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>IRC is not immune from this kind of childish meddling. IRC is just a protocol, Discord is a service provider. I'm in no control over what Discord deems appro

by iotku 5y ago

>IRC is not immune from this kind of childish meddling. IRC is just a protocol, Discord is a service provider. I'm in no control over what Discord deems appropriate and they can terminate my "server" (Guild) that they're letting me use at their own whim (or by accident) with little to no recourse. I can run my own IRC server or use a variety of preexisting IRC networks which typically are fairly lax on over-enforcement unlike Discord. >Just a few months ago freenode underwent a hostile takeover and unlike most Discord communities, it is probably not coming back from that BS. Similar to Discord, Freenode is a service provider. Should the folks who administrate a IRC network have goals that don't align with you (or there's a hostile takeover which changes the operation's goals) you can connect to a different IRC network, this is largely what happened in the case of Freenode -> libera. If Discord decides to nuke your guild there's not an alternate discord to connect to, they must switch to a different client and service. If an IRC network decides to nuke my channel I can just switch to a different network. Overall the likelihood of a well behaving guild on Discord getting nuked randomly is low, but regardless of Discord or IRC you should still have alternative methods of communications and not put all your eggs in one basket. You don't want to lose connections with all of the people you talk with because some moderator or IRCop got bored.

movedx 5y ago
You're still missing the bigger point: whether you're using Discord or IRC (as a service or not) if the server/network is taken away from you, your entire community has to almost start from scratch or pick up the pieces regardless of the platform being used. You'll all still be displaced and will have to gather again elsewhere. It's also complete bullshit that IRC somehow saves the day when it falls short on all the same points as Discord does with regards to saving messages, which it also doesn't do for, PLUS it falls short on some other critical points: too much client choice is a bad thing; it's complex to set up and is something you have to administrate; you have to keep it secure; IRC servers get targeted by (D)DoS attacks all the time - it's a hobby for some arseholes; people new to industry don't know what IRC is and are simply going to find it confusing; most of the teenage population on the planet is using Discord already (and as a primary communication channel). IRC is dead. Get over it.
- iotku 5y ago
  >if the server/network is taken away from you, your entire community has to almost start from scratch or pick up the pieces regardless of the platform being used. >>regardless of Discord or IRC you should still have alternative methods of communications and not put all your eggs in one basket. As previously mentioned, relying on any single platform is a risk that should be mitigated by having alternatives available. Some of the Discords I use extensively have telegram as backups for when Discord is down. If Discord were to disappear tomorrow, you'd would be well served to have a backup of some sort to avoid losing contact with everyone, IRC has the advantage of being relatively easy to setup independently with extremely low hardware requirements. >You'll all still be displaced and will have to gather again elsewhere. Ideally you have somewhere off platform that people would know to look for updates (website, twitter, etc), but irrespective of what you're using such an event would always be pretty disruptive. >falls short on all the same points as Discord does with regards to saving messages, which it also doesn't do for Can arguably be a good thing in keeping chats a bit more ephemeral and more casual, but that's not necessarily a good thing depending on the topic. Regardless you can log client-side or with a bot plenty fine if it's critical to be able to reference the past. >too much client choice is a bad thing; Don't entirely disagree, but no client choice (Discord) is oppressive. I'd much rather have an open protocol where I can use open source clients I can trust aren't scanning my processes and sending telemetry without my consent. If I miss out on features that my client doesn't implement I'm fine with that as long as the basic functionality works. >it's complex to set up and is something you have to administrate; Many ircds are hardly more complex than setting up a web server, and of course there's still multitudes of existing IRC networks to choose from if you don't wish to administer it yourself. >you have to keep it secure; IRC servers get targeted by (D)DoS attacks all the time - it's a hobby for some arseholes; Yeah, not really much debate here. (Although if I have to be pedantic figuring I've been rambling on anyways there's a good amount of vps/server providers that provide decent DDoS protection these days) Spammers are still a minor issue on Discord though. >people new to industry don't know what IRC is and are simply going to find it confusing; And that's a darn shame, but it's not an impossible barrier. People can be taught what it is an how to use it if there's any demand for it. > most of the teenage population on the planet is using Discord already (and as a primary communication channel). Yep, it's convenient and popular and has a large user-base. >IRC is dead. Get over it. IRC will almost certainly outlive Discord and Slack, but it's past its prime for sure. I still believe there's plenty of value in protocols rather than being tied to companies like Slack or Discord and perhaps Matrix (or something else) will be a proper "modern" successor to IRC and enjoy the freedom in communication that not being tied to a particular organization's terms of service/code of conduct. Ultimately though a lot of that will depend on if the internet gets entirely centralized (as has been the direction many things have been going), or fracture back into more decentralized structures. Time will tell.

by iotku 5y ago

movedx 5y ago

You're still missing the bigger point: whether you're using Discord or IRC (as a service or not) if the server/network is taken away from you, your entire community has to almost start from scratch or pick up the pieces regardless of the platform being used. You'll all still be displaced and will have to gather again elsewhere. It's also complete bullshit that IRC somehow saves the day when it falls short on all the same points as Discord does with regards to saving messages, which it also doesn't do for, PLUS it falls short on some other critical points: too much client choice is a bad thing; it's complex to set up and is something you have to administrate; you have to keep it secure; IRC servers get targeted by (D)DoS attacks all the time - it's a hobby for some arseholes; people new to industry don't know what IRC is and are simply going to find it confusing; most of the teenage population on the planet is using Discord already (and as a primary communication channel). IRC is dead. Get over it.

iotku 5y ago
>if the server/network is taken away from you, your entire community has to almost start from scratch or pick up the pieces regardless of the platform being used. >>regardless of Discord or IRC you should still have alternative methods of communications and not put all your eggs in one basket. As previously mentioned, relying on any single platform is a risk that should be mitigated by having alternatives available. Some of the Discords I use extensively have telegram as backups for when Discord is down. If Discord were to disappear tomorrow, you'd would be well served to have a backup of some sort to avoid losing contact with everyone, IRC has the advantage of being relatively easy to setup independently with extremely low hardware requirements. >You'll all still be displaced and will have to gather again elsewhere. Ideally you have somewhere off platform that people would know to look for updates (website, twitter, etc), but irrespective of what you're using such an event would always be pretty disruptive. >falls short on all the same points as Discord does with regards to saving messages, which it also doesn't do for Can arguably be a good thing in keeping chats a bit more ephemeral and more casual, but that's not necessarily a good thing depending on the topic. Regardless you can log client-side or with a bot plenty fine if it's critical to be able to reference the past. >too much client choice is a bad thing; Don't entirely disagree, but no client choice (Discord) is oppressive. I'd much rather have an open protocol where I can use open source clients I can trust aren't scanning my processes and sending telemetry without my consent. If I miss out on features that my client doesn't implement I'm fine with that as long as the basic functionality works. >it's complex to set up and is something you have to administrate; Many ircds are hardly more complex than setting up a web server, and of course there's still multitudes of existing IRC networks to choose from if you don't wish to administer it yourself. >you have to keep it secure; IRC servers get targeted by (D)DoS attacks all the time - it's a hobby for some arseholes; Yeah, not really much debate here. (Although if I have to be pedantic figuring I've been rambling on anyways there's a good amount of vps/server providers that provide decent DDoS protection these days) Spammers are still a minor issue on Discord though. >people new to industry don't know what IRC is and are simply going to find it confusing; And that's a darn shame, but it's not an impossible barrier. People can be taught what it is an how to use it if there's any demand for it. > most of the teenage population on the planet is using Discord already (and as a primary communication channel). Yep, it's convenient and popular and has a large user-base. >IRC is dead. Get over it. IRC will almost certainly outlive Discord and Slack, but it's past its prime for sure. I still believe there's plenty of value in protocols rather than being tied to companies like Slack or Discord and perhaps Matrix (or something else) will be a proper "modern" successor to IRC and enjoy the freedom in communication that not being tied to a particular organization's terms of service/code of conduct. Ultimately though a lot of that will depend on if the internet gets entirely centralized (as has been the direction many things have been going), or fracture back into more decentralized structures. Time will tell.