7 ms·

The bad news is it’s going to take a long time to heal. The good news is you can come back happier than you can imagine. In an ideal scenario you would quit wo

by orasis 5y ago

The bad news is it’s going to take a long time to heal. The good news is you can come back happier than you can imagine. In an ideal scenario you would quit working entirely to focus on your health, but I’m guessing this is not an option. You need to focus on the body first. The most important is sleep, but that is also difficult to address directly, so it’s best to focus on diet and exercise. You’ll likely have to design your entire day and week around these two things. Try the Whole 30 program first. It’s a way of eating that eliminates inflammation causing foods. DONT TRY TO LOSE WEIGHT! Weight loss is important for overall health but you’ll usually sleep worse during a weight loss phase. That said you’ll probably lose weight naturally anyway. Give up the alcohol for 30 days and consider weening off caffeine at some point since both of these will mess up your sleep. For exercise, you just have to find something enjoyable enough to do at least 3x per week. It really doesn’t matter what it is as long as it makes you a bit sore. Consistency is key - don’t overdo it by jumping into something like CrossFit. Lastly, WHY are you burning yourself out? Are you afraid of failing? Afraid of being broke? Afraid of being perceived as a loser? The WHY is a spiritual problem and may be addressed through meditation (slow), psychotherapy (slower), or psychedelics (fast but more risk). Until you resolve the WHY of your burnout you’ll likely remain stuck in this cycle.

ornornor 5y ago
> psychedelics (fast but more risk) Do you have any pointers or experience to expand on that point? How to go about it specifically so that it helps move towards a solution? What about combining it with psychotherapy?
HideousKojima 5y ago
Can't comment one way or the other on Whole 30, but my wife and I have drastically reduced our sugar consumption and it's made us feel significantly better. Eliminating it entirely is a huge pain, but choosing the lower/no sugar options whenever they're available has helped us cut out probably ~90% of our sugar consumption, and even just that has had a noticeable effect on our health.
- tinyhouse 5y ago
  Did you only eliminate sweets, chocolate, etc. or also bread, pasta, and all other things that break into glucose.
  - crawdog 5y ago
    I have been on a similar trend lately. Trying to first focus on low gluten/no gluten and nothing with processed sugar in it. Often hard to eliminate it all but even a dramatic cut back in processed foods has made a difference on my sleep.
    - dustymcp 5y ago
      Cutting out processed foods and making your own food everyday makes a huge difference!
  - taylorhou 5y ago
    body treats everything carbs (except for dietary fiber and sugar alcohols) as glucose eventually. getting under 50g net carbs a day is fairly easy. staying under 20g net is harder but not impossible these days.
    - trentgreene 5y ago
      Yeah... but that "eventually" is metabolically relevant. Anecdata, but 250g / day of complex carb felt very different to 125g simple carb + 125g complex carb / day. As an athlete, and at one point a keto based athlete, I'm confident that carbs per se were not the enemy.
  - HideousKojima 5y ago
    We tried keto for a month or so but it was a pain to keep up with (and getting more expensive because of meat price inflation).
  - umvi 5y ago
    Just eliminating sources of corn syrup and added sugar is a great first step, IMO. We cut out soda, sweets, and other added-sugar crap (but kept bread, milk, pasta, fruit, honey, etc) and that alone was a big improvement.
whitesilhouette 5y ago
This is a very good list. I'll add my to 2 cents to this. 1. Don't do any addiction. Alcohol, Psychedelics nothing. That's another spiral you won't be able to climb out from. 2. Taking some time off is the easiest way to figure out your l life. You will soon be able to realise your priorities in life. I'd say 2 months is good enough a time. But the most important thing is to not attempt doing any work stuff during the time out period.
- aqme28 5y ago
  "Don'd do any addiction" is unfortunately a lot easier said than done.
- cassianoleal 5y ago
  Psychedelics are generally not addictive [0], and if used correctly can help very much with burn out. [1][2] > They are generally considered physiologically safe and do not lead to dependence or addiction. [0] [0] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4813425/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4813425/ [1] https://melmagazine.com/en-us/story/how-to-cure-burnout https://melmagazine.com/en-us/story/how-to-cure-burnout [2] https://www.friedtheburnoutpodcast.com/post/dr-randi-raymond https://www.friedtheburnoutpodcast.com/post/dr-randi-raymond Edit: add references [1] and [2]
  - giantg2 5y ago
    It depends. Sure, they are generally not forming chemical dependence. Psychological addiction can still be an issue for people in this situation.
    - cassianoleal 5y ago
      Did you even read the phrase I quoted? It specifically says "do not lead to _dependence_ or _addiction_".
      - giantg2 5y ago
ohlookcake 5y ago
I know why I'm burning out, but I don't know what to do with the realisation. The fear of being fired, then broke, and then not being able to survive is real-ish. Advice?
- haswell 5y ago
  Do you feel like the realization/fear come from a rational place, or primarily driven by anxiety? Everyone’s journey is different, but depending on where that fear is coming from, I could imagine drastically different next steps. Personally, therapy has helped me immensely. A lot of my early anxiety about these things stemmed from severe imposter syndrome, and through the years I’ve gained enough confidence in myself to know that my skills are in demand, and survival is likely in the current market. But if that fear is due to other things - the health of your employer’s business, etc. then a very different course of action might be required.
  - tinyhouse 5y ago
    How people find a good therapist these days? I contacted about 10 already and all are fully booked.
- orasis 5y ago
  Our minds are conditioned to operate from a place of fear. The fear feeling is real. The fears may even be founded. The difference is whether you’re existing in the grip of that fear or thriving from a place of love. You could try reading something like “The Mastery of Love” by Don Miguel Ruiz to get a taste, but the healing has to come through the body and nervous system. You can’t will your way through this. Edit: Important note: The right antidepressant can help!
akiselev 5y ago
> Try the Whole 30 program first. It’s a way of eating that eliminates inflammation causing foods. DONT TRY TO LOSE WEIGHT! Weight loss is important for overall health but you’ll usually sleep worse during a weight loss phase. That said you’ll probably lose weight naturally anyway Can't stress this enough. I've spent the last decade trying to lose weight and failing, always yo-yoing up a little bit higher and losing confidence each time. Consistent diet changes are really freaking hard especially when you're battling other health issue. Aerobic exercise burns a hilariously tiny amount of calories for the effort and eventually it can eat away at motivation. Setting up a home gym to lift weights and trying to eat healthier rather less has done wonders for my health. ExRx has a lot of information [1] but the gist of it is that a pound of fat burns under 5 calories a day while a pound of lean muscle burns 30 calories a day without exercise and as much as 50 calories a day for up to several days after anaerobic exercise (weight lifting). The maximum grow rate is from half a pound to a pound (for those that won the genetic lottery) of lean muscle a week so in 10 weeks its possible to add 150-300 calories to your basal metabolic rate that requires minimal maintenance compared to on-going dieting. Weight lifting doesn't require that much effort [2] or maintenance, just proper form and equipment, so it's a lot easier to permanently incorporate in a schedule a few times a week than a life long dieting change. [1] https://exrx.net/FatLoss https://exrx.net/FatLoss [2] https://exrx.net/WeightTraining/Research https://exrx.net/WeightTraining/Research
- ammar_x 5y ago
  > Setting up a home gym to lift weights and trying to eat healthier... Does a treadmill work instead of weight lifting? Curious to know based on your experience.
  - akiselev 5y ago
    No, it needs to be anaerobic exercise.
BadCookie 5y ago
I'd like to add to the list of things to try: Go to an eye doctor if you haven't been in a while, even if you've always had perfect vision in the past. We tech workers spend a lot of time staring at screens, and minor eye discomfort can compound into a major source of stress without you necessarily being aware of it.
- tinyhouse 5y ago
  Interesting. Any links?
  - BadCookie 5y ago
    No, just personal anecdotal experience!
tomxor 5y ago
> For exercise, you just have to find something enjoyable enough to do I can't emphasise this enough, staying interested in doing gym exercise for the sake of fitness alone is not sustainable for most people - and boring even if you can. Exercise is an opportunity to find something physical you enjoy spending your time doing, and this can be as much a mental relief as a physical one. This is similar to how most of us enjoy learning about a technology far more while we have something directly in front of us to apply it to, getting fit and staying fit is really fun when you can apply it. Remember this does not only mean team sports, there is more to the world than what school PE exposed us to, there will definitely be something out there that interests you. It can also be great for your mental health in general, especially if it involves getting out into nature.
- convolvatron 5y ago
  agree completely. never into sports and absoutely hate gyms. but i started doing manual labor in a creative field, and getting around town using a bike and i'm much better for it.
  - jrib 5y ago
    curious: would mind describing exactly what kind of manual labor in a creative field?
    - convolvatron 5y ago
      art metal fabricator - metal manufacturing for sculptors and other artists that need specialist help producing work or tooling.
- maerF0x0 5y ago
  Piling on here to add gym's dont have the monopoly on exercise! Consider any of the following they all count: * Hiking in the woods or parks * Dancing lessons * Running, Walking, inline skating, long boarding, bicycling, and really anything remotely similar * martial arts in a dojo / club * Strength training doing calisthenics at one of those outdoor gym things. Keep in mind traditional strength training is great[1] for a number of reasons, but it's not the only way to get exercise. [1]: dare i say superior due to it's muscle preserving and bone density effects? but getting overly picky about optimality can be a source of burnout in of itself.

by orasis 5y ago

ornornor 5y ago

> psychedelics (fast but more risk) Do you have any pointers or experience to expand on that point? How to go about it specifically so that it helps move towards a solution? What about combining it with psychotherapy?

HideousKojima 5y ago

Can't comment one way or the other on Whole 30, but my wife and I have drastically reduced our sugar consumption and it's made us feel significantly better. Eliminating it entirely is a huge pain, but choosing the lower/no sugar options whenever they're available has helped us cut out probably ~90% of our sugar consumption, and even just that has had a noticeable effect on our health.

tinyhouse 5y ago
Did you only eliminate sweets, chocolate, etc. or also bread, pasta, and all other things that break into glucose.
- crawdog 5y ago
  I have been on a similar trend lately. Trying to first focus on low gluten/no gluten and nothing with processed sugar in it. Often hard to eliminate it all but even a dramatic cut back in processed foods has made a difference on my sleep.
  - dustymcp 5y ago
    Cutting out processed foods and making your own food everyday makes a huge difference!
- taylorhou 5y ago
  body treats everything carbs (except for dietary fiber and sugar alcohols) as glucose eventually. getting under 50g net carbs a day is fairly easy. staying under 20g net is harder but not impossible these days.
  - trentgreene 5y ago
    Yeah... but that "eventually" is metabolically relevant. Anecdata, but 250g / day of complex carb felt very different to 125g simple carb + 125g complex carb / day. As an athlete, and at one point a keto based athlete, I'm confident that carbs per se were not the enemy.
- HideousKojima 5y ago
  We tried keto for a month or so but it was a pain to keep up with (and getting more expensive because of meat price inflation).
- umvi 5y ago
  Just eliminating sources of corn syrup and added sugar is a great first step, IMO. We cut out soda, sweets, and other added-sugar crap (but kept bread, milk, pasta, fruit, honey, etc) and that alone was a big improvement.

whitesilhouette 5y ago

This is a very good list. I'll add my to 2 cents to this. 1. Don't do any addiction. Alcohol, Psychedelics nothing. That's another spiral you won't be able to climb out from. 2. Taking some time off is the easiest way to figure out your l life. You will soon be able to realise your priorities in life. I'd say 2 months is good enough a time. But the most important thing is to not attempt doing any work stuff during the time out period.

aqme28 5y ago
"Don'd do any addiction" is unfortunately a lot easier said than done.
cassianoleal 5y ago
Psychedelics are generally not addictive [0], and if used correctly can help very much with burn out. [1][2] > They are generally considered physiologically safe and do not lead to dependence or addiction. [0] [0] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4813425/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4813425/ [1] https://melmagazine.com/en-us/story/how-to-cure-burnout https://melmagazine.com/en-us/story/how-to-cure-burnout [2] https://www.friedtheburnoutpodcast.com/post/dr-randi-raymond https://www.friedtheburnoutpodcast.com/post/dr-randi-raymond Edit: add references [1] and [2]
- giantg2 5y ago
  It depends. Sure, they are generally not forming chemical dependence. Psychological addiction can still be an issue for people in this situation.
  - cassianoleal 5y ago
    Did you even read the phrase I quoted? It specifically says "do not lead to _dependence_ or _addiction_".
    - giantg2 5y ago

ohlookcake 5y ago

I know why I'm burning out, but I don't know what to do with the realisation. The fear of being fired, then broke, and then not being able to survive is real-ish. Advice?

haswell 5y ago
Do you feel like the realization/fear come from a rational place, or primarily driven by anxiety? Everyone’s journey is different, but depending on where that fear is coming from, I could imagine drastically different next steps. Personally, therapy has helped me immensely. A lot of my early anxiety about these things stemmed from severe imposter syndrome, and through the years I’ve gained enough confidence in myself to know that my skills are in demand, and survival is likely in the current market. But if that fear is due to other things - the health of your employer’s business, etc. then a very different course of action might be required.
- tinyhouse 5y ago
  How people find a good therapist these days? I contacted about 10 already and all are fully booked.
orasis 5y ago
Our minds are conditioned to operate from a place of fear. The fear feeling is real. The fears may even be founded. The difference is whether you’re existing in the grip of that fear or thriving from a place of love. You could try reading something like “The Mastery of Love” by Don Miguel Ruiz to get a taste, but the healing has to come through the body and nervous system. You can’t will your way through this. Edit: Important note: The right antidepressant can help!

akiselev 5y ago

> Try the Whole 30 program first. It’s a way of eating that eliminates inflammation causing foods. DONT TRY TO LOSE WEIGHT! Weight loss is important for overall health but you’ll usually sleep worse during a weight loss phase. That said you’ll probably lose weight naturally anyway Can't stress this enough. I've spent the last decade trying to lose weight and failing, always yo-yoing up a little bit higher and losing confidence each time. Consistent diet changes are really freaking hard especially when you're battling other health issue. Aerobic exercise burns a hilariously tiny amount of calories for the effort and eventually it can eat away at motivation. Setting up a home gym to lift weights and trying to eat healthier rather less has done wonders for my health. ExRx has a lot of information [1] but the gist of it is that a pound of fat burns under 5 calories a day while a pound of lean muscle burns 30 calories a day without exercise and as much as 50 calories a day for up to several days after anaerobic exercise (weight lifting). The maximum grow rate is from half a pound to a pound (for those that won the genetic lottery) of lean muscle a week so in 10 weeks its possible to add 150-300 calories to your basal metabolic rate that requires minimal maintenance compared to on-going dieting. Weight lifting doesn't require that much effort [2] or maintenance, just proper form and equipment, so it's a lot easier to permanently incorporate in a schedule a few times a week than a life long dieting change. [1] https://exrx.net/FatLoss https://exrx.net/FatLoss [2] https://exrx.net/WeightTraining/Research https://exrx.net/WeightTraining/Research

ammar_x 5y ago
> Setting up a home gym to lift weights and trying to eat healthier... Does a treadmill work instead of weight lifting? Curious to know based on your experience.
- akiselev 5y ago
  No, it needs to be anaerobic exercise.

BadCookie 5y ago

I'd like to add to the list of things to try: Go to an eye doctor if you haven't been in a while, even if you've always had perfect vision in the past. We tech workers spend a lot of time staring at screens, and minor eye discomfort can compound into a major source of stress without you necessarily being aware of it.

tinyhouse 5y ago
Interesting. Any links?
- BadCookie 5y ago
  No, just personal anecdotal experience!

tomxor 5y ago

> For exercise, you just have to find something enjoyable enough to do I can't emphasise this enough, staying interested in doing gym exercise for the sake of fitness alone is not sustainable for most people - and boring even if you can. Exercise is an opportunity to find something physical you enjoy spending your time doing, and this can be as much a mental relief as a physical one. This is similar to how most of us enjoy learning about a technology far more while we have something directly in front of us to apply it to, getting fit and staying fit is really fun when you can apply it. Remember this does not only mean team sports, there is more to the world than what school PE exposed us to, there will definitely be something out there that interests you. It can also be great for your mental health in general, especially if it involves getting out into nature.

convolvatron 5y ago
agree completely. never into sports and absoutely hate gyms. but i started doing manual labor in a creative field, and getting around town using a bike and i'm much better for it.
- jrib 5y ago
  curious: would mind describing exactly what kind of manual labor in a creative field?
  - convolvatron 5y ago
    art metal fabricator - metal manufacturing for sculptors and other artists that need specialist help producing work or tooling.
maerF0x0 5y ago
Piling on here to add gym's dont have the monopoly on exercise! Consider any of the following they all count: * Hiking in the woods or parks * Dancing lessons * Running, Walking, inline skating, long boarding, bicycling, and really anything remotely similar * martial arts in a dojo / club * Strength training doing calisthenics at one of those outdoor gym things. Keep in mind traditional strength training is great[1] for a number of reasons, but it's not the only way to get exercise. [1]: dare i say superior due to it's muscle preserving and bone density effects? but getting overly picky about optimality can be a source of burnout in of itself.