8RRK76.png https://i.imgur.com/s8RRK76.png the dark gray represents ICUs in the studied time window (which wasn't 2013, it was a study done in 2013, the study measured ICUs from 05-07) Here's an interesting fact[1]. 2020 hospital capacity in the US after the start of the pandemic never even got up to the projected capacity as projected using data from 2015-2019. So no, I don't believe these scary-tale anecdotes I've been reading the entire pandemic. They are not backed in data they are backed, at best, in bullet points without context designed to scare the ignorant. [1]https://www.kff.org/health-costs/issue-brief/trends-in-overall-and-non-covid-19-hospital-admissions/ https://www.kff.org/health-costs/issue-brief/trends-in-overa... Here's a really good breakdown in canada of capacity with ventilators - you'll note almost every single graph shows higher numbers in 2019 https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1479547900598366220.html https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1479547900598366220.html