7 ms·

There was a similar service a few years ago where car owners who had rented out their cars wound up with disastrous personal liability for accidents complete un

There was a similar service a few years ago where car owners who had rented out their cars wound up with disastrous personal liability for accidents complete unknowns had caused while driving their cars. It looks as though Turo only offers $750K of third-party insurance. This looks like a really risky proposition for anyone thinking of renting their car through this service.

Tempest1981 5y ago
Why would the car owner (vs. the driver) ever be on the hook for the amount over $750K? Some legal catch I don't understand, I'm sure.
- scheme271 5y ago
  Liability for medical costs or other costs combined with renting out an expensive supercar? People are putting ferraris, lamborghinis, and similar cars on Turo and a write off on one of those cars can easily hit 300-400k.
  - josephcsible 5y ago
    I don't think that post was really about the amount of liability. I think it was questioning why the owner would ever be liable for any of it, rather than the driver being liable for all of it.
- ip26 5y ago
  Perhaps the driver turns out to be uninsured? Generally the owner of a vehicle is held ultimately responsible for anyone they permit to drive the vehicle.
  - josephcsible 5y ago
    > Generally the owner of a vehicle is held ultimately responsible for anyone they permit to drive the vehicle. But why? If I lend my neighbor my chainsaw, and he's unbeknownst to me a serial killer who murders someone with it, should I be liable for that too?
    - samus 5y ago
      The good faith assumption that the other party is trustworthy (within reason) does not exist on the street. This is why driving is regulated, and most places in the world demand driving licenses, the car to be insured and the owner to be ultimately liable for the car. Chainsaws are rarely regulated, not registered and the even of serial murderers using it is considered rare. Do note however, that some legislations might have the owner on the hook for negligence if they didn't exert reasonable efforts to hide away dangerous machines and substances.
      - deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
- AlexCoventry 5y ago
  Search for "If you lend your car to an incompetent, reckless, or unfit driver" https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/car-accidents-negligence-when-you-29731.html https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/car-accidents-neglig...
  - Tempest1981 5y ago
    Interesting, thanks. Some of these seem fine, like not lending your car to someone you know is drunk, wreckless, underage, or obviously unfit to drive. But this one is worrisome -- how would you know? > someone who suffers from an illness that affects his or her driving — for example, a narcoleptic person prone to falling asleep at the wheel Maybe the Turo driver screening asks about these conditions.
1123581321 5y ago
$750k of coverage is crazy good. Most auto insurance isn't that good (e.g. my insurance is good and covers up to $300k per incident, $100k per person.) If you're not making national news, you're not accumulating $750k of liability. I'd be surprised if you had that coverage for your day-to-day driving without buying a supplemental umbrella policy. Turo actually charges a hefty premium for the $750k policy: https://support.turo.com/hc/en-us/articles/203991150-Summary-and-cost-of-protection-plans-US-guests https://support.turo.com/hc/en-us/articles/203991150-Summary... Most Turo renters are going to pay for one of the cheaper plans, which are 25-40% the cost of the $750k policy and only cover the state minimums. You can read the state minimums here to see how much smaller they are than $750k. https://www.nerdwallet.com/article/insurance/minimum-car-insurance-requirements https://www.nerdwallet.com/article/insurance/minimum-car-ins...
- AlexCoventry 5y ago
  > I'd be surprised if you had that coverage for your day-to-day driving I know I'm a relatively cautious and responsible driver, though, so I can make a reasonable assessment that that's an acceptable risk for me. People renting their cars out through this service don't know anything about who's going to drive their cars.
  - 1123581321 5y ago
    They know some as the underwriting is performed by Turo’s insurance partner. The car owner also holds their own commercial insurance policy, which examines Turo’s driver-side policy as part of underwriting. Also, you’re still misunderstanding auto claim sizes; to choose $100/300 isn’t to make an acceptable risk judgment. It’s to be covered in effectively every situation even if you were a reckless driver. As a reckless driver, your frequency of claims would be higher, so your premium will be higher, but your claim sizes will still fit in a fairly narrow band. $750k with zero deductible is a shiny number designed to sell their very expensive premium policy. (To be clear, I don’t mind that they offer it.)

Tempest1981 5y ago

Why would the car owner (vs. the driver) ever be on the hook for the amount over $750K? Some legal catch I don't understand, I'm sure.

scheme271 5y ago
Liability for medical costs or other costs combined with renting out an expensive supercar? People are putting ferraris, lamborghinis, and similar cars on Turo and a write off on one of those cars can easily hit 300-400k.
- josephcsible 5y ago
  I don't think that post was really about the amount of liability. I think it was questioning why the owner would ever be liable for any of it, rather than the driver being liable for all of it.
ip26 5y ago
Perhaps the driver turns out to be uninsured? Generally the owner of a vehicle is held ultimately responsible for anyone they permit to drive the vehicle.
- josephcsible 5y ago
  > Generally the owner of a vehicle is held ultimately responsible for anyone they permit to drive the vehicle. But why? If I lend my neighbor my chainsaw, and he's unbeknownst to me a serial killer who murders someone with it, should I be liable for that too?
  - samus 5y ago
    The good faith assumption that the other party is trustworthy (within reason) does not exist on the street. This is why driving is regulated, and most places in the world demand driving licenses, the car to be insured and the owner to be ultimately liable for the car. Chainsaws are rarely regulated, not registered and the even of serial murderers using it is considered rare. Do note however, that some legislations might have the owner on the hook for negligence if they didn't exert reasonable efforts to hide away dangerous machines and substances.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
AlexCoventry 5y ago
Search for "If you lend your car to an incompetent, reckless, or unfit driver" https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/car-accidents-negligence-when-you-29731.html https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/car-accidents-neglig...
- Tempest1981 5y ago
  Interesting, thanks. Some of these seem fine, like not lending your car to someone you know is drunk, wreckless, underage, or obviously unfit to drive. But this one is worrisome -- how would you know? > someone who suffers from an illness that affects his or her driving — for example, a narcoleptic person prone to falling asleep at the wheel Maybe the Turo driver screening asks about these conditions.

1123581321 5y ago

$750k of coverage is crazy good. Most auto insurance isn't that good (e.g. my insurance is good and covers up to $300k per incident, $100k per person.) If you're not making national news, you're not accumulating $750k of liability. I'd be surprised if you had that coverage for your day-to-day driving without buying a supplemental umbrella policy. Turo actually charges a hefty premium for the $750k policy: https://support.turo.com/hc/en-us/articles/203991150-Summary-and-cost-of-protection-plans-US-guests https://support.turo.com/hc/en-us/articles/203991150-Summary... Most Turo renters are going to pay for one of the cheaper plans, which are 25-40% the cost of the $750k policy and only cover the state minimums. You can read the state minimums here to see how much smaller they are than $750k. https://www.nerdwallet.com/article/insurance/minimum-car-insurance-requirements https://www.nerdwallet.com/article/insurance/minimum-car-ins...

AlexCoventry 5y ago
> I'd be surprised if you had that coverage for your day-to-day driving I know I'm a relatively cautious and responsible driver, though, so I can make a reasonable assessment that that's an acceptable risk for me. People renting their cars out through this service don't know anything about who's going to drive their cars.
- 1123581321 5y ago
  They know some as the underwriting is performed by Turo’s insurance partner. The car owner also holds their own commercial insurance policy, which examines Turo’s driver-side policy as part of underwriting. Also, you’re still misunderstanding auto claim sizes; to choose $100/300 isn’t to make an acceptable risk judgment. It’s to be covered in effectively every situation even if you were a reckless driver. As a reckless driver, your frequency of claims would be higher, so your premium will be higher, but your claim sizes will still fit in a fairly narrow band. $750k with zero deductible is a shiny number designed to sell their very expensive premium policy. (To be clear, I don’t mind that they offer it.)