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What will that accomplish? If a putative father is already suspicious (and doesn’t want to be a father), sure, then having a NIPT would make sense. But there is

What will that accomplish? If a putative father is already suspicious (and doesn’t want to be a father), sure, then having a NIPT would make sense. But there is already an avenue for that. You would want to make that mandatory for all pregnancies? Not everyone wants to know that information and having a mandatory test could force people (fathers) into situations they don’t want to be in. Kids are more than a financial responsibility.

toomuchtodo 5y ago
If it's not your kid biologically, and you're not a willing participant, it's not your responsibility. Pursue the biological parent for support. To do otherwise is equivalent to fraud. We don't force foster kids on people without their informed consent. This is no different. Edit: We agree to disagree. I fall firmly in the mandatory testing camp for accuracy of paternity for all involved parties. Trust but verify.
- mbreese 5y ago
  If you’re not a willing participant, then you can still have the test. If you’re the type where if the kid isn’t your biological kid, then you wouldn’t want to be a father to them — then get a test. The question is — should it be mandatory for all pregnancies? Willing participant or otherwise. I’m not saying no one should have paternity testing. It should certainly be available. I just don’t think you should mandate it.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - hackerfromthefu 5y ago
    Its also important to remove any doubt - to strengthen the bond in the cases where its true
    - jakimfett 5y ago
      Given that before birth, it's the woman's body, and after birth it's the child's body being tested, and there is no clear medical case for paternity testing being a life-saving operation somehow... --- ...a mandatory test puts serious amounts of potential harm in the hands of a field that historically (and as demonstrated by some of the regrettable opinions expressed in this conversation thread), completely ignores the rights and consent of a woman and child while discussing how men might feel or believe about said topics. Relationships are complex things, and blanket legislation will never respect the full consent of the individuals involved. Give the mother freedom to request a pre-birth paternity test, and the child to request the results once they hit their teens, with confidential results. Anything past that is a relationship issue (does your spouse / child feel safe telling you the truth?), and any form of mandatory testing pre-birth would very much violate the bodily consent of the mother. Post-birth, if it's not a medically necessary operation, which paternity is not, it waits for when the kid is old enough to understand consent. Consent is not a debate. Consent is about functional boundary. In this case, it is simple: Not your body? Not your choice. Enable (their) choice instead of trying to control women and children's bodies, please.
      - hackerfromthefu 5y ago
        You seem to have missed the point, you mention that the mother and the child should have freedom to request a paternity test .. but in the vast majority of cases the mother knows, it's the father that does not know. In all cases the child is the mothers child, where the father can be tricked/defrauded into the most expensive cost they will ever bear for the rest of their life, on the basis of a lie. This is very obvious, completely unaddressed in your comment, and the rest of your argument is probably in bad faith.
    - imtringued 5y ago
      > to strengthen the bond in the cases where its true You mean when the parental relationship is compatible with the wishes of the potential step father. Knowing that the child isn't yours can be useful in either direction. Either you know it from the start and accept it from the start, or you refuse it from the start. This idea that we shouldn't bear bad news and hide them, hoping to profit off the confusion, is a horrible way to run a society. Learn to deal with the bad news. (ignoring them is how situations escalate and get way worse than they should be)
Dma54rhs 5y ago
Abortion is always a possibility for me and during the age when people talk about consent is the question really honest? It absolutely should be mandatory and men should have a sat in abortion itself as well, the bare minimum society can do when there's no consent is to erase the financial burden.
- sockpuppet_12 5y ago
belorn 5y ago
There is a common ethical perspective when dealing with laws like this, such as child support. What is best for the child? Should the child have a right to know who their biological parents are, or should the preferences of the parents decide that. If we determine that children are better of having such rights then the wishes of the parents tend to be disregarded, with some exceptions to religion which still supersede such ethical considerations.

toomuchtodo 5y ago

If it's not your kid biologically, and you're not a willing participant, it's not your responsibility. Pursue the biological parent for support. To do otherwise is equivalent to fraud. We don't force foster kids on people without their informed consent. This is no different. Edit: We agree to disagree. I fall firmly in the mandatory testing camp for accuracy of paternity for all involved parties. Trust but verify.

mbreese 5y ago
If you’re not a willing participant, then you can still have the test. If you’re the type where if the kid isn’t your biological kid, then you wouldn’t want to be a father to them — then get a test. The question is — should it be mandatory for all pregnancies? Willing participant or otherwise. I’m not saying no one should have paternity testing. It should certainly be available. I just don’t think you should mandate it.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- hackerfromthefu 5y ago
  Its also important to remove any doubt - to strengthen the bond in the cases where its true
  - jakimfett 5y ago
    Given that before birth, it's the woman's body, and after birth it's the child's body being tested, and there is no clear medical case for paternity testing being a life-saving operation somehow... --- ...a mandatory test puts serious amounts of potential harm in the hands of a field that historically (and as demonstrated by some of the regrettable opinions expressed in this conversation thread), completely ignores the rights and consent of a woman and child while discussing how men might feel or believe about said topics. Relationships are complex things, and blanket legislation will never respect the full consent of the individuals involved. Give the mother freedom to request a pre-birth paternity test, and the child to request the results once they hit their teens, with confidential results. Anything past that is a relationship issue (does your spouse / child feel safe telling you the truth?), and any form of mandatory testing pre-birth would very much violate the bodily consent of the mother. Post-birth, if it's not a medically necessary operation, which paternity is not, it waits for when the kid is old enough to understand consent. Consent is not a debate. Consent is about functional boundary. In this case, it is simple: Not your body? Not your choice. Enable (their) choice instead of trying to control women and children's bodies, please.
    - hackerfromthefu 5y ago
      You seem to have missed the point, you mention that the mother and the child should have freedom to request a paternity test .. but in the vast majority of cases the mother knows, it's the father that does not know. In all cases the child is the mothers child, where the father can be tricked/defrauded into the most expensive cost they will ever bear for the rest of their life, on the basis of a lie. This is very obvious, completely unaddressed in your comment, and the rest of your argument is probably in bad faith.
  - imtringued 5y ago
    > to strengthen the bond in the cases where its true You mean when the parental relationship is compatible with the wishes of the potential step father. Knowing that the child isn't yours can be useful in either direction. Either you know it from the start and accept it from the start, or you refuse it from the start. This idea that we shouldn't bear bad news and hide them, hoping to profit off the confusion, is a horrible way to run a society. Learn to deal with the bad news. (ignoring them is how situations escalate and get way worse than they should be)

Dma54rhs 5y ago

Abortion is always a possibility for me and during the age when people talk about consent is the question really honest? It absolutely should be mandatory and men should have a sat in abortion itself as well, the bare minimum society can do when there's no consent is to erase the financial burden.

sockpuppet_12 5y ago

belorn 5y ago

There is a common ethical perspective when dealing with laws like this, such as child support. What is best for the child? Should the child have a right to know who their biological parents are, or should the preferences of the parents decide that. If we determine that children are better of having such rights then the wishes of the parents tend to be disregarded, with some exceptions to religion which still supersede such ethical considerations.