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The Drenching Richness of Andrei Tarkovsky
- SavantIdiot 5y agoIf you have some time, watch "Stalker". It's pretty amazing this twisted-reality dreamlike film was made in 1979. It feels right out of 2010.
- danielodievich 5y agoAnd The Roadside Picnic by Strugatsky brothers is an incredible read. The movie is loosely-ish based on that but both stand on their own. The book is tightly written and profound in its exploration of human condition when facing pressure of money and exploitation of something we don't understand.
- andrei_says_ 5y agoWhat is a good translation?
- danielodievich 5y agoI read Russian natively but wife does not and she was satisfied by the Bormashenko work. see https://www.reddit.com/r/books/comments/4s4bv7/is_there_a_better_roadside_picnic_translation/ https://www.reddit.com/r/books/comments/4s4bv7/is_there_a_be...
- euroderf 5y agoWhen I try to describe the book to someone, I start with the containers that have ends but no sides. That piques a person's interest.
- jamesakirk 5y agoIf you are a fan, I strongly recommend Weird Studies' 2-part episode on Stalker. Phil and JF generalize the concept of "the zone" and discuss other examples of zones in art.
- SavantIdiot 5y agoNever heard of that, thanks for the recommendation!
- marttt 5y agoThe central parts involving the Zone were filmed in and around Tallinn, Estonia [1, 2]. EDIT: Ugh, looks like some people may have died because of the lengthy filming sessions near a chemical plant. Wikipedia quotes one of the crew members [3]: "We were shooting near Tallinn in the area around the small river Jägala with a half-functioning hydroelectric station. Up the river was a chemical plant and it poured out poisonous liquids downstream. There is even this shot in Stalker: snow falling in the summer and white foam floating down the river. In fact it was some horrible poison. Many women in our crew got allergic reactions on their faces. Tarkovsky died from cancer of the right bronchial tube. And Tolya Solonitsyn too. That it was all connected to the location shooting for Stalker became clear to me when Larisa Tarkovskaya died from the same illness in Paris." 1: https://www.bfi.org.uk/features/andrei-tarkovsky-stalker-locations https://www.bfi.org.uk/features/andrei-tarkovsky-stalker-loc... 2: https://dobraszczyk.wordpress.com/2011/09/13/tallinntarkovsky-and-stalker/ https://dobraszczyk.wordpress.com/2011/09/13/tallinntarkovsk... 3: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stalker_(1979_film)#Production https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stalker_(1979_film)#Production
- loloquwowndueo 5y agoOh I like Tarkovsky. Nothing puts me right to sleep like his films do. Set up a 1h off-timer and sweet dreams!
- mhh__ 5y agoThe people paid for this film stock, we're going to use the film stock!
- pizza 5y agoCareful what you say about movies that put you to sleep like that. I thought the same thing when I first watched Koyaanisqatsi... now I've seen it upwards of 30 times, probably :)
- coldtea 5y agoYeah, it does take an active mind to not be put to sleep by such films. They're not for the passive consumer who awaits to be entertained with plot twists and/or explosions. In general, they're not there to entertain anyone...
- forinti 5y agoThat's so funny. For years I couldn't watch Stalker because I would sleep. The Pandemic gave me the time to finally watch it during the day.
- the_gipsy 5y agoIf it doesn't put your body to sleep, then it will put your soul to sleep... forever!
- svilen_dobrev 5y agoif you ever need to make A Decision in Life... watch "The Sacrifice" ("Offret" in swedish, it's filmed there) p.s. Now that i read the article... pfff how come the only things noticed are sex and wars and all that shallow headline-making jazz.. One has to go way beyond that to see anything worth..
- pizza 5y agoThere are some movies you think about for years.. The Sacrifice and Stalker were like that, for me. Tarkovsky's advice to young people is also something I think will ring true with the Hacker News crowd https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Vvdtaaprzw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Vvdtaaprzw
- andrei_says_ 5y agoFun fact, when filming the fire in Sacrifice, the camera failed. Tarkovsky had them build the building again, and burn it again, this time filming with two cameras. The crew wanted to work with a model but that didn’t happen. They built the life-size structure and burned it.
- zaat 5y agoThese English subtitles are masterpiece indeed.
- streamofdigits 5y agoI don't think his work travels particularly well in the West. It is steeped in symbolism, deep metaphysics and calm, meditative, photography. All attributes that have been essentially banned from the fast food production/consumption chain that has conditioned audiences. Its a bit like pop music. If all you've ever heard is (basic) western harmony and suddenly get exposed to some weird oriental stuff it does not even register as music..
- qbasic_forever 5y agoThere are directors in the west that have similar ideas and even see some mainstream success, for example Terrence Malik.
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- telesilla 5y agoWow that's a big statement, about the west. I just watched Nine Days (US, https://ninedaysfilm.com https://ninedaysfilm.com) which was rich with Tarkovskian references. I could name hundreds of western films that are deeply moving and affecting beyond their words. Where to start.. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Art_film#Timeline_of_notable_films https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Art_film#Timeline_of_notable_f...
- mhh__ 5y agoYou say that even though Tarkovsky is absolutely worshipped by Western film fans?
- UncleOxidant 5y agoSure, cinephiles, but most people in the US haven't heard of Tarkovsky. Even fairly educated people I've suggested a Tarkovsky film to will give me a blank expression and say "who?"
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- bgm1975 5y agoTarkovsky was truly one of cinema’s great directors. His films aren’t simple or easy, but they are gorgeous to behold and if you put in the time, you’ll be richly rewarded. As others have mentioned, Stalker and Solaris are his two great sci-fi films, easily on par with Kubrick’s 2001. For history buffs, Andrei Rublev is fantastic too.
- tombert 5y agoI definitely think that Solaris is a bit of an underrated gem. It's a very long movie that I can't watch all the time, but occasionally when I'm in the mood for a slow, cerebral movie I pop that one on. If you want a more "abridged" version of it, "Memories" by Satoshi Kon is also pretty great. It's unique enough to be its own thing, so I'm not accusing it of being a "rip off" or anything, but it has similar themes about how memories can influence our perception of people, and it's shorter. EDIT: Sorry, Memories is the name of the anthology movie. Magnetic Rose is Kon's segment.
- personalityson 5y agoOn YouTube in good quality from the film studio itself, may not work in some countries https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6-4KydP92ss https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6-4KydP92ss https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xXa6XpaxBS0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xXa6XpaxBS0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TGRDYpCmMcM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TGRDYpCmMcM
- jamesakirk 5y agoTarkovsky was an Orthodox Christian, but his ideas about the irreducibility of experience parallel Zen: "Everybody asks me what things mean in my films. This is terrible! An artist doesn't have to answer for his meanings. I don't think so deeply about my work - I don't know what my symbols may represent. What matters to me is that they arouse feelings, any feelings you like, based on whatever your inner response might be. If you look for a meaning, you'll miss everything that happens. Thinking during a film interferes with your experience of it. Take a watch into pieces, it doesn't work. Similarly with a work of art, there's no way it can be analyzed without destroying it." - Andrei Tarkovsky Andrei Tarkovsky: Interviews, pg. 71 Univ. Press of Mississippi, 2006 Edit: as others have pointed out, my surprise at this parallel may tell you less about the uniqueness of Tarkovsky's world view, and more about my ignorance of Orthodox Christianity.
- stareblinkstare 5y agoYou say "but" as if Orthodox Christians are contrary to this. Put another way, there is a greater overlap between the thinking (and feeling, and believing) embedded in religions than we can garner just from reading.
- coldtea 5y agoCame to write just that. In fact had just finished my comment when I saw yours :-)
- coldtea 5y ago>Tarkovsky was an Orthodox Christian, but his ideas about the irreducibility of experience parallel Zen Let's add that this is not by chance: the irreducibility of experience (especially divine experience) is a core motive of Orthodox Christianity as well (which also has a long tradition of mystics).
- dhdondldn 5y agoThe idea that experience is not irreducible is rare. Who thinks they can analyse consciousness into more fundamental elements? Max Planck: "I regard consciousness as fundamental. I regard matter as derivative from consciousness. We cannot get behind consciousness. Everything that we talk about, everything that we regard as existing, postulates consciousness."
- Bayart 5y agoThe barn scene in The Mirror [1] remains one of my favourites in cinema history. [1]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3dA60D-j290 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3dA60D-j290
- andrei_says_ 5y agoTo me this is the dog in the hotel room in Nostalgia. Mixing dream and reality in such an incredibly simple way is beyond genius.
- kolbusa 5y agoTarkovsky is a genius. The original novel for Stalker is a must read (esp. if you can read Russian). But I cannot watch some of his movies after I learned that he _cruelly_ killed a horse in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrei_Rublev_(film)#Depictions_of_violence https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrei_Rublev_(film)#Depiction.... I cannot justify this for the sake of art.
- skrebbel 5y agoCan you justify it for the sake of food?
- kolbusa 5y agoProbably, if killed responsibly. The scene in the movie is just animal cruelty in my opinion (edited my comment for clarity).
- tomcam 5y agoI certainly can, though I have some ambivalence. If you’re referring to the statement that the horse was eventually sent to a slaughterhouse, it doesn’t address the central ethical question of purposely torturing a horse to get a good shot.
- skrebbel 5y agoAh i hadn't noticed the cruelty part. Thanks
- coolandsmartrr 5y agoI believe the horse was going to be killed anyways in a slaughterhouse.
- uwagar 5y agothis tarkovsky worship has to stop.
- coldtea 5y ago>A dark aspect of Tarkovsky’s critique of industrial modernity manifests itself: the reversion to a pre-modern order brings with it a reinforcement of male dominance. Yeah, it wouldn't be the New Yorker without at least a touch of cliché 2022 preoccupations and Zeitgeist, no matter how tacked on and forced it is...
- idhqbfojqbx 5y agoIf you want to truly watch and dive into a tarkovsky (and auteur cinéma in general) film I highly advise you to watch them in your local cinémathèque/cineteca. I've watched the films years ago on a laptop but when I recently saw some during the retrospective at the kinemathek in Berlin it was an incomparable experience. Edit: plus you'll see the films with their lovely original laser subtitles.
- randomNumber7 5y agoSome of my favourite movies. They are now in good quality on youtube, but only in russian. If anyone knows where to get the german (or english) synchro in decent quality pls tell me. I bought them on dvd but the quality is so bad that it hurts the art
- nnamtr 5y agohttps://www.filmingo.de/ https://www.filmingo.de/ Watched Nostalghia yesterday :)
- rdtsc 5y ago> Watching it [The Mirror] is like attending a séance of the twentieth-century Russian soul. Very well put. I would agree. The Mirror is my favorite Tarkovsky film. I wouldn't even call it a film, it's more more like a poem in movie form.
- burnished 5y agoI loved Roadside Picnic and this had anticipated watching stalker for years (just never made it happen). When I finally did watch it, recently, I found it relentlessly boring. The questions it raised for me were more of the nature "why is this shot going on for so long" and "do all three of these grown men really think a puddle is the best spot for a nap? Why did you put your foot, still in your shoe, partially into the water?". If some one feels up to the challenge of explaining what they got out of it and why it is critically acclaimed, please do. I wouldn't be surprised if there was some perspective I had failed to consider that made it a compelling experience.
- metroholografix 5y agoThe very first impression I have of Stalker [seen on a projector] is being stunningly beautiful. Very few films [including all of Tarkovsky's, with maybe the best being Mirror] manage to create this sense of stunning beauty so that's something that needs to be mentioned. Other than this, the film simply hypnotized and drew me in. I wasn't analyzing or thinking about the story, rather observing and experiencing, which allowed the magic to unfold. There are scenes that freeze time, the only words that maybe do justice to them are "bewitchingly intense". His philosophical magnum opus [1], Mirror, is even more powerful. Tarkovsky was not only an artist extraordinaire but a supreme genius, the kind of person that appears once every few centuries. His films are full of something that you certainly won't find in any movie today [especially American], which is called "soul", and a full appreciation of him and his work entails opening up that part of yourself and allowing it to engage with Tarkovsky's as expressed in his output. [1] I use "philosophy" here to mean meditations on the human condition that are understood / made real through praxis, i.e. its original definition.
- coolandsmartrr 5y agoTarkovsky may perhaps be the pioneer of slow cinema that consisted of long shots observing subjects like a thousand-yard stare. In Nostalghia (spelled in the Russian transliteration), the final scene consists of a man carrying a candle for 10 minutes. While detractors may be appealed by the hostile nature of slow cinema, their champions like Bela Tarr, Theo Angelopoulos, and contemporary ones like Bi Gan and Apichatpong Weerasethakul embrace long shots for their ability to convey the atmosphere of bleakness. Bela Tarr even made an 8-hour film called Santantango, which Susan Sontag praised as a film she would watch every year. Tarkovsky was not appreciated in Soviet Russia, where distribution depended upon the whims of the censors. When censors criticized not his politics (his films were apolitical) but the lengthy content, he would respond that his films were intended for viewing by "Bresson, Bergman, and Dreyer" (in which order I forget). His films would be given minimal circulation and screened briefly at venues, like in worker's pubs for a week. He would even fight the bureaucrats until he had it with the forced cancellation of The First Day, which thereafter he burned all remaining film and set. (The project purportedly commented on the state's official atheism that were at odds with his deep Russian Orthodox Christianity.) After he defected, he collaborated with his favorite Bergman actors and crews until he died of cancer, possibly caused by exposure to harmful substances during the filming of The Stalker. In Japan, Akira Kurosawa championed Tarkovsky and promoted his works. Today, there is almost always a screening of Tarkovsky in an arthouse cinema every year. While the content of his films eluded me on first viewing, I now observe the silences ripe with meaning. His films transcend time, imparting an experience that lasts briefly and eternally. There is nothing more exciting in film than his characters staring lengthily into the abyss of the human condition.