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Apparently the activist is homeless: https://www.nysfocus.com/2021/11/23/a-homeless-amazon-worker-tried-to-organize-a-union-then-amazon-fired-him/ https://www.n

by tyingq 5y ago

Apparently the activist is homeless: https://www.nysfocus.com/2021/11/23/a-homeless-amazon-worker-tried-to-organize-a-union-then-amazon-fired-him/ https://www.nysfocus.com/2021/11/23/a-homeless-amazon-worker... And “[NLRB] will issue a complaint if the case does not settle” sounds like some nice leverage to have.

aspenmayer 5y ago
Do these complaints have any kind of teeth? I feel bad for the workers, especially the one mentioned. It’s of little comfort to a homeless person to have their complaints upheld if it doesn’t result in a change in their material circumstances.
- tyingq 5y ago
  They can force compliance with an order, but no power for punitive awards, fines, etc. So basically they can force giving the job back with back pay. If I were this particular worker, knowing the NLRB will force at least that, I would ask for something much higher to settle. Though I suppose if you're homeless, you may not have that option to wait.
- kadoban 5y ago
  They have some teeth, yeah. Not enough that Amazon won't do similar things again though, I'm sure. Back pay and reinstatement are possible outcomes (in general for complaints, tbh I have no idea for this one), so it could have a real effect on the wronged.
pandemicsoul 5y ago
It always amazes me, in situations like this, that people just end up suffering even though the machine is "working on their behalf." Like, I used to have this idea – I have no idea where it came from – that if a crime happened to you, the government would step in and help you. Like, if your family member is murdered in your home, they'd come in and clean it up and help you fix the door since you'll be inconsolable. Or, if you get fired for something like this that the government would help you get back on your feet and make sure you have a place to stay and pay your bills. How utterly childish and naive that was. This country has no safety net and that's terrifying.
- selestify 5y ago
  I grew up with that sort of trust in authority too. Somewhere along the line — I’m not sure exactly where — that trust evaporated.
- ncallaway 5y ago
  > How utterly childish and naive that was. It's not childish. It's a totally reasonable expectation of how the world should work. Don't pass that off as childish, instead ask why the government is failing to meet its most basic obligations. It's only naive because the government has totally failed the people. There's no reason (other than a system designed to protect the interests of the wealthy instead of the needy) that it works this way. We should forge a world where such expectations aren't naive.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
- codewithcheese 5y ago
  In some countries there is victim of crime compensation. I don't know if it's timely enough to stop one becoming homeless.
- ErikVandeWater 5y ago
  > This country has no safety net and that's terrifying. No safety net whatsoever?
  - macintux 5y ago
    A thin one with gaping holes and a pile of corpses beneath it.
- nightski 5y ago
  Many people have a pretty strong safety net in their family and friends. I've been there for family members in tough spots and take a lot of comfort in knowing my immediate family would be there for me if I was in dire straights. It is terrifying and unfortunate for those who do not have that luxury though, and strong local communities can help there. We need to do a more. But I think in all cases where I have the option I'd prefer to rely on those close to me than the government. But it also emphasizes how much impact one can have just helping those in need directly instead of complaining about how crappy the government is.
worker767424 5y ago
I get that employees have the right to organize, but this guy was recently out of prison, living in a shelter, and his last job was a transitional job cleaning up trash by the freeway. You have to understand that when you organize, you're painting a target on your back. The guy just finished a prison sentence for robbery. Shut up and keep your head down. Let the middle class kids without police records do the organizing. Not saying this is OK or right, but it's the reality of the situation.
- TameAntelope 5y ago
  I'll even go a step further and say that if you've made a number of objectively bad major decisions in your life, I think it's worth spending a long while reflecting on your decision making process, rather than just keep taking swings like this guy seems to be doing.
  - tyingq 5y ago
    An alternative view is that a guy recently out of prison still found Amazon's working conditions bad enough to become an activist.
    - TameAntelope 5y ago
      I think he would have found something to be upset about regardless of what he did.
    - worker767424 5y ago
      It's really hard to say because the article limited it to this: > During his second week at Amazon, Smith was approached by workers involved in organizing the Amazon Labor Union. Although Smith loved his job, he thought there were things that could be improved. In particular, he said, he was concerned about the warehouse’s extremely rapid pace of work and lack of breaks.
      - tyingq 5y ago
        The article I linked to has lots more detail and direct quotes from Smith. https://www.nysfocus.com/2021/11/23/a-homeless-amazon-worker-tried-to-organize-a-union-then-amazon-fired-him/ https://www.nysfocus.com/2021/11/23/a-homeless-amazon-worker...

by tyingq 5y ago

aspenmayer 5y ago

Do these complaints have any kind of teeth? I feel bad for the workers, especially the one mentioned. It’s of little comfort to a homeless person to have their complaints upheld if it doesn’t result in a change in their material circumstances.

tyingq 5y ago
They can force compliance with an order, but no power for punitive awards, fines, etc. So basically they can force giving the job back with back pay. If I were this particular worker, knowing the NLRB will force at least that, I would ask for something much higher to settle. Though I suppose if you're homeless, you may not have that option to wait.
kadoban 5y ago
They have some teeth, yeah. Not enough that Amazon won't do similar things again though, I'm sure. Back pay and reinstatement are possible outcomes (in general for complaints, tbh I have no idea for this one), so it could have a real effect on the wronged.

pandemicsoul 5y ago

It always amazes me, in situations like this, that people just end up suffering even though the machine is "working on their behalf." Like, I used to have this idea – I have no idea where it came from – that if a crime happened to you, the government would step in and help you. Like, if your family member is murdered in your home, they'd come in and clean it up and help you fix the door since you'll be inconsolable. Or, if you get fired for something like this that the government would help you get back on your feet and make sure you have a place to stay and pay your bills. How utterly childish and naive that was. This country has no safety net and that's terrifying.

selestify 5y ago
I grew up with that sort of trust in authority too. Somewhere along the line — I’m not sure exactly where — that trust evaporated.
ncallaway 5y ago
> How utterly childish and naive that was. It's not childish. It's a totally reasonable expectation of how the world should work. Don't pass that off as childish, instead ask why the government is failing to meet its most basic obligations. It's only naive because the government has totally failed the people. There's no reason (other than a system designed to protect the interests of the wealthy instead of the needy) that it works this way. We should forge a world where such expectations aren't naive.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
codewithcheese 5y ago
In some countries there is victim of crime compensation. I don't know if it's timely enough to stop one becoming homeless.
ErikVandeWater 5y ago
> This country has no safety net and that's terrifying. No safety net whatsoever?
- macintux 5y ago
  A thin one with gaping holes and a pile of corpses beneath it.
nightski 5y ago
Many people have a pretty strong safety net in their family and friends. I've been there for family members in tough spots and take a lot of comfort in knowing my immediate family would be there for me if I was in dire straights. It is terrifying and unfortunate for those who do not have that luxury though, and strong local communities can help there. We need to do a more. But I think in all cases where I have the option I'd prefer to rely on those close to me than the government. But it also emphasizes how much impact one can have just helping those in need directly instead of complaining about how crappy the government is.

worker767424 5y ago

I get that employees have the right to organize, but this guy was recently out of prison, living in a shelter, and his last job was a transitional job cleaning up trash by the freeway. You have to understand that when you organize, you're painting a target on your back. The guy just finished a prison sentence for robbery. Shut up and keep your head down. Let the middle class kids without police records do the organizing. Not saying this is OK or right, but it's the reality of the situation.

TameAntelope 5y ago
I'll even go a step further and say that if you've made a number of objectively bad major decisions in your life, I think it's worth spending a long while reflecting on your decision making process, rather than just keep taking swings like this guy seems to be doing.
- tyingq 5y ago
  An alternative view is that a guy recently out of prison still found Amazon's working conditions bad enough to become an activist.
  - TameAntelope 5y ago
    I think he would have found something to be upset about regardless of what he did.
  - worker767424 5y ago
    It's really hard to say because the article limited it to this: > During his second week at Amazon, Smith was approached by workers involved in organizing the Amazon Labor Union. Although Smith loved his job, he thought there were things that could be improved. In particular, he said, he was concerned about the warehouse’s extremely rapid pace of work and lack of breaks.
    - tyingq 5y ago
      The article I linked to has lots more detail and direct quotes from Smith. https://www.nysfocus.com/2021/11/23/a-homeless-amazon-worker-tried-to-organize-a-union-then-amazon-fired-him/ https://www.nysfocus.com/2021/11/23/a-homeless-amazon-worker...