3 ms·

People are tribalistic and end of the day whether you like it or not, the fact is that hundreds of millions of people (vast majority) are happy to live under cc

People are tribalistic and end of the day whether you like it or not, the fact is that hundreds of millions of people (vast majority) are happy to live under ccp, just as {insert number} are happy to live under {insert country}. We can try to convince ourselves this isn't the case, but I don't exactly see progressive programmers giving up their massive Big Tech salaries as protest. No, they're happy to support whatever corporate campaign sounds good to them while ignoring that the machines they build on are built with slave labor, or that their company willingly censors and bends the knee with countries where LGBT rights don't exist and women can't go out on their own. To me, it is the same kind of thing as the Chinese situation. People will do all sorts of stunts for their team, and never take an L for an external actor because why should they? The best thing you can do is sit back and watch everyone argue (the best show that's live 24/7), while you enjoy a beer. Best case scenario you sell both sides something that they enjoy, so that you can enjoy your life.

nonethewiser 5y ago
> People are tribalistic and end of the day whether you like it or not Yet there are no movies being made where the US triumphs over China.
- octopoc 5y ago
  That's because one of the key beliefs of the ruling tribe in the US is that tribalism is bad, ironically.
  - indigochill 5y ago
    Also that money is good, and China is the world's largest market. It's extremely ironic that China has managed to leverage capitalist interests against the US.
- me_me_mu_mu 5y ago
  The reason US isn't doing that is because currently everyone in the west is essentially using China to build stuff that's too toxic or dangerous to build here. It would cost a fortune to produce plastics and other cheap things in the west with regulations and labor laws. We also know the harms of industrialization having gone through it in the past, so offshore it. The west sends it off to the lowest bidder (China), and leave them to deal with the repercussions. Similar to how the British Empire introduced opium to the Chinese in the 1800s to extract silver and trade, the US/West is taking moral Ls to just use the Chinese once again. In turn, the Chinese do their version of this in S. China Sea and Africa. If played right, there's a possibility of making the opposing side implode, so its no surprise all sides engage in the game. Supply chain issues, wars, pandemics - these suck but they're nothing new to human history. Ignore the noise you hear on twitter, and elsewhere. Very similar to work settings, where the public channels are all fabulous and cheery to keep the workers going but the cold, tough decisions are made in private channels or offline.
indigochill 5y ago
A few years ago, I would recommend anyone (in the US) who had the opportunity to visit China do so. It's an eye-opening experience seeing the comfortable middle-class lifestyle in China for yourself (and of course the general cultural differences), meanwhile being aware of the abuses perpetrated behind the scenes. Provides a different perspective on the narrative about China you read about in the west. Not saying that narrative is wrong, necessarily, but neither is it the entire story, and the entire story sheds light on the story of the west in return.

nonethewiser 5y ago

> People are tribalistic and end of the day whether you like it or not Yet there are no movies being made where the US triumphs over China.

octopoc 5y ago
That's because one of the key beliefs of the ruling tribe in the US is that tribalism is bad, ironically.
- indigochill 5y ago
  Also that money is good, and China is the world's largest market. It's extremely ironic that China has managed to leverage capitalist interests against the US.
me_me_mu_mu 5y ago
The reason US isn't doing that is because currently everyone in the west is essentially using China to build stuff that's too toxic or dangerous to build here. It would cost a fortune to produce plastics and other cheap things in the west with regulations and labor laws. We also know the harms of industrialization having gone through it in the past, so offshore it. The west sends it off to the lowest bidder (China), and leave them to deal with the repercussions. Similar to how the British Empire introduced opium to the Chinese in the 1800s to extract silver and trade, the US/West is taking moral Ls to just use the Chinese once again. In turn, the Chinese do their version of this in S. China Sea and Africa. If played right, there's a possibility of making the opposing side implode, so its no surprise all sides engage in the game. Supply chain issues, wars, pandemics - these suck but they're nothing new to human history. Ignore the noise you hear on twitter, and elsewhere. Very similar to work settings, where the public channels are all fabulous and cheery to keep the workers going but the cold, tough decisions are made in private channels or offline.

indigochill 5y ago

A few years ago, I would recommend anyone (in the US) who had the opportunity to visit China do so. It's an eye-opening experience seeing the comfortable middle-class lifestyle in China for yourself (and of course the general cultural differences), meanwhile being aware of the abuses perpetrated behind the scenes. Provides a different perspective on the narrative about China you read about in the west. Not saying that narrative is wrong, necessarily, but neither is it the entire story, and the entire story sheds light on the story of the west in return.