5 ms·

We shouldnt forget that something like 80% of them were already old people with a variety of health issues.

by akomtu 5y ago

throwntoday 5y ago
And all of the young "healthy" people who died had comorbidities like obesity and diabetws or some congenital issues unknown to them.
- hsbauauvhabzb 5y ago
  Had corona not of existed, would they still be dead?
- zuminator 5y ago
  This is just a no true Scotsman argument in disguise. To wit, anyone who is young and healthy won't die from corona, therefore anyone young who died from it wasn't "really" healthy and had "unknown" issues. You can make that argument with any illness, and people do. E.g., you can't get cancer if you eat healthy, oh, you got cancer? You must not have been eating the right diet for your body type.
  - oneoff786 5y ago
    “All” is an exaggeration but it’s accurate to say that obesity was one of the biggest drivers of the mortality rate. Obese people are not healthy. Subjective boundaries aren’t an excuse to cover your ears and ignore strong correlations.
  - throwntoday 5y ago
    It's not a fallacy it's a very simple statement. Cancer was probably the worst example for your case as its something that can develop in-spite of being healthy and as far as we know it is not caused by a virus. Most people who contracted covid, 99.9% of them, are fine. Of those that have died, 100% seem to have had some underlying issue. You're acting as though it's unreasonable to account for comorbidities when determining the cause of death.
- onecommentman 5y ago
  The most vulnerable “comorbidity” subpopulation rarely mentioned in popular social media are the immunocompromised https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/vaccines/blog/immunocompromised-people-are-vulnerable-to-covid-19-we-owe-them-some-answers https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/vaccines/blog/immunocompromised-... The title itself suggests the immunocompromised are acknowledged as an overlooked group. The CDC has some discussion at https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/hcp/duration-isolation.html https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/hcp/duration-isola... From the link above, the immunocompromised are a reservoir for the virus for a longer time, since it takes longer for the body to clear the virus. So certainly worth the extra attention, from an epidemiological standpoint if nothing else. My sense is the immunocompromised would know the COVID response drill from all the other infectious agents they have to deal with so, maybe, they are more careful anyway, but… The puzzling thing is (from the Johns Hopkins link) there are 15M immunocompromised in the US. Which does beg the question: if COVID is truly a superbug, two years on, why aren’t they (the immunocompromised) dead yet? A death rate of only 6%, over two years, for this highly vulnerable immunocompromised population would explain all the US deaths from COVID. How can COVID be simultaneously (1) the Plague of the Century and, (2) two years on, also leave 94% to 99+% of the most vulnerable alive (depending on your assumption on the percentage of symptomatic/hospitalized/fatal COVID cases who are/were immunocompromised)? Just another COVID “mystery”? Seems a bit odd.
  - TylerE 5y ago
    Maybe because those of us in that subpopulation aren't treating it by sticking our heads in the sand, and actually doing the stuff that works - not going out, wearing a (good) mask when we must, getting our shots...
  - oneoff786 5y ago
    Immunocompromised is not a binary term. Allergies to gluten are an autoimmune disorder. Arthritis can be an autoimmune disorder. A lot of these are minor.
    - dnautics 5y ago
      Autoimmune is not immunocompromised unless you're taking immunosuppressants to mitigate the disease.
- dTal 5y ago
  One third of Americans are clinically obese alone. Half are over 40. What percentage of people actually fit your "young and fully healthy" criteria? Are we meant to be comforted by this? Seriously - what's the subtext here?
HPsquared 5y ago
It'd be interesting to look at "years lost" or something similar ("quality-adjusted life years").
Retric 5y ago
“Old people” where much better about vaccination and isolation so the 80:20 age dropped over time. Currently well over 1/4 of total death are under 65 which is significantly different than when COVID first showed up. When you look at current data it’s even more shocking the under 55 population is making up a rapidly increasing share of total deaths presumably due to relative vaccination rates. For example the first omnicron death in the US was in their 50’s that had already had COVID but never got vaccinated. By many metrics that’s old but their still well below average life expectancy.

We shouldnt forget that something like 80% of them were already old people with a variety of health issues.

by akomtu 5y ago

We shouldnt forget that something like 80% of them were already old people with a variety of health issues.

And all of the young "healthy" people who died had comorbidities like obesity and diabetws or some congenital issues unknown to them.

hsbauauvhabzb 5y ago
Had corona not of existed, would they still be dead?
zuminator 5y ago
This is just a no true Scotsman argument in disguise. To wit, anyone who is young and healthy won't die from corona, therefore anyone young who died from it wasn't "really" healthy and had "unknown" issues. You can make that argument with any illness, and people do. E.g., you can't get cancer if you eat healthy, oh, you got cancer? You must not have been eating the right diet for your body type.
- oneoff786 5y ago
  “All” is an exaggeration but it’s accurate to say that obesity was one of the biggest drivers of the mortality rate. Obese people are not healthy. Subjective boundaries aren’t an excuse to cover your ears and ignore strong correlations.
- throwntoday 5y ago
  It's not a fallacy it's a very simple statement. Cancer was probably the worst example for your case as its something that can develop in-spite of being healthy and as far as we know it is not caused by a virus. Most people who contracted covid, 99.9% of them, are fine. Of those that have died, 100% seem to have had some underlying issue. You're acting as though it's unreasonable to account for comorbidities when determining the cause of death.
onecommentman 5y ago
The most vulnerable “comorbidity” subpopulation rarely mentioned in popular social media are the immunocompromised https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/vaccines/blog/immunocompromised-people-are-vulnerable-to-covid-19-we-owe-them-some-answers https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/vaccines/blog/immunocompromised-... The title itself suggests the immunocompromised are acknowledged as an overlooked group. The CDC has some discussion at https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/hcp/duration-isolation.html https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/hcp/duration-isola... From the link above, the immunocompromised are a reservoir for the virus for a longer time, since it takes longer for the body to clear the virus. So certainly worth the extra attention, from an epidemiological standpoint if nothing else. My sense is the immunocompromised would know the COVID response drill from all the other infectious agents they have to deal with so, maybe, they are more careful anyway, but… The puzzling thing is (from the Johns Hopkins link) there are 15M immunocompromised in the US. Which does beg the question: if COVID is truly a superbug, two years on, why aren’t they (the immunocompromised) dead yet? A death rate of only 6%, over two years, for this highly vulnerable immunocompromised population would explain all the US deaths from COVID. How can COVID be simultaneously (1) the Plague of the Century and, (2) two years on, also leave 94% to 99+% of the most vulnerable alive (depending on your assumption on the percentage of symptomatic/hospitalized/fatal COVID cases who are/were immunocompromised)? Just another COVID “mystery”? Seems a bit odd.
- TylerE 5y ago
  Maybe because those of us in that subpopulation aren't treating it by sticking our heads in the sand, and actually doing the stuff that works - not going out, wearing a (good) mask when we must, getting our shots...
- oneoff786 5y ago
  Immunocompromised is not a binary term. Allergies to gluten are an autoimmune disorder. Arthritis can be an autoimmune disorder. A lot of these are minor.
  - dnautics 5y ago
    Autoimmune is not immunocompromised unless you're taking immunosuppressants to mitigate the disease.
dTal 5y ago
One third of Americans are clinically obese alone. Half are over 40. What percentage of people actually fit your "young and fully healthy" criteria? Are we meant to be comforted by this? Seriously - what's the subtext here?

HPsquared 5y ago

It'd be interesting to look at "years lost" or something similar ("quality-adjusted life years").

Retric 5y ago

“Old people” where much better about vaccination and isolation so the 80:20 age dropped over time. Currently well over 1/4 of total death are under 65 which is significantly different than when COVID first showed up. When you look at current data it’s even more shocking the under 55 population is making up a rapidly increasing share of total deaths presumably due to relative vaccination rates. For example the first omnicron death in the US was in their 50’s that had already had COVID but never got vaccinated. By many metrics that’s old but their still well below average life expectancy.