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I've had 3 of 3 packages go missing in the last two months, all traveling via train through L.A. Either I'm rather unlucky or the thefts are rather thorough. I

I've had 3 of 3 packages go missing in the last two months, all traveling via train through L.A. Either I'm rather unlucky or the thefts are rather thorough. I see some people complaining about their packages being stolen, but if the thefts are that thorough I would expect to see many more. My conspiracy brain can't help but imagine the possibility that discussion of this is being gently suppressed because business don't want people to stop buying things. I've had to stop buying things for now. I hope this is properly resolved soon.

bhelkey 5y ago
> I've had 3 of 3 packages go missing in the last two months Did the packages get replaced?
- cjbgkagh 5y ago
  Refunds / replacements are in progress. I think customer service is a bit stretched at the moment. I'm not sure about the law but I think you have to receive the item to be considered to have taken delivery.
  - bhelkey 5y ago
    I see, I guess I figured that the merchant would detect that the package was never delivered and just ship another product on their end. Maybe I was a bit optimistic.
    - cjbgkagh 5y ago
      They are smaller boutique vendors and USPS and FedEx still have the packages as 'in transit'. Only the first package is considered lost by USPS and that was after 6 weeks of no updates and two escalations. At that time I had no idea train thefts were going on. The goods are expensive and low margin. I imagine it's not typically worth insuring though as it would normally be worth playing the odds. I would imagine having so much systemic theft at the same time would be crushing such vendors.
      - seanmcdirmid 5y ago
        If they are stealing USPS packages, won’t the feds or federal postal cops get involved?
        cjbgkagh 5y ago
        I would imagine they’re overwhelmed atm. I think being a serious crime has kept the theft down for some time. Before this I’ve only had one package go missing in 10 years and I think that’s because the package was super tiny and got lost.
Androider 5y ago
I placed an order just this month from Costco, with UPS sending three separate "Shipment has left LA" notifications repeating every few days, and the "UPS 3-day delivery" ended up taking over two weeks in the end. The 4th delivery attempt then originated from Canada and did arrive. I didn't have to do anything about it, and it didn't show any errors like "oops we lost the package". This makes me think that they did lose the package(s), and either UPS or Costco just ate the cost.
- cjbgkagh 5y ago
  Wow, it sounds like they did eat the costs, 3 out of 3 for LA again. That does seem rather thorough.
  - ejb999 5y ago
    >>Wow, it sounds like they did eat the costs, 3 out of 3 for LA again. That does seem rather thorough. 'they' didn't eat the cost of anything, 'we' are paying the cost thru higher prices on everything we buy.
    - cjbgkagh 5y ago
      I think the phrase 'eat the cost' is apt, and I agree that we will pay through higher prices. It would still cost them money that they otherwise would have made. Perhaps the major beneficiaries are the freight insurance companies.
    - rhexs 5y ago
      As they should. The simple solution is to raise the costs to make freight delivery profitable through what is now apparently lawless California. Each Californian served by this route should have to pay a California surcharge to pay for insurance and the cost of reshipping when a train robbery occurs. Or you know, California could just enforce the law. But the people have voted and spoken.
    - chrischen 5y ago
      Yea one of the greatest lies in ecommerce is “free shipping” and now that Amazon has a near monopoly: “free returns.” In fact in a competitive market businesses would undercut each other to the point they can’t do free returns, which is why Amazon started introducing it after they gained market share. Both these seemingly pro-consumer policies (along with zero liability on lost shipments) is really just a mandatory upsell (think shipping insurance), but where the costs are opaque and built into what you already paid.
beerandt 5y ago
From the articles previously posted, much of what's being targeted and stolen are shipments destined to wholesalers and retailers, not consumers.
- cjbgkagh 5y ago
  That's what I heard as well, they also said thousands of packages. If it was thousands of packages then I would have to have been incredibly unlucky to have 3 for 3 out of thousands. That number must be off by at least a few orders of magnitude. I've also separately heard that Amazon, USPS, and FedEx is being targeted.
  - beerandt 5y ago
    Unless you're ordering something that's essentially some form of manufacturer to consumer drop shipping. Then it could look more like a retail delivery than a consumer one.
    - cjbgkagh 5y ago
      They were clearly consumer. I think the reporting is off, I just don’t know why.
- wrycoder 5y ago
  If you look at the litter along the tracks in the YouTube videos, you'll see that it's largely small consumer-level packages. I was surprised that there would be containers of those.
  - octoberfranklin 5y ago
    Same here. Especially on a train. Railroads really really hate containers with a passion. Anything that doesn't need to be refrigerated or go on a boat, they will press hard to put it in a boxcar. Or in a 16-foot truck trailer sitting on top of a flatcar (used to see those go by all the time with UPS logos on them).
gruez 5y ago
>My conspiracy brain can't help but imagine the possibility that discussion of this is being gently suppressed because business don't want people to stop buying things who cares? the merchant is shouldering the risk of theft, not me. if the price is good I'll still buy it.
- pvarangot 5y ago
  If the word came out that your two/three day delivery is going to now take two weeks people would probably shop differently. There's a lot of stuff I don't buy locally because going to the store that has it on the Bay Area is expensive as I don't have a car. If shipping is going to be between one day or two weeks because logistics are unreliable I'd consider the expense.
throwawayboise 5y ago
I think it's hilarious. LA is getting what they voted for.
- dang 5y ago
  Would you please stop posting flamebait and/or unsubstantive comments? You've been doing it repeatedly, and we ban that sort of account. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
desmosxxx 5y ago
Had a package about 2 weeks ago stuck right outside of LA and actually got an unsolicited email from the company to click for a refund. Wife has one stuck in LA right now. We've maybe ordered around 10 packages in the last month. Seems pretty significant, I'd love to see an estimate of the impact.
muzz 5y ago
How exactly do you know your packages were "all traveling via train through L.A."?
- cjbgkagh 5y ago
  They have tracking and were last scanned at a train based depo in LA before going missing.
  - muzz 5y ago
    Interesting. Which shipper provides that level of specificity, and do you have to pay extra for it? I've only seen the city name and some value description like "Fedex origin city" or "Fedex hub"
    - Symbiote 5y ago
      Given how large LA is, it would be reasonable to have the port, railhead, airport and local distribution centres as separate locations on the tracking list. I see things like "Prague Airport FedEx hub" with FedEx in Europe.

bhelkey 5y ago

> I've had 3 of 3 packages go missing in the last two months Did the packages get replaced?

cjbgkagh 5y ago
Refunds / replacements are in progress. I think customer service is a bit stretched at the moment. I'm not sure about the law but I think you have to receive the item to be considered to have taken delivery.
- bhelkey 5y ago
  I see, I guess I figured that the merchant would detect that the package was never delivered and just ship another product on their end. Maybe I was a bit optimistic.
  - cjbgkagh 5y ago
    They are smaller boutique vendors and USPS and FedEx still have the packages as 'in transit'. Only the first package is considered lost by USPS and that was after 6 weeks of no updates and two escalations. At that time I had no idea train thefts were going on. The goods are expensive and low margin. I imagine it's not typically worth insuring though as it would normally be worth playing the odds. I would imagine having so much systemic theft at the same time would be crushing such vendors.
    - seanmcdirmid 5y ago
      If they are stealing USPS packages, won’t the feds or federal postal cops get involved?
      - cjbgkagh 5y ago
        I would imagine they’re overwhelmed atm. I think being a serious crime has kept the theft down for some time. Before this I’ve only had one package go missing in 10 years and I think that’s because the package was super tiny and got lost.

Androider 5y ago

I placed an order just this month from Costco, with UPS sending three separate "Shipment has left LA" notifications repeating every few days, and the "UPS 3-day delivery" ended up taking over two weeks in the end. The 4th delivery attempt then originated from Canada and did arrive. I didn't have to do anything about it, and it didn't show any errors like "oops we lost the package". This makes me think that they did lose the package(s), and either UPS or Costco just ate the cost.

cjbgkagh 5y ago
Wow, it sounds like they did eat the costs, 3 out of 3 for LA again. That does seem rather thorough.
- ejb999 5y ago
  >>Wow, it sounds like they did eat the costs, 3 out of 3 for LA again. That does seem rather thorough. 'they' didn't eat the cost of anything, 'we' are paying the cost thru higher prices on everything we buy.
  - cjbgkagh 5y ago
    I think the phrase 'eat the cost' is apt, and I agree that we will pay through higher prices. It would still cost them money that they otherwise would have made. Perhaps the major beneficiaries are the freight insurance companies.
  - rhexs 5y ago
    As they should. The simple solution is to raise the costs to make freight delivery profitable through what is now apparently lawless California. Each Californian served by this route should have to pay a California surcharge to pay for insurance and the cost of reshipping when a train robbery occurs. Or you know, California could just enforce the law. But the people have voted and spoken.
  - chrischen 5y ago
    Yea one of the greatest lies in ecommerce is “free shipping” and now that Amazon has a near monopoly: “free returns.” In fact in a competitive market businesses would undercut each other to the point they can’t do free returns, which is why Amazon started introducing it after they gained market share. Both these seemingly pro-consumer policies (along with zero liability on lost shipments) is really just a mandatory upsell (think shipping insurance), but where the costs are opaque and built into what you already paid.

beerandt 5y ago

From the articles previously posted, much of what's being targeted and stolen are shipments destined to wholesalers and retailers, not consumers.

cjbgkagh 5y ago
That's what I heard as well, they also said thousands of packages. If it was thousands of packages then I would have to have been incredibly unlucky to have 3 for 3 out of thousands. That number must be off by at least a few orders of magnitude. I've also separately heard that Amazon, USPS, and FedEx is being targeted.
- beerandt 5y ago
  Unless you're ordering something that's essentially some form of manufacturer to consumer drop shipping. Then it could look more like a retail delivery than a consumer one.
  - cjbgkagh 5y ago
    They were clearly consumer. I think the reporting is off, I just don’t know why.
wrycoder 5y ago
If you look at the litter along the tracks in the YouTube videos, you'll see that it's largely small consumer-level packages. I was surprised that there would be containers of those.
- octoberfranklin 5y ago
  Same here. Especially on a train. Railroads really really hate containers with a passion. Anything that doesn't need to be refrigerated or go on a boat, they will press hard to put it in a boxcar. Or in a 16-foot truck trailer sitting on top of a flatcar (used to see those go by all the time with UPS logos on them).

gruez 5y ago

>My conspiracy brain can't help but imagine the possibility that discussion of this is being gently suppressed because business don't want people to stop buying things who cares? the merchant is shouldering the risk of theft, not me. if the price is good I'll still buy it.

pvarangot 5y ago
If the word came out that your two/three day delivery is going to now take two weeks people would probably shop differently. There's a lot of stuff I don't buy locally because going to the store that has it on the Bay Area is expensive as I don't have a car. If shipping is going to be between one day or two weeks because logistics are unreliable I'd consider the expense.

throwawayboise 5y ago

I think it's hilarious. LA is getting what they voted for.

dang 5y ago
Would you please stop posting flamebait and/or unsubstantive comments? You've been doing it repeatedly, and we ban that sort of account. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

desmosxxx 5y ago

Had a package about 2 weeks ago stuck right outside of LA and actually got an unsolicited email from the company to click for a refund. Wife has one stuck in LA right now. We've maybe ordered around 10 packages in the last month. Seems pretty significant, I'd love to see an estimate of the impact.

muzz 5y ago

How exactly do you know your packages were "all traveling via train through L.A."?

cjbgkagh 5y ago
They have tracking and were last scanned at a train based depo in LA before going missing.
- muzz 5y ago
  Interesting. Which shipper provides that level of specificity, and do you have to pay extra for it? I've only seen the city name and some value description like "Fedex origin city" or "Fedex hub"
  - Symbiote 5y ago
    Given how large LA is, it would be reasonable to have the port, railhead, airport and local distribution centres as separate locations on the tracking list. I see things like "Prague Airport FedEx hub" with FedEx in Europe.