7 ms·

This thread is like "google banned my account" but for real life

ALittleLight 5y ago
Except this place has a better excuse in that they are a township of ~9k people where the board of supervisors get paid 3k a year (read: are not full time). I could totally imagine the part time small town government not really knowing how things should work and flying by the seat of their pants like this.
- eyelidlessness 5y ago
  That’s an extraordinarily generous reading of the facts.
  - victor9000 5y ago
    Captain Obvious checking in, it's more like they really don't want an independent auditor. People focusing on their compensation are not looking deep enough, there's probably some preferred vendor or other grifting going on that leads back to a family member.
    - throwawaygh 5y ago
      The city has an independent auditor. It's a mid-sized firm in a sizable metro with a bunch of CPAs. Literally no incentive to lie on an audit of a tiny township with a miniscule budget.
      - michaelt 5y ago
        The likes on Enron, Worldcom and Bear Stearns all had "independent" audits. Everyone knows auditors only have the capacity to look at a small sample of records; and that difficult, demanding auditors don't get appointed next year.
      - somenewaccount1 5y ago
        CPA's will only verify that the funds were indeed spent as reported. Basically, that the ledger is balanced and funds weren't outright stolen. They won't identify that specific vendors, possibly related to the supervisors, are over paid for thier services.
        throwawaygh 5y ago
        cmeacham98 5y ago
        "Interfund transfers": almost 50% increase to $1.3million; elaborated on nowhere else in the budget as far as I can tell Now I'm not saying there definitely is foul play here (realistically, more likely than not there isn't), but that's why the auditor position exists - to find out
        taylorfinley 5y ago
        Okay. Bottom of page 4, "50 gallon sprayer, $5000" Here's a 50 gallon sprayer from Northern Tool, cost $489. Where'd the other $4500 go? https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200722048_200722048 https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200722048_20... Edit: let's give them the benefit of the doubt, here's the most expensive one, still coming in $2000 under budget https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200675174_200675174 https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200675174_20...
        throwawaygh 5y ago
        ...and there are also sprayers that cost over $7K. Was that money spent on a sprayer? Almost certainly yes. Who could check this? For that, I'm just going to repeat your own words back to you: > CPA's verify that the funds were indeed spent as reported And then ask again what possible incentive the accounting firm could have to lie.
        sgjohnson 5y ago
      - Aeolun 5y ago
        > miniscule budget $14 million?
    - s1artibartfast 5y ago
      Maybe, maybe not. It is pretty wild that everyone assumes some financial conspiracy. I think it is at least as likely they just don't want random wackadoos adding to the bureaucracy.
      - dhbanes 5y ago
        You don’t know much about how local government operates.
        deelowe 5y ago
        I do. In small towns like this, it's not really money. They tend to just favor people they know. It's more bias or conservatism than corruption. Things are more comfortable when you're dealing with people you know. Sure people get favors and side business and such but in total, it doesn't really add up to a whole lot.
        3np 5y ago
        You just described corruption. Regardless of how many dollars it is about in the end. I can think of 0 valid reasons to ghost and undermine your elected auditors.
        josefx 5y ago
        Did they ghost him or did he ghost them first? From what I can tell he had absolutely no idea about or even contact with the people he was supposed to audit/work with until long after the election had taken place. So he turns up one random day to do his job and is surprised that he isn't on the agenda. I repeat, he never even talked to these guys after his election, never checked in with them to even properly organize things. Instead he just assumed "they would know". > and undermine your elected auditors. Given how much he just assumed will happen and failed to properly plan and ensure will happen he is doing quite a good job at helping them with it. And after all that his idea of fixing things is to write a 20+ tweet complaint on twitter. If these people are as corrupt as some here think they must love that guy, they couldn't have found a more superficial incompetent guy for the job if they tried.
  - jf22 5y ago
    I participate in town government. There is more incompetence than malice. There are well intentioned people trying to navigate conflicting laws, statues, bylaws, and codes of conduct. You ask three different people the same question and get four answers. When I read this situation it sounds almost normal.
- KennyBlanken 5y ago
  You missed the part where they did exactly the same thing to someone 6 years prior, including sending the same email, and so on.
  - ALittleLight 5y ago
    What does that imply?
    - 7495743 5y ago
      That they are very keen on not having a board of auditors because there is something they think those auditors could do they don't want done. For instance, uncover corruption.
      - throwaway98797 5y ago
        or they are lazy
      - Aeolun 5y ago
        Or, you know, they still have the same accounting firm, and the situation hasn’t changed at all since last time. Only this auditor is more persistent.
        7495743 5y ago
        I don't think it's reasonable to believe they are ignoring the law just because they are lazy or think the accounting firm makes the auditors unnecessary. If they didn't care, they would just swear in auditors and let them preform their other duties as the law requires.
- TomSwirly 5y ago
  I can't imagine anyone reading this story and thinking, "Oh, this must just be a series of unfortunate accidents by naïve supervisors." "Not knowing how things work" is only an excuse up until someone explains to they, "I was elected, here is the law," and they deliberately refuse to acknowledge it (The reason people run for these obscure, low-paying jobs is so they can get rich on the taxpayers' dime - so they can rezone and procure and otherwise redirect money and influence to their own interests. No one does it as a fun hobby.)
  - Aeolun 5y ago
    > No one does it as a fun hobby Most people I’ve met doing anything like this for less than minimum wage are absolutely doing it for fun, or to help their communities. If they sometimes assign the job to their friend Josh instead of the faceless general contractor 3 towns over, can you blame them?
    - newaccount74 5y ago
      And if that friend Josh then sometimes pays them 10% in kickbacks, can you blame them for taking it? They are putting so much work in for so little, after all.

Except this place has a better excuse in that they are a township of ~9k people where the board of supervisors get paid 3k a year (read: are not full time). I could totally imagine the part time small town government not really knowing how things should work and flying by the seat of their pants like this.

eyelidlessness 5y ago
That’s an extraordinarily generous reading of the facts.
- victor9000 5y ago
  Captain Obvious checking in, it's more like they really don't want an independent auditor. People focusing on their compensation are not looking deep enough, there's probably some preferred vendor or other grifting going on that leads back to a family member.
  - throwawaygh 5y ago
    The city has an independent auditor. It's a mid-sized firm in a sizable metro with a bunch of CPAs. Literally no incentive to lie on an audit of a tiny township with a miniscule budget.
    - michaelt 5y ago
      The likes on Enron, Worldcom and Bear Stearns all had "independent" audits. Everyone knows auditors only have the capacity to look at a small sample of records; and that difficult, demanding auditors don't get appointed next year.
    - somenewaccount1 5y ago
      CPA's will only verify that the funds were indeed spent as reported. Basically, that the ledger is balanced and funds weren't outright stolen. They won't identify that specific vendors, possibly related to the supervisors, are over paid for thier services.
      - throwawaygh 5y ago
        cmeacham98 5y ago
        "Interfund transfers": almost 50% increase to $1.3million; elaborated on nowhere else in the budget as far as I can tell Now I'm not saying there definitely is foul play here (realistically, more likely than not there isn't), but that's why the auditor position exists - to find out
        taylorfinley 5y ago
        Okay. Bottom of page 4, "50 gallon sprayer, $5000" Here's a 50 gallon sprayer from Northern Tool, cost $489. Where'd the other $4500 go? https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200722048_200722048 https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200722048_20... Edit: let's give them the benefit of the doubt, here's the most expensive one, still coming in $2000 under budget https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200675174_200675174 https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200675174_20...
        throwawaygh 5y ago
        ...and there are also sprayers that cost over $7K. Was that money spent on a sprayer? Almost certainly yes. Who could check this? For that, I'm just going to repeat your own words back to you: > CPA's verify that the funds were indeed spent as reported And then ask again what possible incentive the accounting firm could have to lie.
        sgjohnson 5y ago
    - Aeolun 5y ago
      > miniscule budget $14 million?
  - s1artibartfast 5y ago
    Maybe, maybe not. It is pretty wild that everyone assumes some financial conspiracy. I think it is at least as likely they just don't want random wackadoos adding to the bureaucracy.
    - dhbanes 5y ago
      You don’t know much about how local government operates.
      - deelowe 5y ago
        I do. In small towns like this, it's not really money. They tend to just favor people they know. It's more bias or conservatism than corruption. Things are more comfortable when you're dealing with people you know. Sure people get favors and side business and such but in total, it doesn't really add up to a whole lot.
        3np 5y ago
        You just described corruption. Regardless of how many dollars it is about in the end. I can think of 0 valid reasons to ghost and undermine your elected auditors.
        josefx 5y ago
        Did they ghost him or did he ghost them first? From what I can tell he had absolutely no idea about or even contact with the people he was supposed to audit/work with until long after the election had taken place. So he turns up one random day to do his job and is surprised that he isn't on the agenda. I repeat, he never even talked to these guys after his election, never checked in with them to even properly organize things. Instead he just assumed "they would know". > and undermine your elected auditors. Given how much he just assumed will happen and failed to properly plan and ensure will happen he is doing quite a good job at helping them with it. And after all that his idea of fixing things is to write a 20+ tweet complaint on twitter. If these people are as corrupt as some here think they must love that guy, they couldn't have found a more superficial incompetent guy for the job if they tried.
- jf22 5y ago
  I participate in town government. There is more incompetence than malice. There are well intentioned people trying to navigate conflicting laws, statues, bylaws, and codes of conduct. You ask three different people the same question and get four answers. When I read this situation it sounds almost normal.
KennyBlanken 5y ago
You missed the part where they did exactly the same thing to someone 6 years prior, including sending the same email, and so on.
- ALittleLight 5y ago
  What does that imply?
  - 7495743 5y ago
    That they are very keen on not having a board of auditors because there is something they think those auditors could do they don't want done. For instance, uncover corruption.
    - throwaway98797 5y ago
      or they are lazy
    - Aeolun 5y ago
      Or, you know, they still have the same accounting firm, and the situation hasn’t changed at all since last time. Only this auditor is more persistent.
      - 7495743 5y ago
        I don't think it's reasonable to believe they are ignoring the law just because they are lazy or think the accounting firm makes the auditors unnecessary. If they didn't care, they would just swear in auditors and let them preform their other duties as the law requires.
TomSwirly 5y ago
I can't imagine anyone reading this story and thinking, "Oh, this must just be a series of unfortunate accidents by naïve supervisors." "Not knowing how things work" is only an excuse up until someone explains to they, "I was elected, here is the law," and they deliberately refuse to acknowledge it (The reason people run for these obscure, low-paying jobs is so they can get rich on the taxpayers' dime - so they can rezone and procure and otherwise redirect money and influence to their own interests. No one does it as a fun hobby.)
- Aeolun 5y ago
  > No one does it as a fun hobby Most people I’ve met doing anything like this for less than minimum wage are absolutely doing it for fun, or to help their communities. If they sometimes assign the job to their friend Josh instead of the faceless general contractor 3 towns over, can you blame them?
  - newaccount74 5y ago
    And if that friend Josh then sometimes pays them 10% in kickbacks, can you blame them for taking it? They are putting so much work in for so little, after all.