5 ms·

A piece of functionality that's missing/broken by design in Discord is data export. Discord client can show me all the conversations I've taken part in. When I

by robryk 5y ago

A piece of functionality that's missing/broken by design in Discord is data export. Discord client can show me all the conversations I've taken part in. When I request a copy of all data Discord "has on me" I get only the messages I've sent (which is borderline useless), and I am only allowed to do that once a month, with a days-long waiting period.

YXNjaGVyZWdlbgo 5y ago
It's because you don't have any right to other peoples data under GDPR. That's a feature to help stop doxxing.
- nix23 5y ago
  Yeah thanks...now i have to delete all my received emails.
  - YXNjaGVyZWdlbgo 5y ago
    Why would you? That's data you own.
    - nix23 5y ago
      So mail from others are mine but not chats?
      - YXNjaGVyZWdlbgo 5y ago
        Not on Discord and we are still debating about a feature that was never implemented and Ops misunderstanding of GDPR and it's compliance.
        nix23 5y ago
        >Not on Discord Ah ok that makes sense....not
- kortilla 5y ago
  Cool, that’s fucking useless for a chat client though. If someone sends me a message in a chat app, I should be able to get it. Discord isn’t ephemeral. Making a shitty UI that pretends it is doesn’t change that.
- posnet 5y ago
  If you send a message to a public chat room; You should expect that the contexts of the message and its attachment to your username are permanent and accessible to anyone. If you are not comfortable with that, then don't send the message in the first place.
  - floatingatoll 5y ago
    (Or, use Discord to send the message.)
    - robryk 5y ago
      The message is still accessible to anyone using the blessed client, and is available in perpetuity to anyone willing to violate TOS by using a reverse-engineered client.
      - YXNjaGVyZWdlbgo 5y ago
        It's only available in public chat rooms private messages are not recoverable no matter the client.
        robryk 5y ago
        I can run a reverse-engineered client that just logs all the messages I ever receive, if I don't care about TOS.
        floatingatoll 5y ago
        Chances are you won’t, though, because for virtually all chat rooms, why bother? And so in the vast majority of cases, Discord’s approach works well at achieving its outcome. Either no one will hoard data in violation of their legal contract with Discord, or any published/searchable logs will receive takedowns, and that’s just enough to have the intended effect. In the context of FOSS project chat rooms that we’re discussing here, it is quite ironic that many FOSS community members will, predictably and with tacit or explicit support from their peers, openly break their legal contract with Discord in order to hoard chat logs for private or public use — while in the same breath demanding use of, and compliance with, legal contracts such as the GPL. Human beings certainly do excel at developing blind spots for cognitive dissonance when it’s to their benefit to do so.
- robryk 5y ago
  If I had no right to see messages others send to me, then sending messages would be pointless -- the recipient would not have the right to read them. Every other chat service I have requested data export from gave me all the messages in conversations I was a part of (even if they were mangled somehow -- e.g. missing attachments in FB Messenger). I think this is an example of Discord applying motivated reasoning for the company's benefit (E: at the expense of their users).
  - YXNjaGVyZWdlbgo 5y ago
    That's something completely different. GDPR takeouts are only referring to YOUR data. The data entered from other people is not yours. It's not that hard to comprehend if you think about the legal aspect. This is a compliance issue more than anything else if they could they wouldn't give you anything.
    - rovr138 5y ago
      The original comment was talking about lacking data exports tools/options. The workaround is using GDPR but even that is lacking.
      - YXNjaGVyZWdlbgo 5y ago
        It's not a workaround because it's not working. > When I request a copy of all data Discord "has on me" I get only the messages I've sent (which is borderline useless), and I am only allowed to do that once a month, with a days-long waiting period. What he is trying to paint as a broken feature is just compliance to GDPR and with that you only get your data.
        rovr138 5y ago
        >A piece of functionality that's missing/broken by design in Discord is data export. Discord client can show me all the conversations I've taken part in. When I request a copy of all data Discord "has on me" I get only the messages I've sent (which is borderline useless), and I am only allowed to do that once a month, with a days-long waiting period. Full comment because context is important. The first part of the comment is explaining that there's missing/broken functionality. They're trying to export data and that's missing. What Discord has, which could count be used as that feature, is requesting a copy of all your data and THAT is broken for the use case because it's missing the messages of others and, even then, it's once a month and there's days-long waits.
- throw10920 5y ago
  > It's because you don't have any right to other peoples data under GDPR. Citation needed that messages intentionally sent to you are "other people's data" and regulated under the GDPR. They're certainly not personal information such as a real name or phone number. > That's a feature to help stop doxxing. This has nothing to do with doxxing. Doxxing is easily prevented by merely changing the takeout so that there's plausible deniability - e.g. if person A and B have a conversation and A uses the takeout feature, person B's username would be redacted or minimized such that they could reasonably claim that that person in the transcript could have been anyone.
- gnufx 5y ago
  If others' messages to you are their personal data, and you "process" them -- which is rather broadly defined -- as which of the entities defined as processing data are you subject to the Regulation?
  - YXNjaGVyZWdlbgo 5y ago
    It depends on the ToS of the service you are using at discord the "Your Content" part is pretty specific.
    - gnufx 5y ago
      So, which is it, and exactly how -- noting that those terms can change without notice? "the Company is not responsible for any material that you upload, post, or otherwise make available" seems to be trying to disclaim any GDPR responsibility for these personal data. (I'm not just going to accept that lawyers are right in the light of quite explicit violations of regulations I see, and legal actions.) "The terms of service raise very serious concerns." -- TOS;DR extension
makeworld 5y ago
https://github.com/Tyrrrz/DiscordChatExporter https://github.com/Tyrrrz/DiscordChatExporter

by robryk 5y ago

YXNjaGVyZWdlbgo 5y ago

It's because you don't have any right to other peoples data under GDPR. That's a feature to help stop doxxing.

nix23 5y ago
Yeah thanks...now i have to delete all my received emails.
- YXNjaGVyZWdlbgo 5y ago
  Why would you? That's data you own.
  - nix23 5y ago
    So mail from others are mine but not chats?
    - YXNjaGVyZWdlbgo 5y ago
      Not on Discord and we are still debating about a feature that was never implemented and Ops misunderstanding of GDPR and it's compliance.
      - nix23 5y ago
        >Not on Discord Ah ok that makes sense....not
kortilla 5y ago
Cool, that’s fucking useless for a chat client though. If someone sends me a message in a chat app, I should be able to get it. Discord isn’t ephemeral. Making a shitty UI that pretends it is doesn’t change that.
posnet 5y ago
If you send a message to a public chat room; You should expect that the contexts of the message and its attachment to your username are permanent and accessible to anyone. If you are not comfortable with that, then don't send the message in the first place.
- floatingatoll 5y ago
  (Or, use Discord to send the message.)
  - robryk 5y ago
    The message is still accessible to anyone using the blessed client, and is available in perpetuity to anyone willing to violate TOS by using a reverse-engineered client.
    - YXNjaGVyZWdlbgo 5y ago
      It's only available in public chat rooms private messages are not recoverable no matter the client.
      - robryk 5y ago
        I can run a reverse-engineered client that just logs all the messages I ever receive, if I don't care about TOS.
        floatingatoll 5y ago
        Chances are you won’t, though, because for virtually all chat rooms, why bother? And so in the vast majority of cases, Discord’s approach works well at achieving its outcome. Either no one will hoard data in violation of their legal contract with Discord, or any published/searchable logs will receive takedowns, and that’s just enough to have the intended effect. In the context of FOSS project chat rooms that we’re discussing here, it is quite ironic that many FOSS community members will, predictably and with tacit or explicit support from their peers, openly break their legal contract with Discord in order to hoard chat logs for private or public use — while in the same breath demanding use of, and compliance with, legal contracts such as the GPL. Human beings certainly do excel at developing blind spots for cognitive dissonance when it’s to their benefit to do so.
robryk 5y ago
If I had no right to see messages others send to me, then sending messages would be pointless -- the recipient would not have the right to read them. Every other chat service I have requested data export from gave me all the messages in conversations I was a part of (even if they were mangled somehow -- e.g. missing attachments in FB Messenger). I think this is an example of Discord applying motivated reasoning for the company's benefit (E: at the expense of their users).
- YXNjaGVyZWdlbgo 5y ago
  That's something completely different. GDPR takeouts are only referring to YOUR data. The data entered from other people is not yours. It's not that hard to comprehend if you think about the legal aspect. This is a compliance issue more than anything else if they could they wouldn't give you anything.
  - rovr138 5y ago
    The original comment was talking about lacking data exports tools/options. The workaround is using GDPR but even that is lacking.
    - YXNjaGVyZWdlbgo 5y ago
      It's not a workaround because it's not working. > When I request a copy of all data Discord "has on me" I get only the messages I've sent (which is borderline useless), and I am only allowed to do that once a month, with a days-long waiting period. What he is trying to paint as a broken feature is just compliance to GDPR and with that you only get your data.
      - rovr138 5y ago
        >A piece of functionality that's missing/broken by design in Discord is data export. Discord client can show me all the conversations I've taken part in. When I request a copy of all data Discord "has on me" I get only the messages I've sent (which is borderline useless), and I am only allowed to do that once a month, with a days-long waiting period. Full comment because context is important. The first part of the comment is explaining that there's missing/broken functionality. They're trying to export data and that's missing. What Discord has, which could count be used as that feature, is requesting a copy of all your data and THAT is broken for the use case because it's missing the messages of others and, even then, it's once a month and there's days-long waits.
throw10920 5y ago
> It's because you don't have any right to other peoples data under GDPR. Citation needed that messages intentionally sent to you are "other people's data" and regulated under the GDPR. They're certainly not personal information such as a real name or phone number. > That's a feature to help stop doxxing. This has nothing to do with doxxing. Doxxing is easily prevented by merely changing the takeout so that there's plausible deniability - e.g. if person A and B have a conversation and A uses the takeout feature, person B's username would be redacted or minimized such that they could reasonably claim that that person in the transcript could have been anyone.
gnufx 5y ago
If others' messages to you are their personal data, and you "process" them -- which is rather broadly defined -- as which of the entities defined as processing data are you subject to the Regulation?
- YXNjaGVyZWdlbgo 5y ago
  It depends on the ToS of the service you are using at discord the "Your Content" part is pretty specific.
  - gnufx 5y ago
    So, which is it, and exactly how -- noting that those terms can change without notice? "the Company is not responsible for any material that you upload, post, or otherwise make available" seems to be trying to disclaim any GDPR responsibility for these personal data. (I'm not just going to accept that lawyers are right in the light of quite explicit violations of regulations I see, and legal actions.) "The terms of service raise very serious concerns." -- TOS;DR extension

makeworld 5y ago

https://github.com/Tyrrrz/DiscordChatExporter https://github.com/Tyrrrz/DiscordChatExporter