5 ms·

I'm 10 years removed from life science research at this point... but aren't these vitamin studies a dime a dozen at this point? I don't think I see a comparison

I'm 10 years removed from life science research at this point... but aren't these vitamin studies a dime a dozen at this point? I don't think I see a comparison of outcomes between groups that were vitamin D deficient/insufficient vs vitamin D sufficient, which I think could be a bit more useful?

d883kd8 5y ago
I'm actually getting submarine vibes from the amount of positive Vitamin D coverage I've seen recently
- themikesanto 5y ago
  What does that mean?
  - lkbm 5y ago
    PR/astroturfing. It's a reference to Paul Graham's essay "The Submarine: http://www.paulgraham.com/submarine.html http://www.paulgraham.com/submarine.html
  - ozim 5y ago
    That someone is pumping vitamin D supplementation promotion. I have also my own example of N(1) where supplementing vit-D made me healthier and I am nerd sitting most of the time hidden from the sun. Pre-Covid after start of supplementation I noticed less infections, easier hangovers overall better health. That said I mostly sit inside by the screen and live in countries where is not that much sun so it is easy for me to get positive outcome of supplementation. I think there is a lot of people like that and that is why there is so much positive reaction for D supplementation.
nradov 5y ago
Yes most studies on micronutrient supplementation are badly flawed in that way. They typically give a supplement to the study group and a placebo to the control group, but since vitamins also come from other sources the supplements are only loosely correlated with actual levels. A better approach is to pick at least two different target levels for separate study groups. Then use periodic blood tests to precisely titrate those levels using varying amounts of supplements as needed. If the results show a clear relationship between the different blood levels and the study goal then it's likely a real causal relationship exists.
_qua 5y ago
Vitamin D is one of the most overstudied topics in medicine. Yes, there are probably aspects of vitamin D function that we do not understand well, but if there were a large signal for benefit, it should have been discovered by now.
- bagacrap 5y ago
  and hasn't it been discovered by now? my understanding of all the studies I see is that they confirm and reconfirm the importance of vit d. I have a coworker whose doctor prescribes vit d shots every winter because he's so deficient. The big question is why preventative care such as this is not emphasized as much by the powers that be as therapeutics.
  - _qua 5y ago
    The US Preventative Services Task Force has recently reviewed the vitamin D literatue, it is summarized here: https://www.uspreventiveservicestaskforce.org/uspstf/recommendation/vitamin-d-deficiency-screening https://www.uspreventiveservicestaskforce.org/uspstf/recomme... Primary care is largely concerned with preventative care. It's not that we don't want to help, it's just that in many ways we are impotent. We generally do not change practice based on single studies. But since this post is about a single study, I'll share a recent RCT in The Lancet which showed no change in mortality and signals of increased cancer with vitamin D supplementation: https://www.thelancet.com/journals/landia/article/PIIS2213-8587(21)00345-4/fulltext https://www.thelancet.com/journals/landia/article/PIIS2213-8... .
  - ipaddr 5y ago
    That's why they add it to milk.

d883kd8 5y ago

I'm actually getting submarine vibes from the amount of positive Vitamin D coverage I've seen recently

themikesanto 5y ago
What does that mean?
- lkbm 5y ago
  PR/astroturfing. It's a reference to Paul Graham's essay "The Submarine: http://www.paulgraham.com/submarine.html http://www.paulgraham.com/submarine.html
- ozim 5y ago
  That someone is pumping vitamin D supplementation promotion. I have also my own example of N(1) where supplementing vit-D made me healthier and I am nerd sitting most of the time hidden from the sun. Pre-Covid after start of supplementation I noticed less infections, easier hangovers overall better health. That said I mostly sit inside by the screen and live in countries where is not that much sun so it is easy for me to get positive outcome of supplementation. I think there is a lot of people like that and that is why there is so much positive reaction for D supplementation.

nradov 5y ago

Yes most studies on micronutrient supplementation are badly flawed in that way. They typically give a supplement to the study group and a placebo to the control group, but since vitamins also come from other sources the supplements are only loosely correlated with actual levels. A better approach is to pick at least two different target levels for separate study groups. Then use periodic blood tests to precisely titrate those levels using varying amounts of supplements as needed. If the results show a clear relationship between the different blood levels and the study goal then it's likely a real causal relationship exists.

_qua 5y ago

Vitamin D is one of the most overstudied topics in medicine. Yes, there are probably aspects of vitamin D function that we do not understand well, but if there were a large signal for benefit, it should have been discovered by now.

bagacrap 5y ago
and hasn't it been discovered by now? my understanding of all the studies I see is that they confirm and reconfirm the importance of vit d. I have a coworker whose doctor prescribes vit d shots every winter because he's so deficient. The big question is why preventative care such as this is not emphasized as much by the powers that be as therapeutics.
- _qua 5y ago
  The US Preventative Services Task Force has recently reviewed the vitamin D literatue, it is summarized here: https://www.uspreventiveservicestaskforce.org/uspstf/recommendation/vitamin-d-deficiency-screening https://www.uspreventiveservicestaskforce.org/uspstf/recomme... Primary care is largely concerned with preventative care. It's not that we don't want to help, it's just that in many ways we are impotent. We generally do not change practice based on single studies. But since this post is about a single study, I'll share a recent RCT in The Lancet which showed no change in mortality and signals of increased cancer with vitamin D supplementation: https://www.thelancet.com/journals/landia/article/PIIS2213-8587(21)00345-4/fulltext https://www.thelancet.com/journals/landia/article/PIIS2213-8... .
- ipaddr 5y ago
  That's why they add it to milk.