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Police in this tiny Alabama town suck drivers into legal ‘black hole’
- rileymat2 5y ago> Brookside Police did patrol the 1.5-mile stretch of Interstate 22 within their jurisdiction and wrote tickets that brought in $82,467 in fines. So that was the most productive one? After salary, health care and operating costs, The roi does not sound all that good.
- rasz 5y agoChevy Chase and Demi Moor did a documentary about this practice https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nothing_but_Trouble_(1991_film) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nothing_but_Trouble_(1991_film...
- RoyTyrell 5y agoThis sounds a lot like the typical small town where they try to make up for lost tax revenue by aggressive policing. One town I'll remember to never go I guess, not that I'd probably ever go there anyways. There was an old Rockford Files episode called Pastoria Prime Pick, where a small Calforinia town was growing economically by mixing small real and manufacturing/setting-up people with big crimes in order to either solicit bribes for lower crimes and take in huge fines.
- MisterBastahrd 5y agoFrom my personal experience, Golden Meadow in Louisiana is exactly that sort of speed trap. Those cops will absolutely pull you over for doing 1 over the speed limit even though the limit for the area is unnaturally low for the stretch of highway they police. So is Boutte, but only between the Walmart and Dominoes on Highway 90... that'd be the blackest section of the local community, which is essentially the color of every person you'll ever see pulled over in that area, despite it being a busy part of the highway.
- vgeek 5y agoThey have to get the out of towners going to Grand Isle?
- MisterBastahrd 5y agoYeah. Apparently it's been a thing for a very long time. I haven't been down there in forever, but apparently their plan is to raise Highway 1 and charge tolls instead.
- BXLE_1-1-BitIs1 5y agoThere needs to be a RICO prosecution.
- AnonMessiah 5y agoBiggest gang in town.
- throwaway0a5e 5y agoThe TLAs will never allow them to set that precedent.
- HWR_14 5y agoThe DOJ under Obama and earlier used to regularly sue in cases like this. Probably not as often as they needed to, but they did.
- jcpham2 5y agoWelcome to Alabama! Many many towns and cities use the 1.5 mile jurisdiction [1] to rake in extra revenue from neighboring unincorporated areas. https://www.annistonstar.com/the_daily_home/state-supreme-court-rules-in-favor-of-cale-over-lincoln/article_5853b694-87ba-11e8-b09f-ab1400b8bf51.html https://www.annistonstar.com/the_daily_home/state-supreme-co... Basically for the cost of a city attorney whose job literally rests on loose interpretations of state statutes, you can collect monies from all sorts of people outside of your official city limits. Think safety codes and enforcement and then make the easy jump to Dollar General business licenses which are a percentage of turnover. Policing I22 in Brookside is the tip of the iceberg
- wly_cdgr 5y ago
- f0xtrot 5y agoThat's what it comes down to, what is the law (reguardless of any ethics/morals). For some reason the leash laws are never enforced tho... Seems that could add up to large fines in the same way. Sadly the courts actually ruled the police have no duty to uphold the law, they literaly get to choose if and when they intervene. including murders, rape, home invasion, etc. and won't face repercussion for looking the other way.
- SigmundA 5y agoDown here if FL we had a town called Waldo who's police department was disbanded for similar behavior, it was notorious for a long time: https://www.orlandosentinel.com/business/os-waldo-speed-trap-no-more-20180711-story.html https://www.orlandosentinel.com/business/os-waldo-speed-trap...
- culopatin 5y agoI still drive 5 under through there. I still see them hunting. I go to the FIRM racetrack often and my car looks like a speed trapper’s dream. So I’m extra cautious.
- Pigalowda 5y agoModern highway brigands. Kind of interesting that exists still in the US.
- nus07 5y agoThe more I read and experience such things along with the healthcare scam and sudden bills from hospitals and haggling with insurance, the more I wonder why I immigrated to the US when I could have taken my software skills and education to anywhere else like Europe or Canada. This country is for hustlers and grifters and the cunning.
- sokoloff 5y agoThere’s still a significant salary spread between the US and most of Canada and Europe (Switzerland is competitive with the US, but most of the rest is not). Remote working may close some of the gap, but right now there’s a wide gap.
- nus07 5y agoI don't think I care about salary so much especially when I hear that the other countries have a better social safety net. As a software engineer I am confident I can make decent pay for the area. I am not looking to send my kids to private school or avail a world class surgeon or have a beach house or make millions. I just want a good happy middle class life writing code and without a lot of hustling. And somehow the US does not seem very conducive to that.
- melony 5y agoThen move to Canada and see how much you like it. It is trivial for an American software engineer with a degree to immigrate over. There is a reason why Canadians come here rather than remain up north (hint it's not just the weather).
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- estaseuropano 5y agoIf you have experience and good English skills you should be able to find programming jobs in most of the bigger EU countries. And world class surgeons are everywhere, you just don't pay world class prices everywhere. I don't need or want a famous surgeon, I want someone that makes sure I'm well and that I don't need to pay off for the rest of my life. Anecdote: When he was three my son needed a rare emergency surgery. He had an ambulance transfer to a specialist pediatric hospital from another hospital where he was first admitted. They brought a specialist in just for that surgery. My son then stayed three weeks in the children's hospital and I slept next to him on a bed. I paid nothing for any of this except my own sandwiches, and was by his side the whole time. This was the summer holiday period and fell into our annual three weeks of summer vacation. I sent my work my medical certificate and they registered this (as required by law) as sick days and I was able to move my vacation days to right after the hospital stay, meaning I lost not even a single vacation day. Of course i also got full pay for those days with my son sleeping in the hospital, so I was neither working (except for some minimum email forwarding and answering simple queries) nor did I lose any salary, benefits, sick days, leave days, ... And I knew that there was no risk whatsoever that i wouldn't lose my job or insurance. Honestly I would not give any of this up for twice or thrice the money. ~40-50% of everyone's gross salary goes to all these services and we pay close to 20% VAT, but this buys us comfort and security. No one dies because they can't afford treatment - even the homeless or irregular migrants can go to the ER and get care (but likely far less than we are lucky yo receive).
- bmitc 5y agoThis literally defines gang behavior.
- dejj 5y agohttps://web.archive.org/web/20220119164824/https://www.al.com/news/2022/01/police-in-this-tiny-alabama-town-suck-drivers-into-legal-black-hole.html https://web.archive.org/web/20220119164824/https://www.al.co...
- wkimeria 5y agoThere are a lot of towns like this in America. Towns where the sole source of income is traffic tickets, and often that revenue stream comes from a disproportionately black and/or poor population (this was the case with Ferguson MO. The justice report after Michael Brown was murdered pointed to this as one of the factors that led to so much contact between the minority population and police) https://www.justice.gov/sites/default/files/opa/press-releases/attachments/2015/03/04/ferguson_police_department_report.pdf https://www.justice.gov/sites/default/files/opa/press-releas... ---- > Ferguson has allowed its focus on revenue generation to fundamentally compromise the role of Ferguson’s municipal court. The municipal court does not act as a neutral arbiter of the law or a check on unlawful police conduct. Instead, the court primarily uses its judicial authority as the means to compel the payment of fines and fees that advance the City’s financial interests. This has led to court practices that violate the Fourteenth Amendment’s due process and equal protection requirements. The court’s practices also impose unnecessary harm, overwhelmingly on African-American individuals, and run counter to public safety. Most strikingly, the court issues municipal arrest warrants not on the basis of public safety needs, but rather as a routine response to missed court appearances and required fine payments. In 2013 alone, the court issued over 9,000 warrants on cases stemming in large part from minor violations such as parking infractions, traffic tickets, or housing code violations. Jail time would be considered far too harsh a penalty for the great majority of these code violations, yet Ferguson’s municipal court routinely issues warrants for people to be arrested and incarcerated for failing to timely pay related fines and fees. Under state law, a failure to appear in municipal court on a traffic charge involving a moving violation also results in a license suspension. Ferguson has made this penalty even more onerous by only allowing the suspension to be lifted after payment of an owed fine is made in full. Further, until recently, Ferguson also added charges, fines, and fees for each missed appearance and payment. Many pending cases still include such charges that were imposed before the court recently eliminated them, making it as difficult as before for people to resolve these cases. --- The full report is with reading. Also add asset forfeiture to the equation (usually targeted at poor and minority populations who cannot find it) and you have a toxic cycle of racism that feeds into more traffic stops of certain populations which then feeds into stats about that same population, rinse and repeat. But asset forfeiture can cast an even wider death. The murder of millionaire Donald Scott by LA county police was motivated by the fact that they hoped to seize his ranch through asset forfeiture if they found any wrongdoing/illegal activities there (there were none) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Donald_Scott https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Donald_Scott
- wkimeria 5y agoThere was a notorious road in Wilmington VT that was known for targeting out of towners in the mid to late 90s. It was a 35 MPH road that abruptly changed to 25 MPH. I'm from MA. I was in the area camping and I saw the 35 MPH speed limit. Was driving 35 MPH. Then I saw the 25 MPH and began slowing down at a sensible rate and got immediately pulled over by a cop who was literally camping out between the 2 signs. I got a ticket for going 29 MPH in a 25 MPH zone. The only way you could have gotten down to 25 MPH was to slam on the brakes. I could fight the ticket, but that would mean driving back to Vermont for the court date (a 3-4 hour drive and whole day away from work). I just ended up paying it (it was over $100). Only later did I find out that stretch of road was notorious for this and the cops preyed on out of towners who had no idea they needed to slam on their brakes before the poorly indicated 25 MPH zone (locals knew to do this). The traffic stop served absolutely no purpose other than revenue.
- daengh 5y agoI had occasion to be out on the back roads in Utah with a local. At every little hamlet the speed limit dropped 20 mph in two increments over about 50 yards. As was explained to me it was for revenue. Either you'd break one or the other speed limits, or you'd do a panic slowdown & get ticketed for "reckless driving"; either way a nice fine for the town coffers.
- vannevar 5y agoThis is such a clear conflict of interest with the potential for corruption that every state should require that municipal fines go to a general fund. Under no circumstances should a police department be a revenue center.
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- sesuximo 5y agoMaybe we can fund a big sign that says “warning: you are entering a highly policed area. You are advised to find an alternate route!”
- djmips 5y agoWhat about a GPS based alert.
- muttled 5y agoInterested to see what fully self-driving cars will do to these types of schemes. What happens to police departments when the cars no longer do anything ticket-able?