31 ms·

Show HN: I bought and tested the filtration of every mask on Amazon

594 points by lloydarmbrust 5y ago

jaquia 5y ago
This is great. Thanks for sharing!
bryguy32403 5y ago
How to see the ones that failed?
- lloydarmbrust 5y ago
  Just realized you dont see the full data set unless you are on desktop...
hedora 5y ago
Consider adding (affiliate) links to ones that did well, ordered by availability or price. Why Amazon doesn’t do this is beyond me.
- lloydarmbrust 5y ago
  I had wanted to do this.. cause, money... but I felt that took away our credibility.
  - donavanm 5y ago
    For a random consumer opinion I dont think collecting marginal payment on sales leads hurts credibility per se. The huge red flag for me is taking payment from manufacturers. But an adequately disclosed commission, applied equally to different masks, doesnt obviously introduce bias in to your test results. I guess it could induce you to recomend higher priced masks. But readers have the qualitative data available to select comparable, cheaper, products as well.
  - Tagbert 5y ago
    Perhaps you could provide two links. Once with affiliate tag and one without? Give users the information and the choice.
    - lloydarmbrust 5y ago
      Oh ha this is a good idea
      - hedora 5y ago
        I guess the key is to make it easy for people to pick any decent mask. I’d prefer yours, but, as you say, you’re already selling at capacity. I don’t care either way if you make a few percent off a sale of a competitor’s mask, and there’s no obvious conflict of interest, at least as long as there’s some mask on Amazon that works and isn’t sold out. Thanks for doing all the tests!
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
jmpman 5y ago
Anyone have a scatter plot of resistance vs filter efficiency? Watching each review would take forever. I want to explore the results visually.
- lloydarmbrust 5y ago
  This is a good idea... we can put this together for you.
  - jmpman 5y ago
    Make sure that however you graph it, up and to the right is better.
    - lloydarmbrust 5y ago
      Sounds like a PG quote....
      - jmpman 5y ago
        PG? The up and right = better guidance came from a sales guy that I didn’t initially have a lot of respect for. But, he was right. People naturally assume up and right is better on any graph, so present your data in that way. So, 1/resistance versus filtration? Or how much air is passed through the filter (cubic meters per second) given a fixed amount of lung power.
        lloydarmbrust 5y ago
        Paul Graham
sschueller 5y ago
I'm a bit confused by the listed results. For example one mask is listed a KN95 and has a fail although filtering is stated as 99.87%. Isn't a KN95 specifically rated to hold at least 95% of particles of a certain size? Anything above is irrelevant as it holds up to the minimum requirement? Or is it 99.87% of 95% which I would still consider within margins of manufacturing variations. A KN95 that filtered only 75% is something I would be concerned of. Additionally the fit in someones face can turn a good N99 mask into a useless mask which is also an important factor.
- buescher 5y ago
  How they rate masks as passing and failing is not transparent. They indicate they rate the masks on construction and smell but do not give the scores.
  - lloydarmbrust 5y ago
    Thanks for this... I tried to answer this here but LMK if I can be more clear: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29878971#29882192 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29878971#29882192
  - curling_grad 5y ago
    The website says: > Subjective Scoring: Construction > Ear loop strength, build quality, and comfort. This test is somewhat subjective, which is why we don’t include in pass/fail analysis. > Smell is not considered as part of pass/fail analysis.
dwohnitmok 5y ago
Small note on the methodology link: I thought it was a 404 dead link because when I opened it in a new tab it was a 404 (turns out it's a pop-up modal). I don't think what's described in the methodology actually lines up with the result pages. In particular the methodology pop-up has sections about construction and smell, but I don't think I see them anywhere in the text of a particular mask review, i.e. it doesn't look like they're actually a part of what goes into a pass/fail score. Likewise there is a "Standard" field in the review that is pass/fail, but it's not explained in the methodology (I think this is basically a catch-all for "marketing fraud" where a manufacturer says something about their product that is just false?). Nor is it described in the methodology what the pass/fail cutoff is. But the sheer number of masks is definitely impressive.
- lloydarmbrust 5y ago
  Thanks for noting, this was our old methodology and I will get that updated ASAP. We are now removing the subjective feedback and only talking objectively: 1) Does the mask pass the claimed PFE (particulate filtration efficiency) standard that it claims to pass? 2) Does the mask pass the claimed breathability (as stated in the standard they are claiming, ie N95, KN95, surgical)? 3) Does the mask meet other parts of the standard? KN95, N95, KF94, Surgical, FFP2 and others all have hundreds of pages of standards that they have to meet. Most people don't know what these are but we make masks so I've read all of the standards. Most masks or respirators fail in #3 and we are working on being specific as to why those are failing but we have about 400 masks posted and the notations are being transposed as I write.
  - pimlottc 5y ago
    With regards to #3, I found it a bit incongruous that you failed some KN95 masks (like Boncare) for incomplete labeling, while allowing a mask to pass that met a standard that appears to be entirely of their own devising (the Lutema M95i [0]). This seems to be a bit unfair, given that they both performed well in the PFE and breathability tests. It seems like if Boncare decided to call theirs an “MN95” mask, it would have passed too. 0: https://lutema.com/pages/frequently-asked-questions https://lutema.com/pages/frequently-asked-questions
david_allison 5y ago
How does one verify whether the product on Amazon is legitimate? Most masks have reviews referring to comingled fakes, and it's put me off buying.
- lloydarmbrust 5y ago
  That's the biggest problem with Amazon... I honestly would not buy from them. If you find a mask you like, google it and buy direct from the manufacturer. IMO Amazon is convenient, but this is your health and it's worth an extra step.
- genericone 5y ago
  If in doubt about fakes, don't buy it. I don't buy anything on Amazon that could result in absorption in the body. No food, no lotions, even certain fabrics can be radioactive in the case of "negative ion" mumbo-jumbo: This guy on youtube contacted the US Nuclear Regulatory Commission to force Amazon to delist these products with excessive negative-ion radiation: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3BA5bw1EV5I https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3BA5bw1EV5I
  - dzhiurgis 5y ago
    Thought Emporium is so good I refuse to believe it's legit A bit like Applied Science.
- jpindar 5y ago
  If it's on Amazon or eBay, you have no way of knowing if it's fake. Buy directly from a distributor such as https://www.projectn95.org https://www.projectn95.org, https://bonafidemasks.com https://bonafidemasks.com, etc. If you prefer the KF94 types, I've heard good things about https://kollecteusa.com https://kollecteusa.com and https://behealthyusa.net https://behealthyusa.net.
  - dboreham 5y ago
    There's also Costco which I suspect has control over its supply chain.
exabrial 5y ago
This problem could be far easier solved by... minimum airflow requirements.... or just stepping outside. Even in the Covid hotspot of wuhan, there are only a handful of outdoor transmission cases.
- lloydarmbrust 5y ago
  I agree but many places, IE, schools, have terrible ventilation... also I own a mask factory so my bias is going to be providing info on mask filtration :-)
lloydarmbrust 5y ago
I've spent about 1,000 hours on this with my team using a very expensive (~$250k) lab and I'd love for this to be a great resource for people when choosing a mask. The heavy lift we are doing here is around our particulate filtration efficiency test in which we do either the NIOSH N95 NaCL (0.3 micron) test or the ASTM 0.1 micron latex particle test. I'd love HN feedback on how we improve the interface and make this a true resource for people. Disclaimer: Yes, I'm a mask manufacturer and that's how I justify keeping all of this equipment up to spec, but I'm not big enough to make all of the masks for the world so I'd rather people find a good mask than just use my mask. Any feedback is appreciated.
- roeles 5y ago
  Perhaps interesting for you: The University of Delft has done research on mask fit. A report in Dutch can be found here[1]. Perhaps auto-captions in English work for you? [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zJZBNwa6QMk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zJZBNwa6QMk
- taf2 5y ago
  My question is after weeks with the same mask… how does it perform… also bonus what kind of additional germs to I get to experience close to my face
  - Double_a_92 5y ago
    You are not supposed to keep the same mask for weeks... They are meant to be replaced after hours.
- throwaway81523 5y ago
  I looked at the linked page and it had a big list of masks, each of which linked to a page about that mask with a picture but no information such as test results. Was that intended? Could you just ditch all the fancy web design and have a big table with test results for each mask, with an ordering link for the models that you sell? That would be awesome. It would be great if you also sold the stuff you use for testing masks. I spent a while looking into testing masks myself, but then the shortage eased up so it seemed less important.
nkurz 5y ago
Wow, this is fabulous! They spent almost $5000 to buy and test every mask available on Amazon. If you click on a mask it will take you to a page with the test details. More incredibly, most of the masks also have 5-7 minute video review! If you click on the "Breathability" column, then on "Grade" twice, you will end up with a list of masks that Pass with the most breathable masks first. Way to go, Lloyd. I've never heard of you or your company before, but I am genuinely impressed.
- pjgalbraith 5y ago
  A lot of content marketing these days is low-effort and spammy but this is a great example of content marketing done well.
  - lloydarmbrust 5y ago
    Haha thanks.. this one got out of hand. People kept asking me if x or y mask was "good" and I was just really curious... one day I looked up and had tested more masks than the CDC. I learned so much though about how different manufacturers do things, where they cut corners, where they invest. One crazy thing I learned was that almost all of the KN95s on amazing were not following the GB2626-2019 ("KN95") mask spec.... even though it's not that hard. So I decided to make a KN95 that followed the spec! Great way to really get into the product.
- BTCOG 5y ago
  It's an incredible effort that he's put into all this. I'm very thankful for it and the video reviews are well done, some of them funny as well.
nikolay 5y ago
I am a huge gan of Modlex and I've been wearing their N95s without getting infected.
_xerces_ 5y ago
Don't see any of the masks I've been buying off Amazon for a while: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08H3WDXMS/ https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08H3WDXMS/ https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B087Z7N4XF/ https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B087Z7N4XF/ Maybe because not sold by Amazon directly?
- lloydarmbrust 5y ago
  I haven't seen them... second one looks legit to me.
- nwatson 5y ago
  Your second link completely looks like another similar item that we've been buying, down to the box graphic design (but with obscured brand name) ... https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08JZL41H8 https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08JZL41H8 . Just under the "10 PCS" in the lower-left corner on the front ours says "MAXBOOST N95", implying maybe the brand name is "MAXBOOST"? Further details if you care to compare: * manufactured by: Suzhou Fangtian Industries Co., Ltd. * distributed by: Endliss Technology Inc.; 30773 Wiegman Rd.; Haward, CA 94544; USA
71a54xd 5y ago
Not exactly surprising that a majority of the "fail" masks came from China.
- Tagbert 5y ago
  Especially since the majority of masks come from China.
donavanm 5y ago
Related, for those who havent seen, is Aaron Collins collection of mask test data https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1M0mdNLpTWEGcluK6hh5LjjcFixwmOG853Ff45d3O-L0 https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1M0mdNLpTWEGcluK6hh5L...
- fouc 5y ago
  I enjoyed his youtube channel. He discusses how he does the filtration testing here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4YdtH-ccMU&t=0s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4YdtH-ccMU&t=0s
- hhsbdbdbdbdb 5y ago
  Honestly this is great. It allows to sort by pressure drop so I can pick a mask that has the least resistance.
- jerlam 5y ago
  I think it's important to point out that Collins is doing on-face quantitative testing, while Armbrust is only testing the material of the mask. They're not really comparable - a loose surgical mask may be made of good materials and filter well in Armbrust's test, but it's not even worth including in Collins' list because it doesn't seal against the face and won't ever get more than around 60% efficiency. Collins does often test again with a "mask brace" which is a rubber loop that seals that mask against your face, and can achieve similar numbers to Armbrust. Of course, since everyone has different faces, Collins' testing becomes less valuable the more different your face is than his. But he also has advice for getting a decent face seal.
  - donavanm 5y ago
    Indeed. And ideally everyone would get a third party to do a fit test. Or at least do their own self test. But either way Im happy for both datapoints so consumers can filter out obvious junk and then focus on their best available option insyead of starting tabula rosa.
Tagbert 5y ago
@lloydarmbrust , I’m curious about the fail rating for masks where Standard = KN95 is fail? Specifically for masks that claim to be KN95 and filtration values are high. How do you determine a failure here? Just curious. I think this work is amazing.
- lloydarmbrust 5y ago
  Thanks! Yes we are adding those notes now... most of the KN95 fails are the incorrect markings on the mask. To pass the GB2626-2019 standard (where the KN95 lives) you have to put the manufacture name, standard name (eg, "GB2626-2019"), and mask type (eg, "KN95"). About 90% of "KN95s" on amazon are fake because they do not include this... I image because the manufacturers are just trying to make a quick buck and didn't ever read the 57 page standard. If a KF94 fails it is usually because it's not made in South Korea where all official KF94s are made.
  - theogravity 5y ago
    It'd be nice if there were notes on the failures on why it failed. I'm on mobile so I'm not sure if you are providing that information or not on the page.
  - DangitBobby 5y ago
    Do you consider this to be an important criteria? Are there any practical concerns when buying a mask that doesn't technically meet the spec that I'm not aware of?
another_comment 5y ago
Project N95 is the National Critical Equipment Clearinghouse for personal protective equipment (PPE), COVID-19 diagnostic tests and critical equipment. Edit: stupid typo on url, sorry https://www.projectn95.org/ https://www.projectn95.org/ US based non profit, not tied to amazon. I've bought their stuff. They are legit.
- cozzyd 5y ago
  FYI it doesn't seem to work with the www. for me (https://n95project.org https://n95project.org does work though, as does https://www.projectn95.org https://www.projectn95.org).
  - another_comment 5y ago
    Thanks, I fixed the url.
- mjevans 5y ago
  I guess they just got slammed with orders? It would be much nicer if they showed 'SOLD OUT' on anything not in stock rather than nothing. (Firefox, Linux, even on my 'no plugins' profile and after creating an account.) It just shows reviews and nothing else on any masks page. Debug console shows... They aren't depending on Facebook for antifruad are they? How will they ever sell to someone security minded like me that refuses to ever sign up there? [Facebook Pixel] - Invalid PixelID: null. fbevents.js:24:37725 Some cookies are misusing the recommended “SameSite“ attribute 12 Cookie “VtexRCSessionIdv7” will be soon rejected because it has the “SameSite” attribute set to “None” or an invalid value, without the “secure” attribute. 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kps 5y ago
I'm not seeing anything but a list of mask names with no other information. Has the site fallen over? (Chrome 96 on MacOS 11.6)
- lloydarmbrust 5y ago
  It wasn't optimized for mobile but is now... please LMK what you think!
  - kps 5y ago
    Not mobile — Chrome 97 on MacOS.
jcun4128 5y ago
Well... that sucks (finds the brand I've been wearing all this time).
- lloydarmbrust 5y ago
  IYKYK
- jcun4128 5y ago
  Was funny today at the post office this old guy took his mask off, cleared both nostrils like blowing with his fingers and put his mask back on like wtf... Oh well. Then he touches the pad that you pay with oh man...
- nabla9 5y ago
  Good mask helps only so much. You must also wear it properly. Cheap surgical mask is just as good as N95 respirator if you don't wear them properly. It much seal around your skin. For example, if you don't trim your beard so that mask touches skin all around, better mask does not help. In fact, increased humidity under the mask may be one of the main reasons why wearing mask protects their user.
NoblePublius 5y ago
What’s the best mask for not caring about Covid but wanting everyone to think that I do? Is there a perfect balance between “double masking” and “American Flag Print Bandana”? I don’t want to go medical grade but I need something surgical that really evokes me in the trenches risking my life shopping at TJs.
- cavisne 5y ago
  You can buy cheesecloth masks on amazon. They aren’t really any more comfortable though than a surgical mask.
sytelus 5y ago
One of the best mask I have found is Cloud Mask. Super light weight, highly breahable and doesn't fog up my glasses. It's also the most expensive mask in this format. Is it possible you can add this one? https://www.amazon.com/ORIGINAL_MESH-Airflow-Breathable-Comfortable-Adjustable/dp/B08Y1H754Z/ https://www.amazon.com/ORIGINAL_MESH-Airflow-Breathable-Comf...
83457 5y ago
Got the HDX N95 mask for a con over weekend I was nervous about, so very happy with its test results. First time I've used an N95, and first time I've shaved in quite a while. I now understand how difficult it is for healthcare workers and others wearing these for long periods of time. I didn't have an issue with breathing, rather my face hurt after just a few hours, primarily cheekbones and nose, and I wore it for many hours more than that over multiple days. To know it was an effective mask is comforting.
halpert 5y ago
So much focus is on N95 masks, but P100 full-face respirators are AMAZING. I bought one for a home construction project I as doing. I was fully expecting fully labored breathing. To my surprise, my breath was completely unhindered. You also have full visibility and your glasses don't fog up, which is nice. I could definitely wear a full-face respirator all day.
- fnord77 5y ago
  these don't have filtered output, do they?
  - halpert 5y ago
    No, but if everyone is wearing one it doesn't matter. Some of the masks on this site are vented as well.
    - blip54321 5y ago
      The effect is multiplicative. If my mask filters 95% of the air on the way out, and yours filters 95% on the way in, that's 99.75% filtration. Add a HEPA into the room, and you're pretty safe. Studies show the same too.
    - cpeterso 5y ago
      Most of the point of wearing a mask is to prevent you from unknowingly spreading COVID to other people. Many stores I visit have signs prohibiting vented masks.
      - halpert 5y ago
        I'm pretty sure a vented mask is at least as effective as a cloth or surgical mask in that regard, both of which mostly contain the aerosol spray rather than actually filter out small particles. I doubt the stores you go to require true respirators? Apparently the CDC agrees: https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/hcp/respirator-use-faq.html https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/hcp/respirator-use... > Yes, an N95 filtering facepiece respirator will protect you and provide source control to protect others. A NIOSH-approved N95 filtering facepiece respirator with an exhalation valve offers the same protection to the wearer as one that does not have a valve. As source control, findings from NIOSH research suggest that, even without covering the valve, N95 respirators with exhalation valves provide the same or better source control than surgical masks, procedure masks, cloth masks, or fabric coverings.
fnord77 5y ago
my favorite mask, the Moldex 4200 is not listed. This is the only mask that does not fog my glasses (used to be a lot cheaper) https://www.amazon.com/Moldex-4200N95-Disposable-Respirator-Dispenser/dp/B006C5N1LM/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8 https://www.amazon.com/Moldex-4200N95-Disposable-Respirator-...
- nikolay 5y ago
  I only use Moldex. But got downvotes here. Moldex are made in the States, in fact, in Culver City, Southern California. Well, materials might be coming from China, but it's a reputable brand, easy to put on, and take off, unlike 3M!
koyote 5y ago
That's a real trove of information! I see there are no cloth masks tested. I'd love to know how useful they are (or can be) as I much prefer being able to reuse my masks. Edit: just realised that both Type and Style can be cloth and the cloth ones are presumably all under Style. All of them failed :(
- veemjeem 5y ago
  you can reuse n95s, nurses do it all the time. let them sit near a sunny window, off-smells will dissipate in a day. each mask is good for around 8 hours of continuous usage, but it's likely that the mask becomes too soiled before the electrostatic charge is neutralized.
  - TylerE 5y ago
    In a non-healthcare setting the lifespan of an N95 is way longer than 8 hours perhaps 30-40. Generally the idea is to get a new one when it becomes noticeably harder to breath. Generally for COVID use, as opposed to say, construction, I find the mask will physically fail (e.g strap breaks or stretches too much, nose foam detaches) before the filter media is close to being used up.
- lloydarmbrust 5y ago
  Cloth is pretty useless... here's a neck gaiter compared to a surgical mask: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=40gAXGOlEmI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=40gAXGOlEmI Also tested my kids minion pillow case which beat the gaiter :) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EK_WryN-Y40 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EK_WryN-Y40
  - pimlottc 5y ago
    That's what I suspected... it would be instructive to include the cloth mask on the chart, just as a comparison to show the difference.
autarch 5y ago
I've been buying masks from Armbrust since early in the pandemic. I didn't trust anything on Amazon, and I wanted something made in the US, on the theory that the high-quality stuff made in China would be less likely to be exported.
- kevin_thibedeau 5y ago
  Moldex is made in US and the mesh support requires more work to counterfeit.
  - lloydarmbrust 5y ago
    Looks cool too!
- jcims 5y ago
  I have a stack of 50ish Armbrust masks after learning about them last year. Every single one i wore failed at the strap weld within a few minutes. I’ve got a big head and they ran a little small, but this was pure QA fail. I’m guessing they’ve fixed it since then, but i don’t see how people can release products without testing them.
  - lloydarmbrust 5y ago
    Yes, it took us a long time to get it right... manufacturing is hard but that's why we have an earloop guarantee. Write support@armbrust.com and they will refund you or get you a new order.
    - jcims 5y ago
      Appreciate you replying. I think I found your company by a video you (?) posted about the magic of the meltblown process which sent me down a pretty entertaining rabbit hole. I had some issues with import masks previously so I went deep with an order of the denim colored masks thinking this would get us squared away. It was extremely frustrating when I couldn't get a single one to hold together and wasn't sure if I just got took by a bullshit story or you all were just going through growing pains. I'm glad to see it was the latter and am really glad to see some domestic manufacturing stood up. I'll give the earloop guarantee a shot and get a few on your tab. Would love to get a steady supplier, it's always hit and miss around here. If you have any suggestions for big head folks so we don't look like walking wingnuts I'm all ears...literally.
deleted 5y ago
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vhsdev 5y ago
asterizer 5y ago
Just went down the list from the top on Amazon looking for masks in black. A lot aren't there, some have way out delivery dates. Dr. Smile, Lutema (flat fold!)and KN Flax are the first to pop up though delivery dates are next week.
BugsJustFindMe 5y ago
The page claims over 99% filtration by some dinky earloop surgical masks, which seems impossible unless they are only measuring the fabric and not the mask as a whole. It definitely seems like the testing method can't possibly account for side leakage, which IMO makes the measurements basically useless.
- GavinMcG 5y ago
  Useless? It still tells me that the US-made masks I bought from a reputable manufacturer aren't up to spec. Eliminating the ones that fail regardless of fit is extremely helpful.
  - lloydarmbrust 5y ago
    Exactly. We can't tell you how it will fit on your face but can tell you if the fabric fails. You need both filtration AND fit to make a good mask.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
dylan604 5y ago
https://www.armbrustusa.com/blogs/mask-review/kn95-wwdoll-flat-fold-adult-regular-white-533 https://www.armbrustusa.com/blogs/mask-review/kn95-wwdoll-fl... The review for this mask is a great example of the games on Amazon. The review claims this product is from a well known vendor of counterfeit items. The big claim on this product is that the required printing is not on the mask, so they just write it off then and there. However, clicking the link to the item, the required text is prominitely visible in the image. Somewhere along the way, the vendor must have been made aware of the negative reviews (not on Amazon though), and tried to up their counterfeit game. Daily, I see more and more reasons to never use Amazon for anything. Luckily, I made that decision years ago, and just constantly am amazed at how it gets even more blatant.
- boardwaalk 5y ago
  Beware confirmation bias…
  - dylan604 5y ago
    sorry. should have included, that i looked up that mask specifically because i have some. they do not have the printed text on them, nor the original images from when originally purchased. can't be biased if i have like physical evidence of it, but in this post fact world, i guess that might not be worth much???
    - sokoloff 5y ago
      You have a valid measurement. Whether that measurement is confirmation that you shouldn’t buy anything from Amazon is where the possible bias comes in.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
bee_rider 5y ago
I was lucky enough to find some of those 3M Auras at a local hardware shop. They are like $2 a pop, but everything about them is nice -- materials feel great, I find the inside volume is enough that I can breathe easily, they don't stick out like a beak (IMO having the beak style ones in my field of view is annoying). 10/10 mask, still hope to not need them sooner or later, but given the state of the world would buy again.
- lloydarmbrust 5y ago
  great mask would recommend
forgotmyoldacc 5y ago
This is great! This is what I wanted to see early on in the pandemic. Just curious, why test now? This would've been (more) useful a year or two ago.
- lloydarmbrust 5y ago
  This data set took me 2 years to compile but just recently seemed complete enough to post.
  - forgotmyoldacc 5y ago
    Got it. Thanks for doing this!
londons_explore 5y ago
Perhaps partner up with someone like Honey (the browser extension). They can then provide your info on every Amazon listing page, and it sounds like just the sort of gimmick feature they'd like to include for good PR.
fblp 5y ago
I know you're also manufacturing masks but it'd be helpful if you pulled whether it was in stock and the price/unit from Amazon API
RobertRoberts 5y ago
I can't name the instituition or lab but for the purposes of protecting us from COVID their results showed 100% failure of all masks because of both lack of proper fit and inconsistent manufacturing quality. Especially from KN95 masks made in China. Essentially mask are useless long term for COVID protection. Short term they may slow some spread but that is it.
stefan_ 5y ago
Tested by someone with a prominent beard, no less.
viraptor 5y ago
I understand not literally everything can be tested, but I'm surprised that the Korean AirQueen is missing. It seems pretty popular on Amazon.
- ricardobeat 5y ago
  It’s listed as “Nano Filter Face Mask” and [spoiler] it fails the test.
  - viraptor 5y ago
    Interesting. It seems that "brand name search" actually searches by product name not by brand.
anotheryou 5y ago
Why is one pass one fail here? https://www.armbrustusa.com/blogs/mask-review/kn95-powecom-flat-fold-adult-regular-black-506 https://www.armbrustusa.com/blogs/mask-review/kn95-powecom-f... https://www.armbrustusa.com/blogs/mask-review/kn95-allmed-flat-fold-adult-regular-white-511 https://www.armbrustusa.com/blogs/mask-review/kn95-allmed-fl... isn't the passing one worse actually?
- GavinMcG 5y ago
  From elsewhere in the thread (and on the site's methodology information) it looks like the one that failed was not marked with the information required by the standard, so it fails to meet the standard.
  - anotheryou 5y ago
    thanks!
MailNerd 5y ago
Thanks for this comprehensive test! Here's a (translated) test from half a year ago of the German "Stiftung Warentest" (similar to the US "Consumer Reports") https://www-test-de.translate.goog/Masken-Welcher-Mund-Nasen-Schutz-hilft-am-besten-gegen-Corona-5692592-5722124/?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US https://www-test-de.translate.goog/Masken-Welcher-Mund-Nasen... Surprisingly there's only one mask in both tests as far as I can see: - Kingfa, deemed not suitable by Stiftung Warentest, passed in this test Not totally sure it's the same mask though.
hhsbdbdbdbdb 5y ago
Can you also list the worst filtering masks? Or the masks that let air through with the least resistance?
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
edoceo 5y ago
Awesome! I'm having some issues on the Search Brand part (Pixel, Chrome) it's not clickable and I'm unable to scroll down past that point. But it works great on Firefox. Also, I don't see the Envo masks - but they aren't on Amazon. Any chance to expand beyond only what uncle Jeff sells?
271828182846 5y ago
Full disclosure: I intentionally keep the metal stripe unbent to create two air gaps to both sides of my nose for more comfortable breathing. Cheers!
- sandos 5y ago
  If you are wearing glasses that will fog them up real quick. There are even 3d-printed clips to make them even more tight.
MrDresden 5y ago
This is great, and thank you for going out of your way to do this. There seems to be some minor issue (I think) with the table you present on the page. I just watched the test done on the Gerson N95 Model 3230+ mask, and in that video you mention that you had just done a test on the Gerson N95 Model 3230. However it does not seem to exist in the table. Perhaps there are more missing?
- nkurz 5y ago
  It's there, but it's missing the word "Gerson" in the description so it's easy to miss. If you search for 3230 you'll find it: https://www.armbrustusa.com/blogs/mask-review/n95-gerson-duckbill-adult-regular-white-665 https://www.armbrustusa.com/blogs/mask-review/n95-gerson-duc....
BTCOG 5y ago
Lloyd, I very much appreciate all your work and efforts put into this testing! I stocked up on the Powecom masks very early after seeing all their thorough testing and backing and I'm glad that I did. I also went overboard and bought nice high end gas masks and CBRN filters and P3 particle gas mask filters in February 2020 but I've not used/wasted any of those. :)
notreallyserio 5y ago
We've been avoiding buying masks from Amazon because they don't do a good job of dealing with fakes (commingling, etc) and they've argued that unlike other retailers they're not responsible for counterfeits. What do you suggest people do to ensure that the masks they get are authentic?
nobodyandproud 5y ago
This deserves more attention. Thank you for this. Amazon being Amazon, I was wondering was whether it’s possible to distinguish real N95 and KF94 masks from counterfeits.
anotheryou 5y ago
Just one kids mask passing for 95. Interesting. Does anyone know if any passing good ones on the list are just a bit smaller for small faces? Not super tiny like for small kids.
jerlam 5y ago
For another set of data, NIOSH, the official US government agency tasked with certifying respirators and other PPE, has tested and released a large set of data, including masks that were already in volume production before the pandemic: https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/npptl/respirators/testing/default.html https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/npptl/respirators/testing/default.... https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/npptl/ppecase.html https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/npptl/ppecase.html
beezle 5y ago
They did not test every one as they missed what I got last week: GVS N31000 Segre Folded N99 So far they are great. Snug fit but not horribly uncomfortable like some N95s I have worn. They also have a plastic do-dad that so far has kept the straps from breaking off (all so common to N95s). Short use period of a few days but no issue with the metal nose piece either. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08PH37ZLK?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2_dt_b_product_details https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08PH37ZLK?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2_dt_b_...

594 points by lloydarmbrust 5y ago

jaquia 5y ago

This is great. Thanks for sharing!

bryguy32403 5y ago

How to see the ones that failed?

lloydarmbrust 5y ago
Just realized you dont see the full data set unless you are on desktop...

hedora 5y ago

Consider adding (affiliate) links to ones that did well, ordered by availability or price. Why Amazon doesn’t do this is beyond me.

lloydarmbrust 5y ago
I had wanted to do this.. cause, money... but I felt that took away our credibility.
- donavanm 5y ago
  For a random consumer opinion I dont think collecting marginal payment on sales leads hurts credibility per se. The huge red flag for me is taking payment from manufacturers. But an adequately disclosed commission, applied equally to different masks, doesnt obviously introduce bias in to your test results. I guess it could induce you to recomend higher priced masks. But readers have the qualitative data available to select comparable, cheaper, products as well.
- Tagbert 5y ago
  Perhaps you could provide two links. Once with affiliate tag and one without? Give users the information and the choice.
  - lloydarmbrust 5y ago
    Oh ha this is a good idea
    - hedora 5y ago
      I guess the key is to make it easy for people to pick any decent mask. I’d prefer yours, but, as you say, you’re already selling at capacity. I don’t care either way if you make a few percent off a sale of a competitor’s mask, and there’s no obvious conflict of interest, at least as long as there’s some mask on Amazon that works and isn’t sold out. Thanks for doing all the tests!
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

jmpman 5y ago

Anyone have a scatter plot of resistance vs filter efficiency? Watching each review would take forever. I want to explore the results visually.

lloydarmbrust 5y ago
This is a good idea... we can put this together for you.
- jmpman 5y ago
  Make sure that however you graph it, up and to the right is better.
  - lloydarmbrust 5y ago
    Sounds like a PG quote....
    - jmpman 5y ago
      PG? The up and right = better guidance came from a sales guy that I didn’t initially have a lot of respect for. But, he was right. People naturally assume up and right is better on any graph, so present your data in that way. So, 1/resistance versus filtration? Or how much air is passed through the filter (cubic meters per second) given a fixed amount of lung power.
      - lloydarmbrust 5y ago
        Paul Graham

sschueller 5y ago

I'm a bit confused by the listed results. For example one mask is listed a KN95 and has a fail although filtering is stated as 99.87%. Isn't a KN95 specifically rated to hold at least 95% of particles of a certain size? Anything above is irrelevant as it holds up to the minimum requirement? Or is it 99.87% of 95% which I would still consider within margins of manufacturing variations. A KN95 that filtered only 75% is something I would be concerned of. Additionally the fit in someones face can turn a good N99 mask into a useless mask which is also an important factor.

buescher 5y ago
How they rate masks as passing and failing is not transparent. They indicate they rate the masks on construction and smell but do not give the scores.
- lloydarmbrust 5y ago
  Thanks for this... I tried to answer this here but LMK if I can be more clear: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29878971#29882192 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29878971#29882192
- curling_grad 5y ago
  The website says: > Subjective Scoring: Construction > Ear loop strength, build quality, and comfort. This test is somewhat subjective, which is why we don’t include in pass/fail analysis. > Smell is not considered as part of pass/fail analysis.

dwohnitmok 5y ago

Small note on the methodology link: I thought it was a 404 dead link because when I opened it in a new tab it was a 404 (turns out it's a pop-up modal). I don't think what's described in the methodology actually lines up with the result pages. In particular the methodology pop-up has sections about construction and smell, but I don't think I see them anywhere in the text of a particular mask review, i.e. it doesn't look like they're actually a part of what goes into a pass/fail score. Likewise there is a "Standard" field in the review that is pass/fail, but it's not explained in the methodology (I think this is basically a catch-all for "marketing fraud" where a manufacturer says something about their product that is just false?). Nor is it described in the methodology what the pass/fail cutoff is. But the sheer number of masks is definitely impressive.

lloydarmbrust 5y ago
Thanks for noting, this was our old methodology and I will get that updated ASAP. We are now removing the subjective feedback and only talking objectively: 1) Does the mask pass the claimed PFE (particulate filtration efficiency) standard that it claims to pass? 2) Does the mask pass the claimed breathability (as stated in the standard they are claiming, ie N95, KN95, surgical)? 3) Does the mask meet other parts of the standard? KN95, N95, KF94, Surgical, FFP2 and others all have hundreds of pages of standards that they have to meet. Most people don't know what these are but we make masks so I've read all of the standards. Most masks or respirators fail in #3 and we are working on being specific as to why those are failing but we have about 400 masks posted and the notations are being transposed as I write.
- pimlottc 5y ago
  With regards to #3, I found it a bit incongruous that you failed some KN95 masks (like Boncare) for incomplete labeling, while allowing a mask to pass that met a standard that appears to be entirely of their own devising (the Lutema M95i [0]). This seems to be a bit unfair, given that they both performed well in the PFE and breathability tests. It seems like if Boncare decided to call theirs an “MN95” mask, it would have passed too. 0: https://lutema.com/pages/frequently-asked-questions https://lutema.com/pages/frequently-asked-questions

david_allison 5y ago

How does one verify whether the product on Amazon is legitimate? Most masks have reviews referring to comingled fakes, and it's put me off buying.

lloydarmbrust 5y ago
That's the biggest problem with Amazon... I honestly would not buy from them. If you find a mask you like, google it and buy direct from the manufacturer. IMO Amazon is convenient, but this is your health and it's worth an extra step.
genericone 5y ago
If in doubt about fakes, don't buy it. I don't buy anything on Amazon that could result in absorption in the body. No food, no lotions, even certain fabrics can be radioactive in the case of "negative ion" mumbo-jumbo: This guy on youtube contacted the US Nuclear Regulatory Commission to force Amazon to delist these products with excessive negative-ion radiation: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3BA5bw1EV5I https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3BA5bw1EV5I
- dzhiurgis 5y ago
  Thought Emporium is so good I refuse to believe it's legit A bit like Applied Science.
jpindar 5y ago
If it's on Amazon or eBay, you have no way of knowing if it's fake. Buy directly from a distributor such as https://www.projectn95.org https://www.projectn95.org, https://bonafidemasks.com https://bonafidemasks.com, etc. If you prefer the KF94 types, I've heard good things about https://kollecteusa.com https://kollecteusa.com and https://behealthyusa.net https://behealthyusa.net.
- dboreham 5y ago
  There's also Costco which I suspect has control over its supply chain.

exabrial 5y ago

This problem could be far easier solved by... minimum airflow requirements.... or just stepping outside. Even in the Covid hotspot of wuhan, there are only a handful of outdoor transmission cases.

lloydarmbrust 5y ago
I agree but many places, IE, schools, have terrible ventilation... also I own a mask factory so my bias is going to be providing info on mask filtration :-)

lloydarmbrust 5y ago

I've spent about 1,000 hours on this with my team using a very expensive (~$250k) lab and I'd love for this to be a great resource for people when choosing a mask. The heavy lift we are doing here is around our particulate filtration efficiency test in which we do either the NIOSH N95 NaCL (0.3 micron) test or the ASTM 0.1 micron latex particle test. I'd love HN feedback on how we improve the interface and make this a true resource for people. Disclaimer: Yes, I'm a mask manufacturer and that's how I justify keeping all of this equipment up to spec, but I'm not big enough to make all of the masks for the world so I'd rather people find a good mask than just use my mask. Any feedback is appreciated.

roeles 5y ago
Perhaps interesting for you: The University of Delft has done research on mask fit. A report in Dutch can be found here[1]. Perhaps auto-captions in English work for you? [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zJZBNwa6QMk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zJZBNwa6QMk
taf2 5y ago
My question is after weeks with the same mask… how does it perform… also bonus what kind of additional germs to I get to experience close to my face
- Double_a_92 5y ago
  You are not supposed to keep the same mask for weeks... They are meant to be replaced after hours.
throwaway81523 5y ago
I looked at the linked page and it had a big list of masks, each of which linked to a page about that mask with a picture but no information such as test results. Was that intended? Could you just ditch all the fancy web design and have a big table with test results for each mask, with an ordering link for the models that you sell? That would be awesome. It would be great if you also sold the stuff you use for testing masks. I spent a while looking into testing masks myself, but then the shortage eased up so it seemed less important.

nkurz 5y ago

Wow, this is fabulous! They spent almost $5000 to buy and test every mask available on Amazon. If you click on a mask it will take you to a page with the test details. More incredibly, most of the masks also have 5-7 minute video review! If you click on the "Breathability" column, then on "Grade" twice, you will end up with a list of masks that Pass with the most breathable masks first. Way to go, Lloyd. I've never heard of you or your company before, but I am genuinely impressed.

pjgalbraith 5y ago
A lot of content marketing these days is low-effort and spammy but this is a great example of content marketing done well.
- lloydarmbrust 5y ago
  Haha thanks.. this one got out of hand. People kept asking me if x or y mask was "good" and I was just really curious... one day I looked up and had tested more masks than the CDC. I learned so much though about how different manufacturers do things, where they cut corners, where they invest. One crazy thing I learned was that almost all of the KN95s on amazing were not following the GB2626-2019 ("KN95") mask spec.... even though it's not that hard. So I decided to make a KN95 that followed the spec! Great way to really get into the product.
BTCOG 5y ago
It's an incredible effort that he's put into all this. I'm very thankful for it and the video reviews are well done, some of them funny as well.

nikolay 5y ago

I am a huge gan of Modlex and I've been wearing their N95s without getting infected.

_xerces_ 5y ago

Don't see any of the masks I've been buying off Amazon for a while: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08H3WDXMS/ https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08H3WDXMS/ https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B087Z7N4XF/ https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B087Z7N4XF/ Maybe because not sold by Amazon directly?

lloydarmbrust 5y ago
I haven't seen them... second one looks legit to me.
nwatson 5y ago
Your second link completely looks like another similar item that we've been buying, down to the box graphic design (but with obscured brand name) ... https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08JZL41H8 https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08JZL41H8 . Just under the "10 PCS" in the lower-left corner on the front ours says "MAXBOOST N95", implying maybe the brand name is "MAXBOOST"? Further details if you care to compare: * manufactured by: Suzhou Fangtian Industries Co., Ltd. * distributed by: Endliss Technology Inc.; 30773 Wiegman Rd.; Haward, CA 94544; USA

71a54xd 5y ago

Not exactly surprising that a majority of the "fail" masks came from China.

Tagbert 5y ago
Especially since the majority of masks come from China.

donavanm 5y ago

Related, for those who havent seen, is Aaron Collins collection of mask test data https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1M0mdNLpTWEGcluK6hh5LjjcFixwmOG853Ff45d3O-L0 https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1M0mdNLpTWEGcluK6hh5L...

fouc 5y ago
I enjoyed his youtube channel. He discusses how he does the filtration testing here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4YdtH-ccMU&t=0s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4YdtH-ccMU&t=0s
hhsbdbdbdbdb 5y ago
Honestly this is great. It allows to sort by pressure drop so I can pick a mask that has the least resistance.
jerlam 5y ago
I think it's important to point out that Collins is doing on-face quantitative testing, while Armbrust is only testing the material of the mask. They're not really comparable - a loose surgical mask may be made of good materials and filter well in Armbrust's test, but it's not even worth including in Collins' list because it doesn't seal against the face and won't ever get more than around 60% efficiency. Collins does often test again with a "mask brace" which is a rubber loop that seals that mask against your face, and can achieve similar numbers to Armbrust. Of course, since everyone has different faces, Collins' testing becomes less valuable the more different your face is than his. But he also has advice for getting a decent face seal.
- donavanm 5y ago
  Indeed. And ideally everyone would get a third party to do a fit test. Or at least do their own self test. But either way Im happy for both datapoints so consumers can filter out obvious junk and then focus on their best available option insyead of starting tabula rosa.

Tagbert 5y ago

@lloydarmbrust , I’m curious about the fail rating for masks where Standard = KN95 is fail? Specifically for masks that claim to be KN95 and filtration values are high. How do you determine a failure here? Just curious. I think this work is amazing.

lloydarmbrust 5y ago
Thanks! Yes we are adding those notes now... most of the KN95 fails are the incorrect markings on the mask. To pass the GB2626-2019 standard (where the KN95 lives) you have to put the manufacture name, standard name (eg, "GB2626-2019"), and mask type (eg, "KN95"). About 90% of "KN95s" on amazon are fake because they do not include this... I image because the manufacturers are just trying to make a quick buck and didn't ever read the 57 page standard. If a KF94 fails it is usually because it's not made in South Korea where all official KF94s are made.
- theogravity 5y ago
  It'd be nice if there were notes on the failures on why it failed. I'm on mobile so I'm not sure if you are providing that information or not on the page.
- DangitBobby 5y ago
  Do you consider this to be an important criteria? Are there any practical concerns when buying a mask that doesn't technically meet the spec that I'm not aware of?

another_comment 5y ago

Project N95 is the National Critical Equipment Clearinghouse for personal protective equipment (PPE), COVID-19 diagnostic tests and critical equipment. Edit: stupid typo on url, sorry https://www.projectn95.org/ https://www.projectn95.org/ US based non profit, not tied to amazon. I've bought their stuff. They are legit.

cozzyd 5y ago
FYI it doesn't seem to work with the www. for me (https://n95project.org https://n95project.org does work though, as does https://www.projectn95.org https://www.projectn95.org).
- another_comment 5y ago
  Thanks, I fixed the url.
mjevans 5y ago
I guess they just got slammed with orders? It would be much nicer if they showed 'SOLD OUT' on anything not in stock rather than nothing. (Firefox, Linux, even on my 'no plugins' profile and after creating an account.) It just shows reviews and nothing else on any masks page. Debug console shows... They aren't depending on Facebook for antifruad are they? How will they ever sell to someone security minded like me that refuses to ever sign up there? [Facebook Pixel] - Invalid PixelID: null. fbevents.js:24:37725 Some cookies are misusing the recommended “SameSite“ attribute 12 Cookie “VtexRCSessionIdv7” will be soon rejected because it has the “SameSite” attribute set to “None” or an invalid value, without the “secure” attribute. 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kps 5y ago

I'm not seeing anything but a list of mask names with no other information. Has the site fallen over? (Chrome 96 on MacOS 11.6)

lloydarmbrust 5y ago
It wasn't optimized for mobile but is now... please LMK what you think!
- kps 5y ago
  Not mobile — Chrome 97 on MacOS.

jcun4128 5y ago

Well... that sucks (finds the brand I've been wearing all this time).

lloydarmbrust 5y ago
IYKYK
jcun4128 5y ago
Was funny today at the post office this old guy took his mask off, cleared both nostrils like blowing with his fingers and put his mask back on like wtf... Oh well. Then he touches the pad that you pay with oh man...
nabla9 5y ago
Good mask helps only so much. You must also wear it properly. Cheap surgical mask is just as good as N95 respirator if you don't wear them properly. It much seal around your skin. For example, if you don't trim your beard so that mask touches skin all around, better mask does not help. In fact, increased humidity under the mask may be one of the main reasons why wearing mask protects their user.

NoblePublius 5y ago

What’s the best mask for not caring about Covid but wanting everyone to think that I do? Is there a perfect balance between “double masking” and “American Flag Print Bandana”? I don’t want to go medical grade but I need something surgical that really evokes me in the trenches risking my life shopping at TJs.

cavisne 5y ago
You can buy cheesecloth masks on amazon. They aren’t really any more comfortable though than a surgical mask.

sytelus 5y ago

One of the best mask I have found is Cloud Mask. Super light weight, highly breahable and doesn't fog up my glasses. It's also the most expensive mask in this format. Is it possible you can add this one? https://www.amazon.com/ORIGINAL_MESH-Airflow-Breathable-Comfortable-Adjustable/dp/B08Y1H754Z/ https://www.amazon.com/ORIGINAL_MESH-Airflow-Breathable-Comf...

83457 5y ago

Got the HDX N95 mask for a con over weekend I was nervous about, so very happy with its test results. First time I've used an N95, and first time I've shaved in quite a while. I now understand how difficult it is for healthcare workers and others wearing these for long periods of time. I didn't have an issue with breathing, rather my face hurt after just a few hours, primarily cheekbones and nose, and I wore it for many hours more than that over multiple days. To know it was an effective mask is comforting.

halpert 5y ago

So much focus is on N95 masks, but P100 full-face respirators are AMAZING. I bought one for a home construction project I as doing. I was fully expecting fully labored breathing. To my surprise, my breath was completely unhindered. You also have full visibility and your glasses don't fog up, which is nice. I could definitely wear a full-face respirator all day.

fnord77 5y ago
these don't have filtered output, do they?
- halpert 5y ago
  No, but if everyone is wearing one it doesn't matter. Some of the masks on this site are vented as well.
  - blip54321 5y ago
    The effect is multiplicative. If my mask filters 95% of the air on the way out, and yours filters 95% on the way in, that's 99.75% filtration. Add a HEPA into the room, and you're pretty safe. Studies show the same too.
  - cpeterso 5y ago
    Most of the point of wearing a mask is to prevent you from unknowingly spreading COVID to other people. Many stores I visit have signs prohibiting vented masks.
    - halpert 5y ago
      I'm pretty sure a vented mask is at least as effective as a cloth or surgical mask in that regard, both of which mostly contain the aerosol spray rather than actually filter out small particles. I doubt the stores you go to require true respirators? Apparently the CDC agrees: https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/hcp/respirator-use-faq.html https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/hcp/respirator-use... > Yes, an N95 filtering facepiece respirator will protect you and provide source control to protect others. A NIOSH-approved N95 filtering facepiece respirator with an exhalation valve offers the same protection to the wearer as one that does not have a valve. As source control, findings from NIOSH research suggest that, even without covering the valve, N95 respirators with exhalation valves provide the same or better source control than surgical masks, procedure masks, cloth masks, or fabric coverings.

fnord77 5y ago

my favorite mask, the Moldex 4200 is not listed. This is the only mask that does not fog my glasses (used to be a lot cheaper) https://www.amazon.com/Moldex-4200N95-Disposable-Respirator-Dispenser/dp/B006C5N1LM/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8 https://www.amazon.com/Moldex-4200N95-Disposable-Respirator-...

nikolay 5y ago
I only use Moldex. But got downvotes here. Moldex are made in the States, in fact, in Culver City, Southern California. Well, materials might be coming from China, but it's a reputable brand, easy to put on, and take off, unlike 3M!

koyote 5y ago

That's a real trove of information! I see there are no cloth masks tested. I'd love to know how useful they are (or can be) as I much prefer being able to reuse my masks. Edit: just realised that both Type and Style can be cloth and the cloth ones are presumably all under Style. All of them failed :(

veemjeem 5y ago
you can reuse n95s, nurses do it all the time. let them sit near a sunny window, off-smells will dissipate in a day. each mask is good for around 8 hours of continuous usage, but it's likely that the mask becomes too soiled before the electrostatic charge is neutralized.
- TylerE 5y ago
  In a non-healthcare setting the lifespan of an N95 is way longer than 8 hours perhaps 30-40. Generally the idea is to get a new one when it becomes noticeably harder to breath. Generally for COVID use, as opposed to say, construction, I find the mask will physically fail (e.g strap breaks or stretches too much, nose foam detaches) before the filter media is close to being used up.
lloydarmbrust 5y ago
Cloth is pretty useless... here's a neck gaiter compared to a surgical mask: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=40gAXGOlEmI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=40gAXGOlEmI Also tested my kids minion pillow case which beat the gaiter :) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EK_WryN-Y40 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EK_WryN-Y40
- pimlottc 5y ago
  That's what I suspected... it would be instructive to include the cloth mask on the chart, just as a comparison to show the difference.

autarch 5y ago

I've been buying masks from Armbrust since early in the pandemic. I didn't trust anything on Amazon, and I wanted something made in the US, on the theory that the high-quality stuff made in China would be less likely to be exported.

kevin_thibedeau 5y ago
Moldex is made in US and the mesh support requires more work to counterfeit.
- lloydarmbrust 5y ago
  Looks cool too!
jcims 5y ago
I have a stack of 50ish Armbrust masks after learning about them last year. Every single one i wore failed at the strap weld within a few minutes. I’ve got a big head and they ran a little small, but this was pure QA fail. I’m guessing they’ve fixed it since then, but i don’t see how people can release products without testing them.
- lloydarmbrust 5y ago
  Yes, it took us a long time to get it right... manufacturing is hard but that's why we have an earloop guarantee. Write support@armbrust.com and they will refund you or get you a new order.
  - jcims 5y ago
    Appreciate you replying. I think I found your company by a video you (?) posted about the magic of the meltblown process which sent me down a pretty entertaining rabbit hole. I had some issues with import masks previously so I went deep with an order of the denim colored masks thinking this would get us squared away. It was extremely frustrating when I couldn't get a single one to hold together and wasn't sure if I just got took by a bullshit story or you all were just going through growing pains. I'm glad to see it was the latter and am really glad to see some domestic manufacturing stood up. I'll give the earloop guarantee a shot and get a few on your tab. Would love to get a steady supplier, it's always hit and miss around here. If you have any suggestions for big head folks so we don't look like walking wingnuts I'm all ears...literally.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

vhsdev 5y ago

asterizer 5y ago

Just went down the list from the top on Amazon looking for masks in black. A lot aren't there, some have way out delivery dates. Dr. Smile, Lutema (flat fold!)and KN Flax are the first to pop up though delivery dates are next week.

BugsJustFindMe 5y ago

The page claims over 99% filtration by some dinky earloop surgical masks, which seems impossible unless they are only measuring the fabric and not the mask as a whole. It definitely seems like the testing method can't possibly account for side leakage, which IMO makes the measurements basically useless.

GavinMcG 5y ago
Useless? It still tells me that the US-made masks I bought from a reputable manufacturer aren't up to spec. Eliminating the ones that fail regardless of fit is extremely helpful.
- lloydarmbrust 5y ago
  Exactly. We can't tell you how it will fit on your face but can tell you if the fabric fails. You need both filtration AND fit to make a good mask.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]

dylan604 5y ago

https://www.armbrustusa.com/blogs/mask-review/kn95-wwdoll-flat-fold-adult-regular-white-533 https://www.armbrustusa.com/blogs/mask-review/kn95-wwdoll-fl... The review for this mask is a great example of the games on Amazon. The review claims this product is from a well known vendor of counterfeit items. The big claim on this product is that the required printing is not on the mask, so they just write it off then and there. However, clicking the link to the item, the required text is prominitely visible in the image. Somewhere along the way, the vendor must have been made aware of the negative reviews (not on Amazon though), and tried to up their counterfeit game. Daily, I see more and more reasons to never use Amazon for anything. Luckily, I made that decision years ago, and just constantly am amazed at how it gets even more blatant.

boardwaalk 5y ago
Beware confirmation bias…
- dylan604 5y ago
  sorry. should have included, that i looked up that mask specifically because i have some. they do not have the printed text on them, nor the original images from when originally purchased. can't be biased if i have like physical evidence of it, but in this post fact world, i guess that might not be worth much???
  - sokoloff 5y ago
    You have a valid measurement. Whether that measurement is confirmation that you shouldn’t buy anything from Amazon is where the possible bias comes in.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]

bee_rider 5y ago

I was lucky enough to find some of those 3M Auras at a local hardware shop. They are like $2 a pop, but everything about them is nice -- materials feel great, I find the inside volume is enough that I can breathe easily, they don't stick out like a beak (IMO having the beak style ones in my field of view is annoying). 10/10 mask, still hope to not need them sooner or later, but given the state of the world would buy again.

lloydarmbrust 5y ago
great mask would recommend

forgotmyoldacc 5y ago

This is great! This is what I wanted to see early on in the pandemic. Just curious, why test now? This would've been (more) useful a year or two ago.

lloydarmbrust 5y ago
This data set took me 2 years to compile but just recently seemed complete enough to post.
- forgotmyoldacc 5y ago
  Got it. Thanks for doing this!

londons_explore 5y ago

Perhaps partner up with someone like Honey (the browser extension). They can then provide your info on every Amazon listing page, and it sounds like just the sort of gimmick feature they'd like to include for good PR.

fblp 5y ago

I know you're also manufacturing masks but it'd be helpful if you pulled whether it was in stock and the price/unit from Amazon API

RobertRoberts 5y ago

I can't name the instituition or lab but for the purposes of protecting us from COVID their results showed 100% failure of all masks because of both lack of proper fit and inconsistent manufacturing quality. Especially from KN95 masks made in China. Essentially mask are useless long term for COVID protection. Short term they may slow some spread but that is it.

stefan_ 5y ago

Tested by someone with a prominent beard, no less.

viraptor 5y ago

I understand not literally everything can be tested, but I'm surprised that the Korean AirQueen is missing. It seems pretty popular on Amazon.

ricardobeat 5y ago
It’s listed as “Nano Filter Face Mask” and [spoiler] it fails the test.
- viraptor 5y ago
  Interesting. It seems that "brand name search" actually searches by product name not by brand.

anotheryou 5y ago

Why is one pass one fail here? https://www.armbrustusa.com/blogs/mask-review/kn95-powecom-flat-fold-adult-regular-black-506 https://www.armbrustusa.com/blogs/mask-review/kn95-powecom-f... https://www.armbrustusa.com/blogs/mask-review/kn95-allmed-flat-fold-adult-regular-white-511 https://www.armbrustusa.com/blogs/mask-review/kn95-allmed-fl... isn't the passing one worse actually?

GavinMcG 5y ago
From elsewhere in the thread (and on the site's methodology information) it looks like the one that failed was not marked with the information required by the standard, so it fails to meet the standard.
- anotheryou 5y ago
  thanks!

MailNerd 5y ago

Thanks for this comprehensive test! Here's a (translated) test from half a year ago of the German "Stiftung Warentest" (similar to the US "Consumer Reports") https://www-test-de.translate.goog/Masken-Welcher-Mund-Nasen-Schutz-hilft-am-besten-gegen-Corona-5692592-5722124/?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US https://www-test-de.translate.goog/Masken-Welcher-Mund-Nasen... Surprisingly there's only one mask in both tests as far as I can see: - Kingfa, deemed not suitable by Stiftung Warentest, passed in this test Not totally sure it's the same mask though.

hhsbdbdbdbdb 5y ago

Can you also list the worst filtering masks? Or the masks that let air through with the least resistance?

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

edoceo 5y ago

Awesome! I'm having some issues on the Search Brand part (Pixel, Chrome) it's not clickable and I'm unable to scroll down past that point. But it works great on Firefox. Also, I don't see the Envo masks - but they aren't on Amazon. Any chance to expand beyond only what uncle Jeff sells?

271828182846 5y ago

Full disclosure: I intentionally keep the metal stripe unbent to create two air gaps to both sides of my nose for more comfortable breathing. Cheers!

sandos 5y ago
If you are wearing glasses that will fog them up real quick. There are even 3d-printed clips to make them even more tight.

MrDresden 5y ago

This is great, and thank you for going out of your way to do this. There seems to be some minor issue (I think) with the table you present on the page. I just watched the test done on the Gerson N95 Model 3230+ mask, and in that video you mention that you had just done a test on the Gerson N95 Model 3230. However it does not seem to exist in the table. Perhaps there are more missing?

nkurz 5y ago
It's there, but it's missing the word "Gerson" in the description so it's easy to miss. If you search for 3230 you'll find it: https://www.armbrustusa.com/blogs/mask-review/n95-gerson-duckbill-adult-regular-white-665 https://www.armbrustusa.com/blogs/mask-review/n95-gerson-duc....

BTCOG 5y ago

Lloyd, I very much appreciate all your work and efforts put into this testing! I stocked up on the Powecom masks very early after seeing all their thorough testing and backing and I'm glad that I did. I also went overboard and bought nice high end gas masks and CBRN filters and P3 particle gas mask filters in February 2020 but I've not used/wasted any of those. :)

notreallyserio 5y ago

We've been avoiding buying masks from Amazon because they don't do a good job of dealing with fakes (commingling, etc) and they've argued that unlike other retailers they're not responsible for counterfeits. What do you suggest people do to ensure that the masks they get are authentic?

nobodyandproud 5y ago

This deserves more attention. Thank you for this. Amazon being Amazon, I was wondering was whether it’s possible to distinguish real N95 and KF94 masks from counterfeits.

anotheryou 5y ago

Just one kids mask passing for 95. Interesting. Does anyone know if any passing good ones on the list are just a bit smaller for small faces? Not super tiny like for small kids.

jerlam 5y ago

For another set of data, NIOSH, the official US government agency tasked with certifying respirators and other PPE, has tested and released a large set of data, including masks that were already in volume production before the pandemic: https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/npptl/respirators/testing/default.html https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/npptl/respirators/testing/default.... https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/npptl/ppecase.html https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/npptl/ppecase.html

beezle 5y ago

They did not test every one as they missed what I got last week: GVS N31000 Segre Folded N99 So far they are great. Snug fit but not horribly uncomfortable like some N95s I have worn. They also have a plastic do-dad that so far has kept the straps from breaking off (all so common to N95s). Short use period of a few days but no issue with the metal nose piece either. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08PH37ZLK?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2_dt_b_product_details https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08PH37ZLK?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2_dt_b_...