11 ms·

from this thread and the far-too-many-hours I've spent on Reddit - obviously these feeling are not uncommon, but the tone in which this stuff is presented alway

by ausbah 5y ago

from this thread and the far-too-many-hours I've spent on Reddit - obviously these feeling are not uncommon, but the tone in which this stuff is presented always reeks of unearned superiority like I think its great that people like OP have enjoyment and passion for "intellectual pursuits", but most other people don't. you have an interest, and like most other interests, people aren't going to share your interest because they have their own, different interests. so don't be surprised when you try to pivot the conversation, people don't want to talk about like it sucks you can't share your interest with those close to you, that's a problem most everyone has, but when it's on the topic of "intellectual pursuits" or whatever - articles like this it always read as "I'm smart, everyone else is dumb, woe is me" that may not be what people like OP are intending - but the problem is others just have different passions and priorities than you and are turned off when you want to discuss only what interests you. I'm certain most could have such a conversation with someone like OP, but why would they when their tone smells like "smarter than tho" because they want to talk about esoteric philosophy or abstract ideas at a college party if one want to get rid of this "loneliness" you either need to find a community of like-minded others (see the internet) or introduce conversation topics in a more mutually interesting manner instead of wishing for others to meet you where you are I write this as someone who has been on both sides of the conversation

RubyRidgeRandy 5y ago
I agree. There was a TIL thread on Reddit a few years ago about how smarter people are usually more depressed -- low and behold everyone in the comments was lamenting over how cursed they were to carry the burden of their intellect. No one really pointed out that if you were on one of the most popular websites on the planet in a default subreddit, chances were you were pretty average with average intelligence. We fetishize intelligence too much as a society and too many don't understand what it really is and how it can differ. It's nice to imagine a world where we valued empathy as much as intelligence.
- geenew 5y ago
  not to sound superior but it's "lo and behold" :)
  - bryanrasmussen 5y ago
    it's funny, but maybe also auto-correct.
- Jensson 5y ago
  > if you were on one of the most popular websites on the planet in a default subreddit, chances were you were pretty average with average intelligence. This isn't true. If you have a very popular website and take the most common threads people might read on it, then you will likely have at least a few hundred thousand people viewing it. If 1% of the smartest 2% comments you would have a maybe a hundred comments from people who would qualify for mensa if the viewers were random people, basically flooding the comment section. The reason this works is that people will flock to threads that is about something relating to them. People who do well on IQ tests will flock to threads about intelligence etc.
  - kortilla 5y ago
    There is very little overlap between people who care about Mensa/IQ tests and intelligent people.
    - Jensson 5y ago
      People don't have to care about IQ tests to know that they got a good score on one and therefore consider themselves smart. You can see them in almost every thread about IQ tests "I got IQ score 1X0 and I think that IQ is stupid and doesn't matter!". Anyway, being smart without an education is pretty worthless as you say, but there is a lot of such people out there. Being uneducated doesn't mean they aren't intelligent, it just means that they didn't utilize their intelligence in life. I'm not sure why you would try to say that they aren't intelligent just because they lack education. If a study found that intelligent people face more boredom or whatever, then it is almost surely that the study was a correlation between IQ and some questionnaire result, so whatever score someone got on an IQ test is very relevant for the topic.
      - Foobar8568 5y ago
        And if you are educated, you have an even wider gap with your average person. Education starts with school and parenting, when school is averaging to the lowest students and parents are busy with their own work, what is left to your "high IQ kid"? School would just provide a less-than-average knowledge, parents won't guide, and you get an uneducated kid surrounded by "idiots". As a parent, you provide guidance to your kids, high IQ or not, you still get a large gap with their peers. Yesterday, we were drugging kids with TV, today, with tiktok and the likes.
n8cpdx 5y ago
The big clue is that you could swap out books/reading/learning for videogames/watching/playing/learning or TikToks/watching/making, or LEGO/building/designing, or any other hobby and the article and the experience wouldn’t change at all. The distinction between the author and others is not the intellectual pursuit, but the dislike of parties. My bias is to think they’re attending parties with the wrong people, or of bad design (yes, design/engineering is something that social gatherings benefit from). I like a good party plenty, but I’ve slipped away to read books, and I don’t consider myself to be a voracious reader of books.
- renarl 5y ago
  I’m curious about party design/engineering. Can you tell me a bit more about how to do it? Are there any good books/resources you can point to?
  - n8cpdx 5y ago
    I can’t share a whole lot, mainly because I don’t know much myself. In the pre-COVID days, before I stopped going to parties, then blew up my life and moved to another city (thus not having a social network to attend parties with) there were many things to consider when hosting: - who to invite (complicated by melt/flakiness) - involves making predictions about how people will behave and interact with each other - how many to invite - when to start - when to end and how to end - what beverages, snacks, food to include; how such things will be prepared and delivered in sequence - drug and alcohol (also a drug) choices - what music to play - lighting and furniture arrangement; use of space generally - desired outcomes; things to watch for; connections to encourage or discourage - props, toys, games, and other objects (I suppose food and snacks are partially a subset) - compartmentalization and breakaway spaces An example of a party that the author would likely enjoy would be an informal book club gathering with a mixer before or after, or perhaps a showing of a film adaptation with discussion for interested participants after, while less interested people can break off to play board games. Or perhaps board games would be stimulating enough, there are a broad range of kinds, and they can drastically change the feel/experience of an evening. I suppose “engineering” implies a formal discipline. I think that actually is a profession, I just know nothing about it. But design thinking can be applied by anyone to anything, and I do try to be intentional and/or am slightly neurotic about hosting.
steve_adams_86 5y ago
I went through a phase of beginning to think my intellect was isolating me and realized I was just a self absorbed asshole eventually. That was hard to swallow. I think the next hard to swallow realization was that I’m not a very good person. I’m not mean to anyone, but I invest very little in actually doing good. I know I should, I have the resources to do it, but I’m still so self absorbed. I buy things I don’t need knowing the same money could literally save lives. I worry about my own security even though I could find a new job within a month. I used to think I was a pretty nice guy until I realized how terrible I am at changing my behaviour to help other people. In all practicality I’m kind of an asshole. I’ll do better.
- lopatin 5y ago
  Not going out of your way to help people doesn't make you an asshole. > I buy things I don’t need knowing the same money could literally save lives. I worry about my own security even though I could find a new job within a month. These things are normal, I wouldn't worry too much about it. But you are right that going through life thinking you are some lonely, tortured genius is not healthy and is a recipe for being a true asshole.
  - tasty_freeze 5y ago
    Not helping others when you are able doesn't make me an asshole; it makes me self centered. Yes, it is quite normal, but I disagree with your next clause: we should think harder about it and not dismiss it so easily. I've pitched this one before, as it is a short book (pdf, or audiobook) and is one of the most impactful things I've read in a long time. It was Peter Singer's book, The Life You Can Save [1] The book methodically and non-judgmentally addresses many objections and false beliefs people have about charity [2] and effective altruism. In a nutshell: ideally we'd have enough resources that everyone had everything they need, but we don't. There is a strong instinct to care more about people who are similar to you or live near you than for others, but we shouldn't. That is, the suffering of a person you will never meet is just as real as the suffering of someone you are friends with. Because we have limited resources to help others, the resources we do have should be focused on those who are worst off. [1] https://www.thelifeyoucansave.org/peter-singer/ https://www.thelifeyoucansave.org/peter-singer/ [2] For instance, many people moan about how much of the federal budget is spent/wasted on foreign aid. When asked to guess how much of the budget is spent, people (in the US) commonly guess 10-20%. When asked what they thing would be more appropriate, they commonly say 5-10%. The reality is it is well under 1%.
onlyrealcuzzo 5y ago
I'm probably going to get downvoted for being elitist, but here goes... On the flip side, I have found a startling amount of people genuinely don't have many passions / interests. Skills and talents, sure. But passions - no. Or I guess if eating foods like cereal and McDoland's counts as a food passion, or watching TV, or working a job you don't actually enjoy - if these count as passions - then I suppose everyone does have interests. I'm just not inclined to think people are really that passionate about these things - and instead, it's just what they do. Sure - anybody who spends 10 hours a day laying bricks - they're obviously infinitely more skilled in that and related things than someone who doesn't. But a lot of people simply exchange their time for money, and don't particularly love what they do. Most of us HN-ers do, and we forget how rare that is. I think some of us on here forget how close we have it to a life of leisure compared to the average person (ESPECIALLY globally). I know a lot of people that pretty much have no time for anything besides work and family. And I hope that all people like this LOVE at least their work or their family. But in reality, I know A LOT of people trapped in a life where they genuinely dislike both. And that's pretty much their whole life.
- ip26 5y ago
  I’ve found if you inquire with genuine interest, many metaphorical brick layers have a lot to say about laying bricks, and can get quite impassioned about it. There’s often a lot more depth there than you see at first. (Presumably, most people aren’t genuinely interested enough, so the brick layer doesn’t usually get into it)
- medimikka 5y ago
  > On the flip side, I have found a startling amount of people genuinely don't really have many passions / interests. That'd describe Perell well. He doesn't have many passions/interest. He's bowing out of one interest to flee back into his singular comfort zone of unchallenged isolation, where no one "tests" his chops and he can fly on the wings of his self perception to whatever height he desires. He shuns every passion/interest that does not align with his narrow view of which passions and interests make a person "intellectual". He's the kind of guy who will use his superior training as "guy who writes things on the Internet" to start arguing medicine with me, and then leave the party because few people share his interests and he just can't contribute to theirs. Because we're not as intellectual than him. ... in his narrowly defined niche of what makes a person intellectual. Hint: being able to cite Plato does not make you in any way, shape, or form, more "intellectual" than the guy at the end of the bar who knows every Man U soccer game score, who scored, against whom, in which game, at what game time, using which strategy. Having consumed a 500 page book does not make you more intellectual than having consumed 500 episodes of Coronation Street. Consumption, in general, is a low hanging fruit, intellectually. Your love for Doctor Who doesn't make you smarter than someone's fanning over Rihanna. Intellectuals are rarely lonely. Because true intellectuals see value in information, no matter the sender or matter. Restrictive topic selection is pretty much the definition of anti-intellectualism, in my opinion.
winternett 5y ago
The funny part is that everyone needs to start from scratch as a user in most all communities now. They also have to rebuild the entire fort with every new community that starts, it's a lot of wasted work time (without any sort of reward, except for the platform). They could very well be a scholar of science, but if they're enrolling a new account, unless they're buddies with the founders, it's very hard to endure the years it takes to build karma (or to achieve rank in whatever silly merit system that a new community has) on top of enduring arguments with imbeciles, fakers, and being called a "noob" by your unwitting colleagues until you earn credit enough to get permabanned for a comment you made on a meme or on some other part of the site because the mods didn't like the format of your post title. There has got to be a better way of doing this... Too much "king of the hill" and "payola" mentality on communities that call themselves "fair and credible" these days, and the time/creator investment loss is huge if you consider time invested to achieve any level of credibility and/or voice on social sites. I have found that my own (personal and business) web sites are usually the best place to post content, my opinions, and maintain user accounts I don't want to lose, and where I can build a far better/more reliable audience than I could ever do on social media and other community sites for over the past 5 years really. I hope that type of individual web site culture and related indexing comes back. An app or web site that enables seamless integration of personally owned web sites into it in a socially integrated manner would be a much better long-term solution/idea for all social communities in my opinion. I'd develop something like that myself, but would need tons more funding and human resources beyond what I'm working with currently (of course).
- sjtindell 5y ago
  Does this happen? On what communities? Where does anyone pay attention to “credibility”? For me all forums are a string of comments. And there’s really only two forums to me, Reddit and Hacker News.
  - BlueTemplar 5y ago
    Neither of these I would call "forums", but rather social media, because, for instance, they dramatically reduce the moderation work and fostering of a community. For instance : no need to have to police the proper use of necroposting (which sometimes is the proper thing to do instead of starting yet another copycat thread that will rehash the exact same points - a forum isn't a chat !), when necroposting has been disallowed in software !
oytis 5y ago
It is really sad though that at a college party, i.e. a party of people pursuing higher education, it's hard to find people interested in discussing intellectual matters. Probably unimaginable 100 years ago (although I wasn't there and can't say for sure.
- ausbah 5y ago
  I'm in college atm, I go to parties precisely to get away from discussing "intellectual matters". it's fine to sometimes have a break from the thing you do all dah
jmatthews 5y ago
To me it revolves around the introvert vs extrovert stuff. With myself as the model, it's not that I don't enjoy speaking to people, it's that I don't enjoy small talk. Give me a heady subject that is interesting and I will jump in with both feet. Rehashing the weather drains me.
- mLuby 5y ago
  Small talk is a protocol for simultaneously discovering the social capabilities and topics of interest of the conversation participants. Just as a computer that doesn't support HTTPS is functional yet un-networkable, so too can a person choose not to support the small talk protocol (or to offer only obsolete versions) thereby forcing the other participants to degrade or refuse the connection. Everyone has things they're deeply interested in. If you want deep conversation you just have to muster curiosity about what they're into (and not fail the social capabilities portion of the protocol). Rarely you'll get really lucky and the person will share one of your niche interests, but it's an unreasonable expectation so don't make it your goal. I'll explicitly highlight "appropriateness" as part of those social capabilities: participants balk at philosophizing in dance clubs or slasher flicks at funerals or topics that exclude or are obviously uninteresting to others in a multiparty conversation (since 3+ participants is common at parties). Practicing the protocol makes it less draining (assuming that's what's actually draining you).
jmkni 5y ago
Exactly. I have things I’m passionate about as well, and I enjoy a good book as much as the next guy, but I go to parties to relax, and talk shite to people.
watwut 5y ago
I will add - many people have intellectual hobbies or read books. Just not exact same intellectual hobbies, because there are hundreds of those. And not the same books. So, that does not constitue common point to talk about.
Aeolun 5y ago
Hmm, I used to have a lot of discussions like that in high school because there was a whole group of like minded people, but after that such discussions just didn’t really happen any more in my circle of friends. I sort of miss it, but I’m also happy with the conversations I have now, so meh?
ErikVandeWater 5y ago
I would say the issue isn't so much "interests" as it is what one finds stimulating. Most people are content to discuss the surface-level, but moving up the intellectual curve, the conversation needs to be deeper in order to be satisfying. Another problem being that most people cannot handle disagreement. If you want to discuss an idea that often leads to disagreement. True intellectuals relish an opposing viewpoint, whereas the vast majority of people wonder why you're being an asshole. The fact that most people cannot handle respectful disagreement in search of a deeper understanding is a problem they have, but a burden placed on others. And of course most people who would call themselves "intellectual" are actually in the latter category.
mattlondon 5y ago
+1 - replace "read a book" or "surrounded by ideas" with "work on a car engine" and "surrounded by oil and grease" and it would be no different. Let's call it "mechanical loneliness". TL;Dr - some people like to read books, some people like to do other things.
travisjungroth 5y ago
The give-away that it's all self inflected melodrama is *he's going to the party*. If you want to go, go. If you don't want to go, don't go. If you want to go for a little bit, do that. And if for some reason you need to lie with an excuse versus saying "I've had a wonderful time, I'm going to head home.", then do that too! *But* do not try to speak from this tortured soul, zero agency, prisoner of parties that go on slightly longer than you'd like perspective on the same website that you present yourself as master of your domain. Sheesh.
- andrepd 5y ago
  Hit the nail on the head. I've no patience for this /r/iamverysmart bullshit X)
scotty79 5y ago
You don't have to be intelectually superior to be bored with people and not getting intelectual stimulation from them. In place of intelectual bookworm you might imagine teenager whose at the same time desperately lonely and bored out of his mind when he people try to talk to him. The thing is some people have trouble finding people close to their niche. The solution is search better and/or widen your niche.
zorrolovsky 5y ago
I understand how opinions like the one OP expressed can be interpreted as arrogant by many people. And you're probably right in saying that many of those Reddit comments reek arrogance. But to bring a different lens to the topic: to me, articles like this are about protesting the way social interactions are designed and blindly followed by many people, not signaling superiority. So I don't read OP as "I'm better than anybody else", but as "There must be a better way of interacting with others and sharing interests. I dislike the current way". The article resonated with me because I think the concept of "parties" is overhyped. I've done a lot in my life and yes, there's a good side to them. But there's also plenty of BS going on: power dynamics, shallow conversations, etc. The problem is, parties are a sort of a sacred dogma to the vast majority of people. Friends and aquitances will often tease/insult you you for not going to them, or for going and not staying late enough. I don't understand why the hype. Why are parties the "ultimate and only" way to have fun and interact socially for some people? There are dozens of other ways to interact with people. For example, I rather have one to one catch-ups with friends because when you get small talk out of the way you can deep-dive into topics. Because of that, I'm an anti-social outcast for many people. "The weird guy that doesn't go to parties". I think that's what the article is on about: societal pressure to individuals so they interact in a certain way and bend to stablished norms, when such norms are not enjoyable for such individuals.
goodpoint 5y ago
> always reeks of unearned superiority "always"? On one side Reddit is known for its armchair experts to the point of being a cliche'. Yet anti-intellectualism is widespread in many environments. The idea that people should only engage in gossip and idle conversations in a college party is a good example.

by ausbah 5y ago

RubyRidgeRandy 5y ago

I agree. There was a TIL thread on Reddit a few years ago about how smarter people are usually more depressed -- low and behold everyone in the comments was lamenting over how cursed they were to carry the burden of their intellect. No one really pointed out that if you were on one of the most popular websites on the planet in a default subreddit, chances were you were pretty average with average intelligence. We fetishize intelligence too much as a society and too many don't understand what it really is and how it can differ. It's nice to imagine a world where we valued empathy as much as intelligence.

geenew 5y ago
not to sound superior but it's "lo and behold" :)
- bryanrasmussen 5y ago
  it's funny, but maybe also auto-correct.
Jensson 5y ago
> if you were on one of the most popular websites on the planet in a default subreddit, chances were you were pretty average with average intelligence. This isn't true. If you have a very popular website and take the most common threads people might read on it, then you will likely have at least a few hundred thousand people viewing it. If 1% of the smartest 2% comments you would have a maybe a hundred comments from people who would qualify for mensa if the viewers were random people, basically flooding the comment section. The reason this works is that people will flock to threads that is about something relating to them. People who do well on IQ tests will flock to threads about intelligence etc.
- kortilla 5y ago
  There is very little overlap between people who care about Mensa/IQ tests and intelligent people.
  - Jensson 5y ago
    People don't have to care about IQ tests to know that they got a good score on one and therefore consider themselves smart. You can see them in almost every thread about IQ tests "I got IQ score 1X0 and I think that IQ is stupid and doesn't matter!". Anyway, being smart without an education is pretty worthless as you say, but there is a lot of such people out there. Being uneducated doesn't mean they aren't intelligent, it just means that they didn't utilize their intelligence in life. I'm not sure why you would try to say that they aren't intelligent just because they lack education. If a study found that intelligent people face more boredom or whatever, then it is almost surely that the study was a correlation between IQ and some questionnaire result, so whatever score someone got on an IQ test is very relevant for the topic.
    - Foobar8568 5y ago
      And if you are educated, you have an even wider gap with your average person. Education starts with school and parenting, when school is averaging to the lowest students and parents are busy with their own work, what is left to your "high IQ kid"? School would just provide a less-than-average knowledge, parents won't guide, and you get an uneducated kid surrounded by "idiots". As a parent, you provide guidance to your kids, high IQ or not, you still get a large gap with their peers. Yesterday, we were drugging kids with TV, today, with tiktok and the likes.

n8cpdx 5y ago

The big clue is that you could swap out books/reading/learning for videogames/watching/playing/learning or TikToks/watching/making, or LEGO/building/designing, or any other hobby and the article and the experience wouldn’t change at all. The distinction between the author and others is not the intellectual pursuit, but the dislike of parties. My bias is to think they’re attending parties with the wrong people, or of bad design (yes, design/engineering is something that social gatherings benefit from). I like a good party plenty, but I’ve slipped away to read books, and I don’t consider myself to be a voracious reader of books.

renarl 5y ago
I’m curious about party design/engineering. Can you tell me a bit more about how to do it? Are there any good books/resources you can point to?
- n8cpdx 5y ago
  I can’t share a whole lot, mainly because I don’t know much myself. In the pre-COVID days, before I stopped going to parties, then blew up my life and moved to another city (thus not having a social network to attend parties with) there were many things to consider when hosting: - who to invite (complicated by melt/flakiness) - involves making predictions about how people will behave and interact with each other - how many to invite - when to start - when to end and how to end - what beverages, snacks, food to include; how such things will be prepared and delivered in sequence - drug and alcohol (also a drug) choices - what music to play - lighting and furniture arrangement; use of space generally - desired outcomes; things to watch for; connections to encourage or discourage - props, toys, games, and other objects (I suppose food and snacks are partially a subset) - compartmentalization and breakaway spaces An example of a party that the author would likely enjoy would be an informal book club gathering with a mixer before or after, or perhaps a showing of a film adaptation with discussion for interested participants after, while less interested people can break off to play board games. Or perhaps board games would be stimulating enough, there are a broad range of kinds, and they can drastically change the feel/experience of an evening. I suppose “engineering” implies a formal discipline. I think that actually is a profession, I just know nothing about it. But design thinking can be applied by anyone to anything, and I do try to be intentional and/or am slightly neurotic about hosting.

steve_adams_86 5y ago

I went through a phase of beginning to think my intellect was isolating me and realized I was just a self absorbed asshole eventually. That was hard to swallow. I think the next hard to swallow realization was that I’m not a very good person. I’m not mean to anyone, but I invest very little in actually doing good. I know I should, I have the resources to do it, but I’m still so self absorbed. I buy things I don’t need knowing the same money could literally save lives. I worry about my own security even though I could find a new job within a month. I used to think I was a pretty nice guy until I realized how terrible I am at changing my behaviour to help other people. In all practicality I’m kind of an asshole. I’ll do better.

lopatin 5y ago
Not going out of your way to help people doesn't make you an asshole. > I buy things I don’t need knowing the same money could literally save lives. I worry about my own security even though I could find a new job within a month. These things are normal, I wouldn't worry too much about it. But you are right that going through life thinking you are some lonely, tortured genius is not healthy and is a recipe for being a true asshole.
- tasty_freeze 5y ago
  Not helping others when you are able doesn't make me an asshole; it makes me self centered. Yes, it is quite normal, but I disagree with your next clause: we should think harder about it and not dismiss it so easily. I've pitched this one before, as it is a short book (pdf, or audiobook) and is one of the most impactful things I've read in a long time. It was Peter Singer's book, The Life You Can Save [1] The book methodically and non-judgmentally addresses many objections and false beliefs people have about charity [2] and effective altruism. In a nutshell: ideally we'd have enough resources that everyone had everything they need, but we don't. There is a strong instinct to care more about people who are similar to you or live near you than for others, but we shouldn't. That is, the suffering of a person you will never meet is just as real as the suffering of someone you are friends with. Because we have limited resources to help others, the resources we do have should be focused on those who are worst off. [1] https://www.thelifeyoucansave.org/peter-singer/ https://www.thelifeyoucansave.org/peter-singer/ [2] For instance, many people moan about how much of the federal budget is spent/wasted on foreign aid. When asked to guess how much of the budget is spent, people (in the US) commonly guess 10-20%. When asked what they thing would be more appropriate, they commonly say 5-10%. The reality is it is well under 1%.

onlyrealcuzzo 5y ago

I'm probably going to get downvoted for being elitist, but here goes... On the flip side, I have found a startling amount of people genuinely don't have many passions / interests. Skills and talents, sure. But passions - no. Or I guess if eating foods like cereal and McDoland's counts as a food passion, or watching TV, or working a job you don't actually enjoy - if these count as passions - then I suppose everyone does have interests. I'm just not inclined to think people are really that passionate about these things - and instead, it's just what they do. Sure - anybody who spends 10 hours a day laying bricks - they're obviously infinitely more skilled in that and related things than someone who doesn't. But a lot of people simply exchange their time for money, and don't particularly love what they do. Most of us HN-ers do, and we forget how rare that is. I think some of us on here forget how close we have it to a life of leisure compared to the average person (ESPECIALLY globally). I know a lot of people that pretty much have no time for anything besides work and family. And I hope that all people like this LOVE at least their work or their family. But in reality, I know A LOT of people trapped in a life where they genuinely dislike both. And that's pretty much their whole life.

ip26 5y ago
I’ve found if you inquire with genuine interest, many metaphorical brick layers have a lot to say about laying bricks, and can get quite impassioned about it. There’s often a lot more depth there than you see at first. (Presumably, most people aren’t genuinely interested enough, so the brick layer doesn’t usually get into it)
medimikka 5y ago
> On the flip side, I have found a startling amount of people genuinely don't really have many passions / interests. That'd describe Perell well. He doesn't have many passions/interest. He's bowing out of one interest to flee back into his singular comfort zone of unchallenged isolation, where no one "tests" his chops and he can fly on the wings of his self perception to whatever height he desires. He shuns every passion/interest that does not align with his narrow view of which passions and interests make a person "intellectual". He's the kind of guy who will use his superior training as "guy who writes things on the Internet" to start arguing medicine with me, and then leave the party because few people share his interests and he just can't contribute to theirs. Because we're not as intellectual than him. ... in his narrowly defined niche of what makes a person intellectual. Hint: being able to cite Plato does not make you in any way, shape, or form, more "intellectual" than the guy at the end of the bar who knows every Man U soccer game score, who scored, against whom, in which game, at what game time, using which strategy. Having consumed a 500 page book does not make you more intellectual than having consumed 500 episodes of Coronation Street. Consumption, in general, is a low hanging fruit, intellectually. Your love for Doctor Who doesn't make you smarter than someone's fanning over Rihanna. Intellectuals are rarely lonely. Because true intellectuals see value in information, no matter the sender or matter. Restrictive topic selection is pretty much the definition of anti-intellectualism, in my opinion.

winternett 5y ago

The funny part is that everyone needs to start from scratch as a user in most all communities now. They also have to rebuild the entire fort with every new community that starts, it's a lot of wasted work time (without any sort of reward, except for the platform). They could very well be a scholar of science, but if they're enrolling a new account, unless they're buddies with the founders, it's very hard to endure the years it takes to build karma (or to achieve rank in whatever silly merit system that a new community has) on top of enduring arguments with imbeciles, fakers, and being called a "noob" by your unwitting colleagues until you earn credit enough to get permabanned for a comment you made on a meme or on some other part of the site because the mods didn't like the format of your post title. There has got to be a better way of doing this... Too much "king of the hill" and "payola" mentality on communities that call themselves "fair and credible" these days, and the time/creator investment loss is huge if you consider time invested to achieve any level of credibility and/or voice on social sites. I have found that my own (personal and business) web sites are usually the best place to post content, my opinions, and maintain user accounts I don't want to lose, and where I can build a far better/more reliable audience than I could ever do on social media and other community sites for over the past 5 years really. I hope that type of individual web site culture and related indexing comes back. An app or web site that enables seamless integration of personally owned web sites into it in a socially integrated manner would be a much better long-term solution/idea for all social communities in my opinion. I'd develop something like that myself, but would need tons more funding and human resources beyond what I'm working with currently (of course).

sjtindell 5y ago
Does this happen? On what communities? Where does anyone pay attention to “credibility”? For me all forums are a string of comments. And there’s really only two forums to me, Reddit and Hacker News.
- BlueTemplar 5y ago
  Neither of these I would call "forums", but rather social media, because, for instance, they dramatically reduce the moderation work and fostering of a community. For instance : no need to have to police the proper use of necroposting (which sometimes is the proper thing to do instead of starting yet another copycat thread that will rehash the exact same points - a forum isn't a chat !), when necroposting has been disallowed in software !

oytis 5y ago

It is really sad though that at a college party, i.e. a party of people pursuing higher education, it's hard to find people interested in discussing intellectual matters. Probably unimaginable 100 years ago (although I wasn't there and can't say for sure.

ausbah 5y ago
I'm in college atm, I go to parties precisely to get away from discussing "intellectual matters". it's fine to sometimes have a break from the thing you do all dah

jmatthews 5y ago

To me it revolves around the introvert vs extrovert stuff. With myself as the model, it's not that I don't enjoy speaking to people, it's that I don't enjoy small talk. Give me a heady subject that is interesting and I will jump in with both feet. Rehashing the weather drains me.

mLuby 5y ago
Small talk is a protocol for simultaneously discovering the social capabilities and topics of interest of the conversation participants. Just as a computer that doesn't support HTTPS is functional yet un-networkable, so too can a person choose not to support the small talk protocol (or to offer only obsolete versions) thereby forcing the other participants to degrade or refuse the connection. Everyone has things they're deeply interested in. If you want deep conversation you just have to muster curiosity about what they're into (and not fail the social capabilities portion of the protocol). Rarely you'll get really lucky and the person will share one of your niche interests, but it's an unreasonable expectation so don't make it your goal. I'll explicitly highlight "appropriateness" as part of those social capabilities: participants balk at philosophizing in dance clubs or slasher flicks at funerals or topics that exclude or are obviously uninteresting to others in a multiparty conversation (since 3+ participants is common at parties). Practicing the protocol makes it less draining (assuming that's what's actually draining you).

jmkni 5y ago

Exactly. I have things I’m passionate about as well, and I enjoy a good book as much as the next guy, but I go to parties to relax, and talk shite to people.

watwut 5y ago

I will add - many people have intellectual hobbies or read books. Just not exact same intellectual hobbies, because there are hundreds of those. And not the same books. So, that does not constitue common point to talk about.

Aeolun 5y ago

Hmm, I used to have a lot of discussions like that in high school because there was a whole group of like minded people, but after that such discussions just didn’t really happen any more in my circle of friends. I sort of miss it, but I’m also happy with the conversations I have now, so meh?

ErikVandeWater 5y ago

I would say the issue isn't so much "interests" as it is what one finds stimulating. Most people are content to discuss the surface-level, but moving up the intellectual curve, the conversation needs to be deeper in order to be satisfying. Another problem being that most people cannot handle disagreement. If you want to discuss an idea that often leads to disagreement. True intellectuals relish an opposing viewpoint, whereas the vast majority of people wonder why you're being an asshole. The fact that most people cannot handle respectful disagreement in search of a deeper understanding is a problem they have, but a burden placed on others. And of course most people who would call themselves "intellectual" are actually in the latter category.

mattlondon 5y ago

+1 - replace "read a book" or "surrounded by ideas" with "work on a car engine" and "surrounded by oil and grease" and it would be no different. Let's call it "mechanical loneliness". TL;Dr - some people like to read books, some people like to do other things.

travisjungroth 5y ago

The give-away that it's all self inflected melodrama is *he's going to the party*. If you want to go, go. If you don't want to go, don't go. If you want to go for a little bit, do that. And if for some reason you need to lie with an excuse versus saying "I've had a wonderful time, I'm going to head home.", then do that too! *But* do not try to speak from this tortured soul, zero agency, prisoner of parties that go on slightly longer than you'd like perspective on the same website that you present yourself as master of your domain. Sheesh.

andrepd 5y ago
Hit the nail on the head. I've no patience for this /r/iamverysmart bullshit X)

scotty79 5y ago

You don't have to be intelectually superior to be bored with people and not getting intelectual stimulation from them. In place of intelectual bookworm you might imagine teenager whose at the same time desperately lonely and bored out of his mind when he people try to talk to him. The thing is some people have trouble finding people close to their niche. The solution is search better and/or widen your niche.

zorrolovsky 5y ago

I understand how opinions like the one OP expressed can be interpreted as arrogant by many people. And you're probably right in saying that many of those Reddit comments reek arrogance. But to bring a different lens to the topic: to me, articles like this are about protesting the way social interactions are designed and blindly followed by many people, not signaling superiority. So I don't read OP as "I'm better than anybody else", but as "There must be a better way of interacting with others and sharing interests. I dislike the current way". The article resonated with me because I think the concept of "parties" is overhyped. I've done a lot in my life and yes, there's a good side to them. But there's also plenty of BS going on: power dynamics, shallow conversations, etc. The problem is, parties are a sort of a sacred dogma to the vast majority of people. Friends and aquitances will often tease/insult you you for not going to them, or for going and not staying late enough. I don't understand why the hype. Why are parties the "ultimate and only" way to have fun and interact socially for some people? There are dozens of other ways to interact with people. For example, I rather have one to one catch-ups with friends because when you get small talk out of the way you can deep-dive into topics. Because of that, I'm an anti-social outcast for many people. "The weird guy that doesn't go to parties". I think that's what the article is on about: societal pressure to individuals so they interact in a certain way and bend to stablished norms, when such norms are not enjoyable for such individuals.

goodpoint 5y ago

> always reeks of unearned superiority "always"? On one side Reddit is known for its armchair experts to the point of being a cliche'. Yet anti-intellectualism is widespread in many environments. The idea that people should only engage in gossip and idle conversations in a college party is a good example.