6 ms·

UK Prime Minister can't tell the difference between a party and a work meeting

33 points by feurio 5y ago

jjgreen 5y ago
Astonishing. At that time I travelled into central London on Saturday to do a bit of food shopping (mainly to enjoy the strange emptiness of the never-empty city). When done, I'd sit on a bench in Soho square to drink a can of pop. There was always a group of police rotating the park asking (ever so politely) people to move on, as sitting on benches was not permitted. If you chose your bench wisely, it would take them about 20 minutes to get around to you. Clearly I would have been better off with 8 cans of Special Brew in the No 10 garden.
- dazc 5y ago
  A friend of mine lives in a block of apartments and, during first lockdown, there was a disturbance in one of the flats below. It turned out the single resident had her family staying over at the weekend (2 adults and 3 kids) and they had travelled 250 miles to be there. When we complained about the noise we were threatened with violence and told in no uncertain terms where to go. This was reported to the police and they did nothing. Let's not pretend that we were living in a Police state at the the time. Yes, I would expect better from the PM and his ministers but the rules were barely enforced anywhere, save your can of pop example and few other isolated cases.
  - antihero 5y ago
    Well don't be a narc then.
  - ngcc_hk 5y ago
    But as one of the poster said one has to compare like with like. Covered the whole uk is hard. But it seems they are good in policing the park. But not the garden of pm. Anyway he is way down in popularity. It is not because of a party (unless it is criminal office which has to wait for … no multi-dept cross enquiry I hope) … more at play in politics.
    - ralferoo 5y ago
      I lived next to Hyde Park at the time. On numerous occasions whilst doing my daily run, I witnessed excessive policing. For instance, a group of 4 police officers moving on a student who was on her own sat on the grass studying, 15m away from anyone else in every direction. Two police officers moving along two grannies who'd just sat down at opposite ends of a bench, and clearly needing a rest. Mounted police and police in cars were everywhere in Hyde Park harassing anyone who dared sit down, so I can only assume they were all so busy in the park that they didn't have time left over to pop round to Downing Street to check on things there. And yet it's really interesting that at the time the rules the government were saying we had to follow, weren't actually law. The official TV daily briefings said repeatedly that we could only have an hour outside for exercise, and only once per day, something that was simply a lie. The law stated only that one of the reasons for being outside was for exercise, and gave no time or frequency restrictions (except for in Wales, but the government advice in the briefings made out this was for the whole of the UK). They made the laws, they could have had any restrictions they wanted in them, but to pass one set of laws and then to misrepresent them to the public by imposing additional restrictions is pretty egregious, especially as it transpires that they weren't even following the rules or law themselves.
      - CodeGlitch 5y ago
        I don't think the police knew how to enforce the rules... so there was a lot of inconsistency.
- dspillett 5y ago
  > a group of police This is the same Met police who dismissed the December Downing Street party investigation with a statement of “not enough evidence” despite many eyewitnesses including the met police officers who would have been on duty on-site at the time checking and recording who was going in & out. But remember: we're all in it together, eh?
1cvmask 5y ago
Politicians here in California and the US are no different. The rules they advocate, mandate and prescribe to the masses do not apply to them. https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/heatherknight/article/S-F-Mayor-London-Breed-had-her-own-French-15767506.php https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/heatherknight/article/S-... https://abc7news.com/london-breed-french-laundry-san-francisco-stay-at-home-order-sf-coronavirus-covid-in/8852527/ https://abc7news.com/london-breed-french-laundry-san-francis... https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2020-12-03/skelton-edd-inmate-unemployment-fraud-scandal-french-laundry-embarassment https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2020-12-03/skelton-... https://edition.cnn.com/2021/02/18/opinions/california-governor-gavin-newsom-recall-mitchell/index.html https://edition.cnn.com/2021/02/18/opinions/california-gover... https://www.brproud.com/news/former-president-obama-celebrates-birthday-without-a-mask-and-social-media-reacts/ https://www.brproud.com/news/former-president-obama-celebrat...
- feurio 5y ago
  I can't read all of those because of stupid geo restrictions, but it looks like most of those were "advice" rather than law. This was most certainly against the actual law that the PM himself brought in.
Tycho 5y ago
This is one of the stupidest scandals I’ve ever seen. It makes Labour look very bad and deluded. They think the PM is going to resign because he stepped outside to the Downing St back garden for a short break and a glass of wine on a sunny day? Hall Monitor mentality in full effect.
- samwillis 5y ago
  I think you are missing the sentiment of the general public. A poll yesterday suggested two thirds of Brits would like him to resign [0] and another 56% [1], the public have had enough of him. Just wait for the polling from today after his statement to parliament, I suspect it will be even worse for him. Quite right though, he won't resign on his own accord, he will stay until he is pushed. But there is a very strong chance that is going to happen soon. 0: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/boris-johnson-poll-resign-party-b1990911.html https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/boris-johnson... 1: https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/1480931525235462145 https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/1480931525235462145
  - CodeGlitch 5y ago
    I'm not defending Boris here, but polls are never accurate and hardly ever correct when compared to actual elections. If polls were a real reflection of how the public are thinking why would we ever bother for a full-blown election? The best thing to do with polling is to ignore them.
- dazc 5y ago
  Couldn't agree more. The stupid thing really is that he didn't just fess-up at the outset and it would all be forgotten about by now.
  - antihero 5y ago
    If we'd "fessed up at the outset" we'd be fined.
    - 5y ago
samwillis 5y ago
For the none Brits on here, we are nearing the end of Boris Johnsons farcical term as PM. It could be just a matter of days until he is gone, and god know what then happens as there is no one obvious to take over - even on an interim basis. Most people I have spoken too would like there to be an early general election, even if they want another Conservative government, because we need to clear house and start afresh.
doingtheiroming 5y ago
It’s a trope in British politics that the real division is not between left and right but between roundhead and cavalier. It’s a useful way to think about things. The British tend to prefer a bit of the cavalier in their Prime Ministers. The cavaliers do well until they forget that the British also expect at least a roundheadish front when the times call for it. Like Charles I though, Johnson believes in the divine right of toffs and seems likely to end up with his Government decapitated.
- pydry 5y ago
  The British political circus's priorities doesnt reflect the priorities of British people. In most cases the fought over symbols (like this party) are reflective of the less well publicized power struggles and under the surface lobbying.
wanda 5y ago
I think what is more fascinating is that high-ranking politicians have always sought ways to circumvent the rules, in order to get ahead, securing themselves exorbitant personal fortunes, even in times of financial crisis, and often at the immediate or delayed expense of the taxpayer (if not simply evading taxes). And this phenomenon is not new. It has most probably been going on as long as the concept of money has been around, or even the concept of trade and personal-private wealth, be it tribal chieftains/shamans, monarchs and satellite nobles, land-owners/feudal leaders, warlords/military commanders, right the way up to contemporary politicians. and yet, what the people get up in arms about is the garden party? How many of the UK's politicians have bizarre private companies and "offshore" bank accounts? How many of them paved the way for absurd legislation and policy decisions that serve only the top 1%? How many of them let their actions be determined by lobbying and veiled bribery rather than any personal convictions or, heaven forfend, the views of the electorate? People are getting upset about this, even though a non-trivial portion of the same people broke the law at the same time to see family and party? The people should pay attention to what else is going on. Of course, the people mostly pay attention to whatever is put on the stage and given the spotlight. And that is determined not by an obligation to pursue and broadcast the truth, but rather by whatever can sell newspapers and online news subscriptions, and whatever can capture people's gaze on the television screen and online ad real estate -- but, critically, without shaking the foundations of the status quo. It's all just a theatrical presentation. Politics and its coverage in the media is little more than a reality TV show. None of it deserves your time of day.
- feurio 5y ago
  > People are getting upset about this, even though a non-trivial portion of the same people broke the law at the same time to see family and party? That's a may be, but they aren't Prime Minister and they haven't lied to the Commons and the entire British people about it.
  - wanda 5y ago
    Fair point. Can you show me a Prime Minister who hasn't lied to the Commons and the British populace about something? Sorry, that's unfair. Can you show me a [governing body/individual] who hasn't lied to the [country]'s populace about something? My point is only that people should be pretty pissed off about a host of other lies and fuck ups by this government and every government prior, but they're not. Why aren't they? Well, because when governments screw up, the world keeps ticking over. Somebody embezzles a few million here, does some insider trading there, covers for some sex offenders elsewhere, etc. But none of this messes with a person's daily routine. Their world keeps going, the company they work for still exists and if not, they'll just work somewhere else. And it's obviously a lot more effort to dethrone the bloated corpses of our entrenched governments, and even more effort to replace it with something that is better. Especially when, to the best of our knowledge, there isn't a better alternative to liberal democracy, but it comes with the small print that corruption is pretty much a part of it. No one wants to rock the boat. The boat's got some leaks, we have to empty the water out every now and then, sometimes she runs aground due to some fairly terrible decision making by the captains, but it's the only boat where people can live in relative peace that's proven seaworthy so far.
beardyw 5y ago
It might be good to ask at an interview. "Will I be able to tell a work meeting from a party". If the answer is no, life could be interesting.
crtasm 5y ago
Title should be "Boris Johnson admits attending Downing Street party during lockdown"
neilsense 5y ago
Honestly having The Guardian posted is the same as The Daily Mail, just the leftist version.
- MattPalmer1086 5y ago
  A better comparison might be between the Guardian and the Telegraph. The Daily Mail has a certain reputation... In any case, pretty much all the papers have lambasted Johnson on this. When the Tory press turn on a Tory PM, it's a good sign that their days are numbered...

33 points by feurio 5y ago

Astonishing. At that time I travelled into central London on Saturday to do a bit of food shopping (mainly to enjoy the strange emptiness of the never-empty city). When done, I'd sit on a bench in Soho square to drink a can of pop. There was always a group of police rotating the park asking (ever so politely) people to move on, as sitting on benches was not permitted. If you chose your bench wisely, it would take them about 20 minutes to get around to you. Clearly I would have been better off with 8 cans of Special Brew in the No 10 garden.

dazc 5y ago
A friend of mine lives in a block of apartments and, during first lockdown, there was a disturbance in one of the flats below. It turned out the single resident had her family staying over at the weekend (2 adults and 3 kids) and they had travelled 250 miles to be there. When we complained about the noise we were threatened with violence and told in no uncertain terms where to go. This was reported to the police and they did nothing. Let's not pretend that we were living in a Police state at the the time. Yes, I would expect better from the PM and his ministers but the rules were barely enforced anywhere, save your can of pop example and few other isolated cases.
- antihero 5y ago
  Well don't be a narc then.
- ngcc_hk 5y ago
  But as one of the poster said one has to compare like with like. Covered the whole uk is hard. But it seems they are good in policing the park. But not the garden of pm. Anyway he is way down in popularity. It is not because of a party (unless it is criminal office which has to wait for … no multi-dept cross enquiry I hope) … more at play in politics.
  - ralferoo 5y ago
    I lived next to Hyde Park at the time. On numerous occasions whilst doing my daily run, I witnessed excessive policing. For instance, a group of 4 police officers moving on a student who was on her own sat on the grass studying, 15m away from anyone else in every direction. Two police officers moving along two grannies who'd just sat down at opposite ends of a bench, and clearly needing a rest. Mounted police and police in cars were everywhere in Hyde Park harassing anyone who dared sit down, so I can only assume they were all so busy in the park that they didn't have time left over to pop round to Downing Street to check on things there. And yet it's really interesting that at the time the rules the government were saying we had to follow, weren't actually law. The official TV daily briefings said repeatedly that we could only have an hour outside for exercise, and only once per day, something that was simply a lie. The law stated only that one of the reasons for being outside was for exercise, and gave no time or frequency restrictions (except for in Wales, but the government advice in the briefings made out this was for the whole of the UK). They made the laws, they could have had any restrictions they wanted in them, but to pass one set of laws and then to misrepresent them to the public by imposing additional restrictions is pretty egregious, especially as it transpires that they weren't even following the rules or law themselves.
    - CodeGlitch 5y ago
      I don't think the police knew how to enforce the rules... so there was a lot of inconsistency.
dspillett 5y ago
> a group of police This is the same Met police who dismissed the December Downing Street party investigation with a statement of “not enough evidence” despite many eyewitnesses including the met police officers who would have been on duty on-site at the time checking and recording who was going in & out. But remember: we're all in it together, eh?

1cvmask 5y ago

Politicians here in California and the US are no different. The rules they advocate, mandate and prescribe to the masses do not apply to them. https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/heatherknight/article/S-F-Mayor-London-Breed-had-her-own-French-15767506.php https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/heatherknight/article/S-... https://abc7news.com/london-breed-french-laundry-san-francisco-stay-at-home-order-sf-coronavirus-covid-in/8852527/ https://abc7news.com/london-breed-french-laundry-san-francis... https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2020-12-03/skelton-edd-inmate-unemployment-fraud-scandal-french-laundry-embarassment https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2020-12-03/skelton-... https://edition.cnn.com/2021/02/18/opinions/california-governor-gavin-newsom-recall-mitchell/index.html https://edition.cnn.com/2021/02/18/opinions/california-gover... https://www.brproud.com/news/former-president-obama-celebrates-birthday-without-a-mask-and-social-media-reacts/ https://www.brproud.com/news/former-president-obama-celebrat...

feurio 5y ago
I can't read all of those because of stupid geo restrictions, but it looks like most of those were "advice" rather than law. This was most certainly against the actual law that the PM himself brought in.

Tycho 5y ago

This is one of the stupidest scandals I’ve ever seen. It makes Labour look very bad and deluded. They think the PM is going to resign because he stepped outside to the Downing St back garden for a short break and a glass of wine on a sunny day? Hall Monitor mentality in full effect.

samwillis 5y ago
I think you are missing the sentiment of the general public. A poll yesterday suggested two thirds of Brits would like him to resign [0] and another 56% [1], the public have had enough of him. Just wait for the polling from today after his statement to parliament, I suspect it will be even worse for him. Quite right though, he won't resign on his own accord, he will stay until he is pushed. But there is a very strong chance that is going to happen soon. 0: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/boris-johnson-poll-resign-party-b1990911.html https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/boris-johnson... 1: https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/1480931525235462145 https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/1480931525235462145
- CodeGlitch 5y ago
  I'm not defending Boris here, but polls are never accurate and hardly ever correct when compared to actual elections. If polls were a real reflection of how the public are thinking why would we ever bother for a full-blown election? The best thing to do with polling is to ignore them.
dazc 5y ago
Couldn't agree more. The stupid thing really is that he didn't just fess-up at the outset and it would all be forgotten about by now.
- antihero 5y ago
  If we'd "fessed up at the outset" we'd be fined.
  - 5y ago

samwillis 5y ago

For the none Brits on here, we are nearing the end of Boris Johnsons farcical term as PM. It could be just a matter of days until he is gone, and god know what then happens as there is no one obvious to take over - even on an interim basis. Most people I have spoken too would like there to be an early general election, even if they want another Conservative government, because we need to clear house and start afresh.

doingtheiroming 5y ago

It’s a trope in British politics that the real division is not between left and right but between roundhead and cavalier. It’s a useful way to think about things. The British tend to prefer a bit of the cavalier in their Prime Ministers. The cavaliers do well until they forget that the British also expect at least a roundheadish front when the times call for it. Like Charles I though, Johnson believes in the divine right of toffs and seems likely to end up with his Government decapitated.

pydry 5y ago
The British political circus's priorities doesnt reflect the priorities of British people. In most cases the fought over symbols (like this party) are reflective of the less well publicized power struggles and under the surface lobbying.

wanda 5y ago

I think what is more fascinating is that high-ranking politicians have always sought ways to circumvent the rules, in order to get ahead, securing themselves exorbitant personal fortunes, even in times of financial crisis, and often at the immediate or delayed expense of the taxpayer (if not simply evading taxes). And this phenomenon is not new. It has most probably been going on as long as the concept of money has been around, or even the concept of trade and personal-private wealth, be it tribal chieftains/shamans, monarchs and satellite nobles, land-owners/feudal leaders, warlords/military commanders, right the way up to contemporary politicians. and yet, what the people get up in arms about is the garden party? How many of the UK's politicians have bizarre private companies and "offshore" bank accounts? How many of them paved the way for absurd legislation and policy decisions that serve only the top 1%? How many of them let their actions be determined by lobbying and veiled bribery rather than any personal convictions or, heaven forfend, the views of the electorate? People are getting upset about this, even though a non-trivial portion of the same people broke the law at the same time to see family and party? The people should pay attention to what else is going on. Of course, the people mostly pay attention to whatever is put on the stage and given the spotlight. And that is determined not by an obligation to pursue and broadcast the truth, but rather by whatever can sell newspapers and online news subscriptions, and whatever can capture people's gaze on the television screen and online ad real estate -- but, critically, without shaking the foundations of the status quo. It's all just a theatrical presentation. Politics and its coverage in the media is little more than a reality TV show. None of it deserves your time of day.

feurio 5y ago
> People are getting upset about this, even though a non-trivial portion of the same people broke the law at the same time to see family and party? That's a may be, but they aren't Prime Minister and they haven't lied to the Commons and the entire British people about it.
- wanda 5y ago
  Fair point. Can you show me a Prime Minister who hasn't lied to the Commons and the British populace about something? Sorry, that's unfair. Can you show me a [governing body/individual] who hasn't lied to the [country]'s populace about something? My point is only that people should be pretty pissed off about a host of other lies and fuck ups by this government and every government prior, but they're not. Why aren't they? Well, because when governments screw up, the world keeps ticking over. Somebody embezzles a few million here, does some insider trading there, covers for some sex offenders elsewhere, etc. But none of this messes with a person's daily routine. Their world keeps going, the company they work for still exists and if not, they'll just work somewhere else. And it's obviously a lot more effort to dethrone the bloated corpses of our entrenched governments, and even more effort to replace it with something that is better. Especially when, to the best of our knowledge, there isn't a better alternative to liberal democracy, but it comes with the small print that corruption is pretty much a part of it. No one wants to rock the boat. The boat's got some leaks, we have to empty the water out every now and then, sometimes she runs aground due to some fairly terrible decision making by the captains, but it's the only boat where people can live in relative peace that's proven seaworthy so far.

beardyw 5y ago

It might be good to ask at an interview. "Will I be able to tell a work meeting from a party". If the answer is no, life could be interesting.

crtasm 5y ago

Title should be "Boris Johnson admits attending Downing Street party during lockdown"

neilsense 5y ago

Honestly having The Guardian posted is the same as The Daily Mail, just the leftist version.

MattPalmer1086 5y ago
A better comparison might be between the Guardian and the Telegraph. The Daily Mail has a certain reputation... In any case, pretty much all the papers have lambasted Johnson on this. When the Tory press turn on a Tory PM, it's a good sign that their days are numbered...